So Confused

[larns]

Ok, Ok,

I know that this question may have been asked before, but I have done a search, and can't find it anywhere.

I was ripped apart by the vet practice manager today for apparently feeding my puppy the wrong stuff. I currently feed her, leanords (sp?) pet mince, rice, and bonnie puppy dry food. The practive manager asked if I would feed this to a twelve week old baby, and of course I wouldn't, to start off with they don't have teeth!

I was told to feed her only bonnie dry food with a little of mince, and to stop feeding her chicken bones during the day, as they form sharp edges and may choke her. I usually give her some kind of bone every day so that her teeth and gums will develop well.

I am so confused as that doesn't seem like a balanced diet to me. Should I start her on BARF and if so, what will that do to her digestive system. She was taken to the vet yesterday with diarrhoea, but I haven't seen anymore. Also what about treating her when training her to sit and stay and come, currently I am using cherios and cheese, not too much cheese and only the light stuff, should I also stop using that? And if I stop using that, what should I use instead?

I want to do the best by my puppy and am upset at the implication that I am not doing so. I try very hard to make sure that she has all the nutrients possible, but whatever I do doesn't seem to be enough. She is very active and has gone from 2.5kg at 8 weeks to 7kg at twelve weeks, so I must be doing something right. I will see how she goes with an evening meal of only bonnie, but I was wondering if I should start to give her puppy milk in the morning with weetbix.

Please help, I am at a loose end completely.

This is a picture of her tonight, so you can all see that she isn't starving, though excuse the state of the pillow, she has taken to carrying it in the dirt.

[Toohey]

That diet sounds OK to me.

I have always fed chicken wings from 8 weeks of age without a problem.

You could try adding some raw minced vegies to his mince, occasionally yoghurt, apple cider vinegar would do wonders for his gut bugs, and occasionally things like raw eggs with the shell included but crushed, and tinned sardines. Vary it up throughout the week and you should cover all your bases as well as giving him the calcium and other nutrients he needs in a natural form.

You can use dry puppy food as well. Perhaps for breakfast and a bedtime snack.

Box one biscuits are also good for teeth.

Why not try him on some liver treats for training.

[larns]

She doesn't seem to like liver treats much, often rolls them around in her mouth and then spits them out.

[~Midniara~]

I have NO IDEA what your vet was talking about. That diet sound FINE to me. I would also add some veggies to it and then your pup will have a complete diet.

My dogs have always eaten similar from 8 weeks and NEVER had any problems.

I worry about what some vets say.

[Cordelia]

Geez! I start my pups on chicken necks at 5wks of age.

The diet she is on sounds fine.

[~Midniara~]

OH, I also forgot to add that I give them yoghurt, sardines, tuna and an egg once per week (crushed with the shell included).

[Staff'n'Toller]

I agree with the others, what you're feeding sounds fine....

If you want to go BARF, I think there are heaps of good links from previous threads on this forum.

I have Dr Billinghursts book 'Give your dog a bone' and I found it to be pretty good.

There is a puppy version by the same author 'Grow your pup with bones'.

Others may have some good book suggestions- these are the only ones I know about.

Mel.

Edited to say: I give my adult dogs the egg whole- they just love to break into it, eat the contents, then they eat the shell too!

Edited December 7, 2004 by StaffordsRule

[Rozzie]

Excuse ignorance... what are Cheerios?

[larns]

Cheerios are like little sausages from the deli section of the supermarket.

Thanks for your replies, I feel a little better about it all now. The practice manager said she doesn't understand why we domesticate dogs and then expect them to eat raw things like they do in the wild.

[Staff'n'Toller]

Ask your practice manager to explain physiologically how the digestive system of the dog is different to the wolf. Because I would like to know myself!! LOL

I've heard that said before.....great marketing strategy to sell more dry food.

Buy your practice manager 'Give your dog a bone' for Christmas methinks

Mel.

[Toohey]

Rozzie, cocktail frankfurts are called cheerios in QLD

[NorthernStarPits]

LARNS, holly s#%t!! your pup looks just like my ridgy X pup,WOW. , your feeding reigeme looks great to me instead of feeling confused just get as much info on everything possible to do with dogs health/nutrition/grooming/ he-he which is what your doing and just pick what you feel you agree with and run with it (making small adjustments here "n" there to suit) then you'll never ever be confused ever again.. PS what breed/s your pup again?..

[Guest cloverfdch]

Vets will tell you anything to get you to buy the commercial food they sell these days . The diet you have your pup on sounds fine. Oh and by the way your Pup is beautiful .

