JimmyTheHuman

Thanks for the considered post, we took note. Thought i would provide an update.

Since posting he had a scope and they said, yep, Lar par, but bearable see how long can go without surgery.

Recently it got very bad. On Walks it would almost close and his tongue would go blue and clearly couldn't breath, on the couch he was heaving to breath. So we rang them back and they gave us two options. 1 was with them and another was a more specialised place but double the price. Luckily the more specialist was happy to talk to our vet and us and give our vet and us guidance when he knew we couldnt afford double. Fairly generous actually

Had tie back surgery last week and other than 24hrs of grogginess he is brand new. easy relaxed breathing, can drink water easy and we feed him meat balls and swallows them like oysters so very little risk of aspirating food. We have a big yard, he doesnt chew sticks etc, but if he finds a juicy dead bird or something he will be into it...not much we can do about that

He is more agile and can easily jump on the couch, he was really struggling before. He has lost a LOT of bloat around his chest...i think he was holding a bit of fluid there or something.

Today (Sunday) will be his first walk since surgery Thursday.

Hopefully this gives him a few more years of easy living that includes walks.

thanks for the tips and advice.

6 hours ago, juice said:

Who owns a white pit bull ? Ignorance much . 

I was deliberately mouthing off about stuff i have no idea about to make a point...i failed.

I dont, just nitpicking and assuming we're all doing the wrong thing. Anyway, now i am whinging! Go ahead and delete these posts if you like.

Thanks for the links, i am building the pen Sat, then make it inescapable...i am predicting his tunnelling skills...then i will make it exciting!

16 hours ago, juice said:

I dont see the problem with filling out a form first . Why would a foster career who may work full time want to talk to every tyre kickers out there . They don’t have the time . It’s basically sorting the wheat from the chaff . I do understand some questions I have seen are stupid but I’d suck it up . Breeders dogs might be cheaper initially, but a rescue will be vaccinated and desexed so cheaper , plus you can get a better match and backup 

Yep, maybe the form needs some thought. Because sharing that much personal info is simply not safe. Plus there is no way you can learn enough about a families suitability from filling out a form. It requires a discussion at least. But i know that can use a lot of time...i just think a better balance could be had.

I did try quite a few rescue options, organised a puppy from a breeder and continue to try for rescue until puppy time. So i did what i could.

17 hours ago, persephone said:

WHO sold you a puppy this young ?

Puppies are not supposed to be sold until at least 8 weeks. 

16 hours ago, juice said:

And you have had him 4 days so even younger than 7 weeks when u got him poor mite . 

He was like 7 weeks and 5 days. PLEASE forgive my rounding.

I think this is an excellent way to create a quiet and unpleasant forum.

There is NOTHING poor about this pup or my older dog. We lived as a family 5 (4 people and the dog), his picture is on the wall next to my kids, we do everything together. My dogs live like Kings! Best food, regular holidays together, regular vet, big yard, inside with us a lot, plenty of exercise, obedience and training, the beach. With the pup My wife and i are on shifts and take to toilet all night to train him to go way down the back, he could be in a pen on a chain...nothing poor or lazy or ill considered here.

These comments are as silly as me saying, your white pitbull in your profile pic is a killer breed and shouldn't be allowed. Why are you so careless?

I tried exactly as suggested. In order to chat with anyone about anything you must fill in the form. When they reply, DENIED i contact them and say, would you mind chatting with me or helping me understand why...you get told some silly BS about wasting time. The form and details they need are not safe, the process is waaay too out of date...it's a shame...our current dog rescued from this forum in 2007 has lived the life of a king.

On 22/04/2020 at 4:41 PM, sheena said:

Where is he going to sleep at night?

My current dog slept outside for 10 years on his bed...he would drag his bed out of his kennel. He just preferred it. Last couple of years we've let him sleep inside as he is getting old and he very trustworthy and next level obedient.

New pup is in crate next to old dog inside. He is 7 weeks. WAY too young to leave outside over night in melb winter. I have enclose outdoor area and his crate is going out there during the day...he is fine for next month. I am trying to get him to to love his crate. Then i was going to do what did last time, kennel and dog run until he grows out of the escape and dissappear age and will reliably stay home even when gate is open. eg my current/old dog can be told to sit on front door matt i can go out for hours and come back and he will be sitting there...though i dont test this anymore. He wouldn't go out our gate without being released even if other dogs walked past. I aiming to repeat this

On 22/04/2020 at 2:37 PM, Dogsfevr said:

The better question is what is your long term plan and how do I raise the puppy to adapt too it .

