Kavik

I think people use check chains BECAUSE their dog is unresponsive to a flat collar I have found it hard to find a club that WILL allow you to use a check chain if you wish. (you have the choice at my club, some people on flat collars, some on martingales, some check chains and some haltis. All use either food or toys or a combination). Zoe my Kelpie cross is dog aggressive and a flat collar just won't cut it. Diesel could probably be worked on a flat collar, I just find the check chain gives a bit more control over a large dog. Since he is fairly easy, I am thinking of changing to a martingale (ordered it last night).

It's up to you whether you want to use check chains or not. Harnesses are not the best for training though, they will want you to use something else no matter where you train. I use check chains but also use food. Am thinking of changing to a martingale for Diesel though. What is more important is what do you think of their training methods over all? If you want to use food and they don't, maybe try somewhere else (conversely, if they use food, and you are against using food, somewhere else may be better). Do they allow you to use a different type of collar if it is effective or do you have to use a check chain to train there?

Actually I find that stronger distractions make it more difficult if your dog is getting bored with the treats . . . the higher a distraction, the better the treat needs to be until the dog learns to ignore the distraction.

I use cheese and cocktail frankfurts. I prefer to use cheese because the smell of cocktail frankfurts eventually makes me want to :rolleyes: , especially in warmer weather but I will change around if they are getting bored.

I think longlines are useful in the transition from on lead to off lead recalls, but I would gather the lead as the dog comes in (and lure in to front if necessary) so that there is not a lot of slack when the dog comes close, in case it tries to run off. This way you minimise the chance of the dog running off, and it can't go far, so there will not be a big jerk on the lead.

Diesel has been great with recalls, but he did this to me last week! So embarrassing, he came in and then decided to run off and have a play elsewhere at the last second! I ran the other way and he decided to see what I was doing, so he came in the end! I am now going back to shorter distances for formal recalls and making sure he is in the right position with food. I am also doing come-fores once again to get the right position and eagerness. I practice my real life recalls when he is distracted by a scent on walks, I call him and go backwards (or run if trying to improve his speed). This week he was much better, we tried a shorter distance, he came into the front position perfectly. At 12 months he was just seeing what he could do

Grotty Rotty My current GSD is also happy go lucky! That is why I chose his breeder, her dogs are calm and relaxed. Makes training much more pleasant.

I have lost my temper when training Zoe before. Mostly because of her dog aggression. It will be going fine, and she will be ignoring other dogs. And then for no reason she will have a go. It gets very frustrating. But now I just make sure to give a good distance between her and other dogs, get her attention, and don't test it much. If I think it will be too hard, we cross the street. And if something unexpected happens (eg off lead dog, or dog that lunges at her while she is nicely at heel), I know it is not her fault, and do not get upset. But classes used to frustrate me something chronic. It didn't help that everyone elses dog was super friendly and the owners would let them come into Zoe's face despite me telling them she was not friendly.

Digging is difficult to stop. I would have thought though that it would be best not to involve the handler in the method (so that the dog would not associate the handler with bad things re digging and so that the dog would act the same whether handler home or not). Something remote would be better? Like the problem with stopping barking by reprimanding - when you are not home, the dog will bark because you are not there to tell it off. Wouldn't the same thing happen if you use this technique to stop digging? Dog would still dig when you are not home? (if it is successful in stopping digging when you are home)

She seems to be giving the dog very human aspects in this story, goes a bit too far I think. (digging holes is sacred??) And dogs can learn by watching people - they can certainly learn to dig holes by watching you weed the garden! I'm not sure the method would have the desired effect. Strikes me similar to Bark Busters telling you to encourage the dog to jump on you and then correct the dog when it does. Certainly won't get any agility training out of that dog

Dog always work for external rewards! As they get better, the rewards just take longer getting there, or secondary rewards are used more often. I have done a scent detection course - really good dogs are amazing to watch! Super motivated, and the active reward dogs super keen on their toy (and will do anything and destroy anything to get to it LOL!) I love to see dogs which are happy while they are working. I also happen to have a dog that sees agility as its own reward (although we no longer go due to dog aggression issues). She waits in a sit for my signal, you can see how eager she is to do the course in the way she is waiting. We do use food, mainly for new exercises and to teach her to slow down for contacts. Interestingly, while I though calling her off an obstacle (say the 3 jumps mentioned before) would be difficult, she responds very well and fast to my voice commands, and does not make up her own course (have seen many that do LOL!)

You have just said something very useful - positive only training is most useful if started straight away. The problem then is with dogs that have no previous training or manners - positive only is very difficult with them (especially if they weigh twice as much as you ). And I agree with Sidoney - you cannot control every situation, life is unpredictable, and dogs (being animals, not machines) are also unpredictable. In this, I don't think positive only training is realistic.

I don't think anyone is arguing whether positive reinforcement works (as all training methods use positive reinforcement, including traditional techniques), Rather whether positive ONLY techniques work as well as those that are balanced, on every dog and in every situation.

I disagree. I don't think the dog understands that because he comes to you when called he is able to enjpy more freedom. I think he understands that coming to you gets rewarded. I think he enjoys getting out. But I don't think he understands that the two are related.

