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Microchipping - Nsw - Requirements When Selling/rehoming A Dog Just wanted to ensure people are aware

#1 User is offline   petsearch 

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 02:31 PM

Hi All,
Recently we have been speaking to a number of breeders (not only of dogs), but we have been coming across the same problem over and over, so I just wanted to highlight to everyone some problems we have been finding.

Scenario 1:
An animal arrives in the pound - it is still registered in the breeders name - breeder gets a phone call to say come and collect the animal. The breeder bred the animal 7 years ago, they can't find the paperwork of who they sold the animal to. Animal has to wait in the hope the owner will come and get it.

Scenario 2:
An animal arrives in the pound - it is not registered on any microchip registry (i.e the microchip number doesn't exist on the registry). - Pound can try (if they have time) to track back the microchip to find out who the microchip was sold to eg a vet or an implanter, and see if the vet can find who it was then implanted in. But this is often a lost cause as it can lead back to "puppy 1" or "puppy 2" of such and such litter. So in best hope we can track it to the breeder, but most of the time the vet doesn't know who the animal is.

Both of these scenarios happen when the breeder/seller of the animal gives the yellow copy of the microchip paperwork to the new owner. (It can also happen with paperwork going missing at council or in the mail) It is the responsibility of the seller of animal to send in the yellow copy of the change of ownership form to any council office, but we have heard alot that the seller of the dog is giving the new owner the yellow copy and the pink copy to the new owner and telling them to send it into council. This is illegal and the seller can get fined for that.

Some sellers have said the reason they do it is so the new owner can get the animal desexed before paying life time registration as there is a big price difference, but the fact is that they have up to 6 months of age to pay the life time registration, and you can send the paperwork at time of sale and the new owner can get the animal desexed and just has to pay the life time registration by the time the animal is 6 months old, not immediately.

I am not sure if the above all makes sense in writing, but I just wanted everyone to be aware of the impact of the seller not sending the paperwork into the council, in a harsh way of looking at it, it puts the animals life at risk, and it can also lead to the seller receiving a fine, and more and more fines are being issued in regards to companion animals.

So please if you can talk and educate your friends and family who may breed or sell animals, please ask them to send in the yellow copy of the change of ownership to council when they sell/give away an animal.

#2 User is offline   WreckitWhippet 

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 02:51 PM

With scenario 1, why would the breeder not collect the dog ? it's still in their name and they are still the legal owner.

#3 User is offline   Helen Hayden 

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 02:56 PM

The microchip registry bit can "sometimes " be a problem as there are 2 registries.

Anyway regarding microchipping, the MICROCHIPPER must send the white page [top one] to the local council, the Pink page [2nd one] is the copy that goes to the new owner, the yellow page[3rd one] is the page that STAYS in the microchippers pad.

Now when I do my puppies, I ALWAYS Chip them in the New Owners Name, I am the secondary contact for the life of the animal, once the local council recieves all chip docs from the IMPLANTER they then forward the details to the NEW OWNERS LOCAL COUNCIL, when the pup is 6mths they must register.


If everyone COULD register pups in the new owners name it would be far easier, but many breeders havent got puppies sold by the time their 6wks, whereby I am lucky mine are often spoken for well in advance, before litters are born and if not by the time that are a week old.


It is the NEW OWNERS responsibility to send in the change of ownership [pink copy 2nd page] to either the rigistry listed or their local council, NOT the breeders!

#4 User is offline   Helen Hayden 

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 03:01 PM

Yes Jackie agreed, the Breeder should have collected and then dealt with the issue, as we would, but sadly not alot of breeders keep reasonable records, I use my Breedmate and have every puppy, chip number, owner, rego number etc recorded I also have the seperate data files for my pharaoh peds, but I keep a seperate one for anything I have bred with all details!

#5 User is offline   petsearch 

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 04:37 PM

Just to clarify some information.
There is only 1 compulsory microchip registry in NSW -the companion animal register - other registries are optional and use different forms.

For the companion animal registry there is a form that has 3 duplicate copies - 1 yellow, 1 pink and 1 white.

The yellow copy goes to council
the pink copy goes to the new owner
the white copy is kept by either the implanter (if microchipped directly into new owners name), or by the breeder if changing ownership from breeder to new owner.

Quote

Now when I do my puppies, I ALWAYS Chip them in the New Owners Name, I am the secondary contact for the life of the animal, once the local council recieves all chip docs from the IMPLANTER they then forward the details to the NEW OWNERS LOCAL COUNCIL, when the pup is 6mths they must register.


It is only the microchippers responsibility to send in the yellow form if it is going directly into the new owners name, but if all was being done correctly, this would mean the new owner would have to be present at the time of microchipping to sign the form, otherwise whomever is there at the time of microchipping is illegally signing the document. (this is being pedantic, but if all the rules were being followed, this would be happening) If it is being changed from a breeders name to the new owners name it is the breeders responsibility to send the yellow form in.

There are many reasons why a breeder won't/can't collect an animal - eg it is in a pound hundreds of kilometres away, the animal can't fit into the breeders household for whatever reason, fines, costs and sometimes even charges from the police involved in getting the animal out.

#6 User is offline   Steve 

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 04:49 PM

Well - When I chip my pups at the vets . I get the pink and I never see the yellow or the white . No choice - thats how its done.
Some councils let you chip straight into the new owners name and others wont unless the new owner is right there when its done.
If the owner is interstate the vet never sends the chip papers on [ white and yellow] and keeps them in her office .
When I sell a pup I download a form from the net because the council no longer send these forms out and get the new owner to sign them and send them into the council again.
Sometimes I dont meet the new owners in person so I ask for them to sign a form I send to them and send it back to me so I can send it to my council to get it changed into their name. If they dont send it back the puppy remains in my name because the council wont accept my notice of change of owner without the new owners signature even though I only have 14 days to change the owner details by law.
I cant register a dog unless I attend bodily in person to the council during business hours either.