You're right this is THE big question. I have agonised over this and our pup has been here for 4 days and i am still thinking, crikey what have i done!

I am lucky/unlucky enough to be working from home for the first 3months of its life. Plus i have 'adult' children at home until Feb next year as the uni is 100% from home until then. This will be our last child/puppy in this lifetime so we are very into it, and this is possibly the most time we will be at home until retirement/retrenchment

This is the time for us. However its winter, but our yard is all grass. No mud. We are working, even now on training and playing for calm, we want him to be inside and cuddly and calm as much as possible.

We dont want to use chain or pen but reality is, there are times when the puppy needs to learn to be on his own and our 1 acre yard is dog proof, its still to big for him to wander for hour/s without supervision for now. So i think i will build a pen from mesh fence panels. Make it into a dog disneyland with heaps of creative play stuff and a kennel and shelter from the weather and get him used to being separated and playing on his own in there.

What do you think?

Wife and i are debating about whether to build close enough where he can see us inside or better its we are out of sight?

Not exactly our first puppy, but keen to start at the start. Not about behaviour, theres endless content on that.

Ours is a Kelpie puppy.

I am curious about pens, play areas. What does a day look like for a 12-24 week old puppy look like. how to safely leave him at 2 days a week. dog runs, vs chained to kennel. how long to use chains and runs before alone in the yard.

Any good guides or discussion on this? i cant find anything.

I have a new kelpie puppy arriving in 2 weeks and i want to follow an entire course if possible.

I trained my current kelpie myself, using smart and dumb tactics. He is amazing and so well behaved, no bad habits and can go anywhere. But I really want to just focus on smart this time, but i want to follow something proven to be effective.

What is the best online/dvd type training to learn all of the key elements of well behaved, intelligent active dog.

Pawperfect is another organisation with a form that was made by a well meaning volunteer...why would they need to know my occupation? I'm Lawyer or a Bricklayer - which best for owning dog type A, B or C?

No talking to anyone unless you fill in a form. It deters a lot of people i have found out since i've started trying to rescue again.

Thanks, Charlotte is absolutely gorgeous! So is Izzy. I really wanted a dog. But will send them a message and see what the process is.

thanks!

Yes thanks...that organisation is actually one of the ones deterring me. They want too much info at the start, they say no in a 1 sentence email and then they share you private info in an insecure way - i get they are busy and volunteers - but sharing that much info isn't safe from a privacy and security perspective and the 8 word 'no' email isnt enough to let you know whats happening. But i do understand its volunteer and limited resources.

When you then compare the cost of a puppy with full pedigree and warranty from a known and reputable breeder is a little less than adoption, the whole system then relies entirely on my willingness to participate and really want to rescue, even though the experience is kinda crappy.

You can see the circular nature of the problem.

So I am not to trying to criticise, i know they are trying to do their best, but its flawed (in my opinion). When i rescued through this site in 2007 the experience was quite personal and the foster carer and i were able to chat directly and it really has worked out for the best, Jax has lived the life of a king as far as dogs go.

Since posting i have found a couple of breeders who have litters. I really want to be able to rescue...but not sure what to do.

We are going to get a second dog. we're at home for 6 months, now is the time.

We want a small/fine/smoochy kelpie. not a cattle ready working version.

We have 1 Kelpie, he is getting on, but still ok and we have 1 acre of land and we're outdoorsy and keen to train etc.

We've tried a few rescue apps on petrescue. but i wont be doing that anymore. I dont like sharing so much info and waiting for days for an email saying "we dont feel you are the right fit" based on filling in the worlds oldest online form. I understand why they are like this...i imagine how many wierdos they have to deal with. but its not a great experience.

So. We rescued our current dog through this forum in 2007! But they dont seem to be doing much here anymore? is there a secret way of rescues...or is petrescue it now?

As we have a small window of opportunity. we may have to consider breeder over rescue. Any recommendations for reputable breeders in Vic. Esp black n tan for companion quality kelpies? (we already know beloka and they may or may not have something)

Thanks, we will switch the harness. The lady Vet said operational is possible, but it's invasive and has side effects...so only consider if the issue is really impacting him. It's certainly impacting him...but probably not enough to warrant a big surgery and long recovery etc.

Thanks for the advise and wishes.