I agree with Sidoney and vpzn. Different methods work for different people and different dogs. Depends on temperament of dog and owner, and what you are trying to train. As long as you are not harming the dog and it works, go for it. Some dogs train well with traditional methods, others crumble, and work best with alternative methods. Some owners cannot comprehend correcting their dog, and don't use a method that requires physical correction, others use physical correction when necessary.

I use a food processor. The only problem I have is that sometimes they don't all pulp as well as I would like (there are chunks), and it is time consuming. If we get a juicer I would give it a go! I have used a blender before but found that it didn't cope with the vegies as well as the food processor. I am lucky that my dog will eat the vegies on their own He is a strange one that way!

I often get the opposite comments about my kelpie cross I either get she is so skinny or is she part whippet? (I don't think she is either of those two!) - she is just a lean lightly built dog! Yours looks solid, not fat. Staffies are a solid dog generally, although when really toned they are , like a body builder.

I was talking to someone who also had BARF wrong, but had the opposite problem. They only fed their dog meat. Not meaty bones, just mince. I tried to explain the calcium/phosperous ratio, the importance of bones (at least wings etc), and the need for other things such as veggies etc. Not sure how much was understood. Now I know why vets are loath to recommend BARF or any homemade diet. Diesel gets: * Chicken wings (and frames when we can find them) - about 5 wings or 2 frames for brekkie and 4 or 5 wings for dinner (depending on what else he is getting) * Pureed fruit and veggies (apple, carrot, celery, pear, snow peas) every day * Fish twice a week (mackeral and sardines) * Egg twice a week * Brisket bones twice a week * Kelp twice a week (1 teaspoon) * Organ meat twice a week (liver, heart, kidney and giblets, rotating) * Vit C and fish oil every day. I think I have covered most things, it is time consuming, but I think about the same price as a premium food.

I use food as part of my positive reinforcement reward schedule. I also use toys and games and pats - try to mix it up a bit. But mostly food as I find you can do many repetitions with food without the dog getting tired or bored. Every dog I have owned has been food motivated

I enjoyed 'The Dogs Mind' and 'How Dogs Learn' for training and psychology. I also have a few books on Schutzhund and competitive obedience which I find helpful for new ideas and new ways to teach things, actual exercises to try. My next mission is to get some DVDs from Leerburg. I have borrowed the competitive heeling one and aim to buy it. Also looking into getting the motivational retrieving DVD as we are running into problems there, and maybe a tracking one or scent detection one.

One of my classmates at TAFE titled an Afghan, a Geryhound and another sighthound (don't remember which one) in obedience! I was impressed. She said it was a challenge. She got lots of comments from other competitors about her breed choice. She even did tracking with the greyhound. When I did agility there were about 2 or 3 Afghans there. Lovely dogs that were also shown in conformation. Zoe didn't mind them so we were able to talk a bit (for some reason, she doesn't mind the sighthounds as much as other breeds - maybe because they are more aloof and tend to ignore her?).

With Zoe (kelpie X) I did obedience and agility. She liked obedience and LOVED agility, although retrieving was difficult for her. Unfortunately, she doesn't like other dogs and until she either miraculously decides to behave or I feel like stressing out has been retired. Although I have been looking into canine freestyle a bit and teaching her heaps of tricks (she also loves this!) - although of course we can't compete because of her problem. But I may be using her as a demo dog for friends and family gatherings. Her latest tricks are 'bow' and 'spin', we are working on 'crawl'. With Diesel (GSD), the plan is competitive obedience. He is showing great promise in focus and heeling, and is fast in his response to commands. He has even got the hang of the left about turns and scooting his bum around for them (after a lot of work!). Dumbell work and retrieving is proving a challenge - I think I need more work in teaching it! He thinks he is supposed to pick up the dumbell and chuck it somewhere. Will be getting tips next week. I would like to try tracking with Diesel, but it looks really time consuming. I think Diesel is too slow and doesn't corner well enough for agility (well, after training a super fast quick turning kelpie anyway). Don't think I am quite ready for the commitment for Schutzhund, maybe the next dog (if the next is a Malinois ) Edited to add: I have also done some scent detection work with Zoe, she loved it! May get back into that and also try it with Diesel. Just need more time . . .

Search for 'Flat Feet' I think on General Dog Discussion. Holly has posted the pic and info on a few threads.

From the diet he was given before, it does sound like a calcium defieciency and he looks down in the pasterns. Of course I would check to make sure that is the problem with the vet. Holly has some great before and after photos of a pup with a similar problem. I say go with a BARF diet Will give him the correct calcium/phosperous ratio in his diet.

I work at a vet and my workmates were a bit skeptical about BARF. When I told them what I feed Diesel, they commented on how much more work it was than dry - which is true, but he certainly enjoys it and looks great! They are mostly worried about not getting the mix of ingredients right and are concerned that some people would feed a meat only diet. The parents of some friends of mine confirm that some people are like that - they are feeding their puppy only cooked meat I tried to explain the principles of BARF and that they need to feed more than just meat, and preferably raw meaty bones. We'll see how it goes. Interestingly we had a client come in with an old Beagle who was not well - and she fed BARF too! Gave me some good ideas, and was surprised they only feed cooked meat at the vet as she only feeds raw. Nutrition is rarely the focus of the vets where I work, unless it is a specific problem requiring a specific diet (where they use the Science Diet special diets). Mainly they are interested in getting the animals to eat AT ALL, and will give them anything they will eat including cooked chicken and cat food.