Colour In Staffordshire Bull Terriers

[Kirislin]

I thought there wasn't a true black in Staffordshire bull terriers. I thought they were all really brindle, just some more heavily brindled than others. I think there are solid fawns reds but I thought blacks and blues were all brindles. Am I wrong? I dont profess to be an expert.

Edited April 15, 2014 by Kirislin

[*kirty*]

You are correct. Genetically they are brindle (but they miggt only haveone or two brindle hairs).

[Kirislin]

that's what I thought, someone needs to tell the Staffordshire Bull Terrier club of Vic that then because they have classes for best black, red, brindle, white, pied and blue.

[*kirty*]

I think they still call them black (or black brindle).

[Sandra777]

The standard says black, brindle, red,fawn or blue. No genetically they're not black and in reality only one in a couple of thousand is black - as opposed to black brindle - but as the standard uses the term black the club will too - the class is for black brindles and the fun is in guessing which one is black brindle and which one is brindle :-)

[dancinbcs]

Do the "K^B" dominant black or "a" recessive black genes exist in SBTs? Reds and fawns have to be k^yk^y a^ya^y, brindles are k^brk^br or k^brk^y a^ya^y. I am just wondering if their are any black and blues with different K an A series genes.

[Sandra777]

Phenotypically black dogs have not produced a large enough number of black pups to lend any credence to the idea they are genetically black.

There's a few DNA testing for colour and all the ones I have seen have come back k^br - including one absolutely black pup I had here.

There's a fair amount of anecdotal evidence that black Staffords are frequently tan-pattern but with black brindle points, black brindle so intensely black-striped they appear black. Tan pattern is often seen in the same families as these black dogs.

Edited April 16, 2014 by Sandra777

[dancinbcs]

Phenotypically black dogs have not produced a large enough number of black pups to lend any credence to the idea they are genetically black.

There's a few DNA testing for colour and all the ones I have seen have come back k^br - including one absolutely black pup I had here.

There's a fair amount of anecdotal evidence that black Staffords are frequently tan-pattern but with black brindle points, black brindle so intensely black-striped they appear black. Tan pattern is often seen in the same families as these black dogs.

So two apparent black dogs do not produce black offspring? A K^Bk^br dog would be true black but carry brindle and would only produce true black to another with the same K^Bk^br genes. The same applies to blues. Do they not produce clear blues when bred together?

[Sandra777]

So two apparent black dogs do not produce black offspring? A K^Bk^br dog would be true black but carry brindle and would only produce true black to another with the same K^Bk^br genes. The same applies to blues. Do they not produce clear blues when bred together?

Not in numbers enough to support the idea they are black rather than brindle, hence why it's always been believed "black" doesn't occur in Staffords.

Edited April 17, 2014 by Sandra777

[dancinbcs]

So two apparent black dogs do not produce black offspring? A K^Bk^br dog would be true black but carry brindle and would only produce true black to another with the same K^Bk^br genes. The same applies to blues. Do they not produce clear blues when bred together?

Not in numbers enough to support the idea they are black rather than brindle, hence why it's always been believed "black" doesn't occur in Staffords.

Interesting. Now colour testing is more available I wonder if people with dogs that appear to be black or blue will bother testing them to check.