I emailed the vet with videos and long explanation. 2 vets reviewed it, reviewed his xrays and called me back and spent 15min on the phone with me. On the same day I emailed them!

They went through each suggestion we made (many from this page) and explained why they didnt like them (eg xray proof or absence of key symptoms).

They think its this. Laryngeal Paralysis. They really like that the noise is an inhale not exhale noise...much less likely to be fluid or other internals and lends itself this. one of the vets has a keplie with the same issue.

So they have a process to diagnose this and we'll go in a week or so and confirm.

Thanks for the tips, hope this helps someone else.

https://www.albertparkvet.com.au/dog-stuff/2018/3/6/laryngeal-paralysis-is-your-dog-a-noisy-breather

I am definitely taking him back to the vet, but i wanted to offer some thoughts and ask more questions. Our vet is very obliging and caring, they would watch the vids.

No he isnt on any pain meds, but doesnt pay his knee much attention.

He remembers the vet clinic and he doesnt like the place at all. As soon as you pull up he is shaking...then when they try and stethoscope him he snaps and growls from fear, we muzzle him and he just shakes, like cartoon type whole of body trembling. They sedate him and then they xray and ultra sound and listen to him...he isnt wheezing during any of this.

It's not from smoke, he has had it since before the bushfires.

Sheena, that sounds quite similar, except sometimes he is ok, if something like that i would expect it all the time?

He seems to have less wheezing if sleeping with head elevated, or if he is standing. it seems to be when he laying down.

I dont want to wait until its a bigger issue, but i dont know what to ask/tell the vet?

He went outside 30min after posting above, came back in and is breathing quietly. I filmed him breathing quietly, but as i type this its starting to sound crackly like it did before.

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AvYNQeOv4wIlhbVz23CWuiR3Hsw8TQ

Hi there, we adopted our beloved Jax in 2007 from this forum. He has been going pretty great but recent times he has this crackly breathing...sounds like he has bronchitis or a lot of mucus on his chest...now that he is old he is inside a lot so we hear it each night. Every day he does this hacking thing, almost throwing up.

Last week, after a very short walk he came back completely exhausted, extreme. He cuddled up to mum and on the couch (never cuddled anyone in his life) really nuzzling his head on her and was panting really heavy all night - trip to vet, xray, heart murmur tests etc etc and nothing could be found.

Tonight he is laying next me and he is super restless and occasionally sits up and pants, like stress/super out of breath.

He isnt over weight and his diet is mostly dried food. Got plenty of water but doesnt do a lot of exercise now.Any ideas?

I dont mind taking him back to the vet, but i want to go with some leads...Jax HATES the vet, he stresses and shakes and tries to bite...honestly its frightening to watch him that scared...so i need to only take him for emergencies.

Wife googled and came up with a collapsed/damaged trachea? Although he can still bark fine.

Any ideas?

Video of the breathing noise

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AvYNQeOv4wIlhbVwlEffFYXeIpomuw?e=HIe58j

Video of his belly while breathing (not sure if this is significant)

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AvYNQeOv4wIlhbVxL56tzqZsz1Iyig?e=DMDO6U

History:

Knee reco. Its ok, but not perfect.

Fatty lumps - has a few of these and we had one removed from arm pit, they said defintely benign

He is home now for 3 days...he was in pain and pretty unhappy for a day or two...we're home with him in shifts this week. He is frustrated with being confined and the cone on his head...but he will lick his staples out in a heart beat  

Also starting to walk on his repaired leg. Back to the Vet for fentanil patch and bandage off today and he was growling and barking at the vet, he has never growled or barked at anyone in his life...he does not like the vet! Had to have two sedatives just to remove the bandages   and even then he resisted the sedatives (max dose) for over and hour and my wife had to do it. 

I dont think this is the best time for to start figuring out pecking orders with new dogs...we might look into it again next year...reading these posts and thinking about it, the more i think it'll probably cause jealously and dislodgement - he's earned all of the attention and his respected spot in our pack, we'll just be happy with that for now  

Hi there, we rescued our dog through this forum in early 2007. He was in ACT and we south of Melb. Another member offered to take him as carry on luggage, wife met this generous lady airport, dropped her at her gig and brought our adoptee home.

Jax is almost 12 now and he has been the best dog ever. Seriously well mannered and good natured and very obedient - my kids treat him like a sibling. 

He has had no medical issues other than some lumps removed earlier this year - now he has had a knee ligament and needs a knee reco. He is going in next week.