#7 User is offline   Steve 

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 12:30 PM

The white paper staye with the implater no matter where the pup goes next doesnt it ?

#8 User is offline   pomquest 

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 05:22 PM

We have this on our puppy page:


PLEASE NOTE:
All of our puppies will be micro-chipped with Pomquest details. This will not be transferred into the new owners name when the puppy/dog is sold/re-homed. In the event that the dog is lost or stolen at any time during the course of its life, anyone finding the dog will be able to contact us at anytime of the day or night and the dog will be retrieved or the new owner contacted by us. Therefore all new owners are advised to keep in contact with us and keep all personal details up to date. If we are unable to contact the new owner, Pomquest Pomeranians will either collect the dog or have the dog transported by whatever method is appropriate from anywhere in Australia to our place of residence or another safe location chosen by us. If the new owner wishes to re-claim the dog, all transport costs will be reimbursed to Pomquest Pomeranians in full before the dog is released back to the new owner. Also we will happily take our fur babies back in to our home at any time, at any age, as we assume responsibility for their entire life. If a Pomquest Pomeranian needs to be re-homed, then we prefer to do that ourselves.

*** IF YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH THESE TERMS, PLEASE DO NOT CONSIDER A POMERANIAN FROM US. ***




Does anyone else do anything like this? Is it legal? We want to be responsible for any dog we breed for its lifetime. Microchipping is not mandatory here in Qld so thats why I thought we could make our own rules. We figure that if they care enough about their dog, they will do as we ask and if they don't care enough we don't want them to have one of our dogs anyway.


#9 User is offline   petsearch 

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Posted 25 January 2008 - 12:01 AM

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you were within NSW, that is completely illegal.

Companion Animals Act 1998 No 87
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

11 Owner required to notify certain changes and events

(1) The owner of an identified companion animal (whether or not it is registered) must notify the Director-General when any of the following happens:
(a) any change occurs in the registration information or identification information for the animal (notification must be given within 14 days after the change occurs),(b) the making or revocation of a declaration by a court under Part 5 that the animal (being a dog) is dangerous (notification must be given within 7 days after the declaration is made or revoked),
© the animal dies (notification must be given within 28 days after the animal dies),
(d) the animal has been missing for more than 72 hours (notification must be given within 96 hours after the animal went missing),
(d1) the animal has been found after having been reported missing (notification must be given within 72 hours after the animal is found),
(e) any other event prescribed as a notifiable event by the regulations.

Maximum penalty:

(a) 8 penalty units except in the case of a dangerous or restricted dog, or
(b) 50 penalty units in the case of a dangerous or restricted dog.


and - quoted from the companion animals website:
What do I need to do if I give my pet away or sell it?
Under the Companion Animals Act, you cannot sell or give away a companion
animal without having it permanently identified by microchip. All puppies or kittens
need to be microchipped by the age of 12 weeks, but if you sell or give away animals
before this age, you are still responsible for ensuring that they are microchipped
before they leave your ownership. A maximum penalty of $550 applies for breaching
these provisions.
You need to complete a Change of Owner/Details form and send it to your local
council within 14 days. The form should also have the signature of the new owner,
so you make sure you have the form ready when the new owner takes the cat or
dog. Change of Owner/Details forms are also available from your local council.

Of course this is all only relevant for NSW, but further to this, the problems I can see with what you are doing are:
1. You are leaving yourself legally open to being prosecuted, for example if the dog was to escape and cause a car accident, you could be sued as the legal owner of the dog. This is also the case if the dog was to bite someone.
2. You are legally responsible for any fines/infringements the dog has such as not picking up droppings, fines for roaming or ending up in the pound.
3. If for some reason you do not answer your phone and miss a call from a pound and that animal is put to sleep and the new owners find out, they could possibly sue you.

Also just wondering how you go about the registration aspect as you would be liable to pay the registration fees for each of the dogs in your name. Also if you live in an area where the council has a restriction on the number of dogs on your property, a search on the microchip or council registry would show all the dogs listed under your property and you would then need to explain to them where all the dogs are, and they would then make you transfer the microchips all over to the new owners.

I can't imagine why you would want to take on the responsibility of all the people you sell dogs to, at the end of the day, you are taking responsibilities away from them, and putting yourself at risk at the same time. If you want to stay on the animal's record, you can put yourself on there as a secondary contact person when you change the microchip over into the new owners name. I can appreciate you wanting to be there for the animal for life, but allow the owner to take some responsibility for the dog, and you remain the secondary contact.

#10 User is offline   Steve 

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Posted 25 January 2008 - 12:06 AM

Quote A maximum penalty of $550 applies for breaching
these provisions.

Yeah well how long are TheY going to wait to fine the people who dont ?

#11 User is offline   petsearch 

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Posted 25 January 2008 - 12:13 PM

too long...but one big problem with the whole microchipping system is that it is state based, each state doing things differently. If someone in Victoria or QLD sells a dog to a person in NSW, the new owner has to have the knowledge to know that the animal won't be listed on the NSW companion animal register unless they do it themselves. ALso if a NSW dog is visiting another state and goes missing in another state, none of the other states check the NSW companion animal register for information, so unless your dog has a collar and tag on or is registered on one of the private registries, it has no chance of being reunited with the owner.

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