[bommy]

Hi larns,

The only thing I would take out is the Bonnie dry food. My vet didnt know much about BARF until I broached him about in an attempt at looking at ways to boost Major's immune system, after hours of research he gave it a thumbs up the only thing he requested is I worm regularly (which I do anyways). Major was 4mths at the time & we havent looked backwards with it, Is your vet actually in Blackwater or Emerald? (sorry cant remember Blackwaters VET situation). Raw chicken bones are fine for puppies, I always cut mine into 3 sections for the puppies though, until they get used to chewing the bones, also if you freeze your bones I always defrost in the fridge never use the microwave.

Good luck Jacqui

[SamAdams]

whoa... My idea of Cheerios, is a Cereal sold in the US... anybody else heard of the Cereal Cheerios. sorry i know this is off but it is just so funny, i didn't know they were anything but Cereal...

[Wiz's Mum]

Excuse ignorance... what are Cheerios?

Cocktail frankfurts or little boys depending on what state you're from

The diet sounds fine - but if you ask around vets you will generally get as many differnet opinions as those you asked.

[larns]

Sorry, can't help anymore with the cheerio explanation, never heard of them being a cereal though.

Sirmonsta, could you post a pic of your pup, we were told that Roxy was a mastiffxLab, though you can see why we don't really think so. By the way, how big does a ridgy get?

My other feeding question is, should I be putting more beef raw meat in as well? So that she doesn't become anaemic? I started to put yoghurt in, and boy does she love that, how often should I be giving that to her?

Bommy, why should I be taking out the Bonnie dry food? beside the fact that she doesn't eat it?

Thanks so much for the reassurance, I was getting pretty worried that all wasn't right with her system, although she has been pretty active the whole time, doing usual puppy things and getting into everything she can

Thanks again.

P.S. The vet is based in Emerald but also has an office in Blackwater. There is only one other vet in Blackwater, and he gives me the creeps.

Edited December 7, 2004 by larns

[Steve]

My pups start eating raw meaty bones at 3 weeks Their Mum chews em up for them and then vomits them back all warm and crushed By the time they are 5 weeks old they work over a neck or a wing pretty well all on their own. I dont feed any commercial food at all. I think bonnie is crap and its made from the same stuff Max's cat litter is made from The rice hulls that are left over after manufacturing and processing rice for human consumption Its why Bonnie started a pet food company in the first place.

Here's some links Get educated and then when a vet manager wants to try to sell you on what they say they know let em have it. Ian Billinghursts Give your dog a Bone is available from his website or from any good library.

http://www.bluegrace.com/barf.html

http://www.rawmeatybones.com/

http://www.barfworld.com/html/learn_more/barf_pups.shtml

http://www.barfworld.com/main.shtml

http://www.barfers.com/bigpicture.html

[bommy]

Bommy, why should I be taking out the Bonnie dry food? beside the fact that she doesn't eat it?

Hi Larns

Steve has basically advised you on what I believe about Bonnie as well, I have a link somewhere about fillers in commercial dog food when I find it I'll post it for you. But basically if you give a fully balanced barf diet there is no need for dry kibble based products as some of the ones out there are "fillers" & depending on what is in them can be doing more harm than good for your dogs. Since swapping from a kibble based to full BARF we have noticed our dogs toileting is 100% better & the poos turn white & blow away in 24hrs, where as with kibble we had to pick it up daily as it didnt decompose as fast.

As an example for a BARF diet, we went through this with our vet & this is what we feed,

CHICKEN:

Minced chicken

Chicken winkgs,necks & backs

Chicken giblets

Chicken feet

Beef:

mince,

(larger bones for recreation through the day)

Ox tongue & tail

Offal

Lamb:

Mince

Flaps

offal

Fish:

sardines or tuna (canned or fesh)

Vegetables (raw)

any green leafy vegies

Bananas

1 Avocado/week

Eggs 1/day/dog

Yoghurt daily.

we alternate the different meat & fish varieties around on a weekly basis to give variety.

But honestly as long as your baby is performing on your diet & its not harmful to them (ie no chocolate or other dangerous to dog foods) you should feed what you are comfortable with.

Edited December 7, 2004 by bommy

[larns]

Thanks again,

I would just like to report that for the first time ever, Roxy ate all her breakfast at amazing speed, even the bonnie which is an absolute first. She also had the liver treats for a change. I really think it might have something to do with the yoghurt I put on her meal, I think it might spice it up a bit for her.

Thanks Bommy and Steve for that info, I will definately be looking into that today. I appreciate the time you take to educate those that need some help.

Thanks again.

Larns