He seems like he is going to live forever, but we know he wont. We arent a two dog family, but were thinking maybe a small dog to keep him company, a new dog could learn from him and it might help to keep him young?

I know it varies with every dog, but what is the general consensus on this types of thing?

A dog of a certain size and strength always has the potential to kill a small child...whether the owner or a parent is present or not. Previous history, behaviour, training etc is all secondary. The owner and the parent have made a tragic mistake, one that will be repeated again and again and again.

We have had situations where people with big dogs brought them near my young kids,

If those factors were 'secondary', then every big dog would 'kill' or seriously attack. The evidence is that most don't.

Go look at the scientific studies.

Studies looking into aggressive behaviours in dogs of all sizes & breeds & mixed breeds at the University of Cordoba found that human factors in what people did or did not do, in managing and training their dogs, was the key factor. Their conclusion was that people need to socialize & train their dogs. But they acknowledged some could have issues like neurological problems.

Science doesn't replace logic. the dog of a certain size and strength has the capacity to kill a child of a certain size. Your upbringing of the dog will change the likelihood. The capacity remains unchanged (in terms strength). While your upbringing and training will change the likelihood the dog will always have the same capacity. What you are arguing is that even though the risk of occurrence is greatly reduced by your training and treatment of the dog, and the potential for it to kill the child still exists, but it's worth the risk?

I strongly disagree and I don't think the risk is worth it with small children... other people do...some get away with it some don't. Fairly big stakes to gamble with IMO.

One factor that came out as more linked with development of aggression... was small size. Yes, small size. Because owners didn't see the necessity to train them & also because they are more likely to be pampered & spoiled. Yet small size dogs can do serious harm to the statistically most vulnerable age bracket.... babies, toddlers & young children. Because the child's face is on a level with the dog & their finer skin is very easily injured.

Anyone watching Bondi Vet last Saturday, saw a small chihuahua do over Dr Chris & draw blood. Everyone in the segment thought it was funny. But it wasn't. If that'd been a toddler's face... rather than a male adult hand....

I get that. But in terms of risk...it's clearly not an apples for apples comparison. My son has been bitten twice this year and 3 times in his life, twice on the face, so I do take risks and I have gotten it wrong. 1 time was his fault and I was standing there, so were the owners. He was backing his hand up to one as he has been shown and the dog just snapped and bit him while he owners was giving me lecture on how kid friendly it was. The next one he did the wrong thing and grabbed the dog by the face and tried to snuggle it and it nipped him on the nose. Ad another one walked into a friends place and bit him on the face while he was playing video games. I has also tried to bite me.

If you have young children in that vulnerable age bracket, then you're rightly cautious in taking care when unleashed dogs are around

Except it should be all dogs.

Especially if there's no history of their being well socialised with children. The latest report seems to say that was the case with this dog. It was not used to being free around a child. It had always been contained on a chain. So what's possible when left off the chain around a child?

I think that having an equality policy when comes to animals is silly when they are not equal. Some are more dangerous than others. If they weren't then you would see people hunting pigs with westies instead I mastifs?

I didint say big ones only...but at a certain size the RISK changes. Maybe that size it bigger than a westie, or a kelpie or a rotty...i dont know what the rule is or should be...i use my own judgement. But leaving a kid the sized a 2 yo near a dog with enough power to kill a pig is dumb...i was reffering this type of thing, more than the case on the new specifically...i dont know what dog they had?

Such a tragedy for all concerned The poor little boy who lost his life in what would of been I can only speculate, nothing short of sheer terror. The poor grandmother who would of been

frantically trying to stop the dog but injured the whole horrific situation & the dog that for what ever reason, apparently out of character,I don't know, has a brain snap....

My sympathies & condolences to the poor family.

A dog of a certain size and strength always has the potential to kill a small child...whether the owner or a parent is present or not. Previous history, behaviour, training etc is all secondary. The owner and the parent have made a tragic mistake, one that will be repeated again and again and again.

We have had situations where people with big dogs brought them near my young kids, i put a stop to it, occasionally causing a few scenes where dog owner friends and family claim i am making a big deal...f. them...i am not taking those typs of risks with my kids safety. Other can choose to, i think its stupid.

You will never know but i would be interested in the relationship between the number of stupid excuses and pet store purchases.

Do pet stores have any process where they tell knew customer that they are buying in for the life o the animals, that the animals will depend on you, and you on it. That its not just a pet until you get sick of it?