5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 (edited) Hey Guys, Just wanting some opinions on what you expect from a groomer... Lab owners expecially... Ok, so Mackenzie (my 22 month old black lab) is a bit crazy... She reminds me of Marley from the book/movie actually... So I accept that she's difficult to groom... But I really was expecting more from a pro groomer than what I could myself... I took her to a groomer specifically because she had a lot of her winter coat left, and everytime my wife and I try to brush her, she decides it's time to play... So I decided to bite the bullet and get her professionally done, as she also needed her feet trimmed... So I take her down, drop her off... 3 hours later, I pick her up... She's been bathed, but the dead fur is literally visably hanging off her, if I pat her I get fur in between my fingers, and she doesn't look like she's brushed at all... They did a good job on her feet, but they also clipped her whiskers, which I didn't ask to be done, and I liked her better with the longer whiskers... When I picked her up, they told me she'd been a bit of a handful, and suggested obediance training... So I get the feeling they put her in the too-hard basket, and only did half the job... To top it all off, now when I'm out of her sight, she does this panicked bark that I've never heard her do before and so this just adds to my disappointment... The bottom line is, I forked out $35 more (i.e $60 for the groom) than what I would've paid to do it myself, and to be honest, I think I could've done the same level of work with her... Were/are my expectations too high? Is it my fault for not having her obedience trained? While she's crazy, we don't have a great deal of trouble getting her to do what we want her to... She sits on command (both verbally and by clicking my fingers), shakes on command, she doesn't come inside unless invited... So I don't know that she does have an obedience problem, she's just very energetic, and wants to play the whole time... Everything's a toy to her... Which is the problem when I groom her... Is it just that the groomer was expecting a docile lab and got a crazy one? All opinions welcome guys! And if anyone can suggest a groomer in Penrith for future reference? In case I decide to have her pro groomed again in the future... Edited November 21, 2009 by 5tumpy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gayle. Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 It sounds to me like she has an obedience problem, if she can't behave herself while she's being groomed. While sitting and shaking on command are admirable traits, they can also easily be taught to 8 week old puppies but that does not make them obedient, or obedience trained. $35 is fairly cheap, I'd think....I would expect to pay more for a fullgrown medium/large breed who's coat is shedding and has never been professionally groomed before. So I don't know that she does have an obedience problem, she's just very energetic, and wants to play the whole time... Everything's a toy to her... Which is the problem when I groom her... You are making excuses for her. At 22 months, she should be able to stand quietly while being bathed and brushed. She's been allowed to get away with bad behaviour so far, and she probably thinks it *is* all a big game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavmad Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Get someone to come to your house and do it next time and then you can see exactly what the deal is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Having done grooming before, it can be VERY difficult to bathe and brush a large dog who is bouncing off the walls. Who refuses to get into the bath, freaks out in the bath and tries to jump out (difficult to hold a 30kg+dog in the bath and bathe them at the same time by yourself!) and then bounces around while you try to dry and brush them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 It sounds to me like she has an obedience problem, if she can't behave herself while she's being groomed. While sitting and shaking on command are admirable traits, they can also easily be taught to 8 week old puppies but that does not make them obedient, or obedience trained. Yeah fair enough... But sitting and shaking is only one example I gave... Like I also said, but you neglected to quote... She is predominantly an outside dog, but is allowed inside when we're home etc... If we open the back door for something else, she does not come in unless invited... If my wife or I tell her to do something, she does it... The only exception to that is grooming... She hates being brushed, she hates being bathed... I thought a pro would be able to overcome this... $35 is fairly cheap, I'd think....I would expect to pay more for a fullgrown medium/large breed who's coat is shedding and has never been professionally groomed before. Again, you only seem to have half my post... I said i paid $35 more than what I would have paid to do it myself, i.e $60... You are making excuses for her. At 22 months, she should be able to stand quietly while being bathed and brushed. She's been allowed to get away with bad behaviour so far, and she probably thinks it *is* all a big game. Thanks for your opinion... Although I personally think you're being uneccesarily harsh... But then again, when you're a perfect dog owner as you obviously are, I guess it's hard to understand that others might not be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisovar Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 A bit unrealistic yes, but many expect miracles from the Groomers or the Vets when they have an untrained dog. The coat thing, well, you normally wont get rid of it all in one sitting, a hydro bath and a dry will loosen up the dead coat and it will be surfacing, so that is something to consider. If she had come to me I would have charged you a lot more than $35 especially if I had to wrestle with her to get her done. I don't need my clients to be able to shake hands, but standing calmly for grooming is very helpful. For $35 in many places you would get a bath for a lab full stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 (edited) It is still cheap and if your dog was a handful they probably gave up instead of spending hours for that small amount of money trying to settle your dog. A pro groomer can not magically train your dog in a couple of hours - that is up to you to do. THe most they can do is try and wrestle the dog about which is 1) unsafe for them and 2) highly stressful for your animal. By this age she should be handlable, standing still and able to be groomed properly without wiggling. She's not a baby anymore and active is no excuse - I have a breed that can run rings around most other dogs and yet when she needs a groom, bath, nail grind, vet etc there is no issues it is done safely and quickly. I say enrol in obedience if you havnt already and start laying down some more rules for the dog. Start handling like you would a puppy every day and praise for calm behavior only never praise when she's over excited. Edited November 21, 2009 by Nekhbet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss B Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 She hates being brushed, she hates being bathed... I thought a pro would be able to overcome this... Was she taught, as a pup, to accept these things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 Having done grooming before, it can be VERY difficult to bathe and brush a large dog who is bouncing off the walls. Who refuses to get into the bath, freaks out in the bath and tries to jump out (difficult to hold a 30kg+dog in the bath and bathe them at the same time by yourself!) and then bounces around while you try to dry and brush them. Yeah... I totally understand what you're saying, but surely it's not unreasonable to expect a pro to be able to handle my ~30kg lab? I have little doubt that this is what she did... But it's their job... I work in tech support, if I have a customer who's a bit difficult, I don't hang up on them... Know what I mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 A bit unrealistic yes, but many expect miracles from the Groomers or the Vets when they have an untrained dog.The coat thing, well, you normally wont get rid of it all in one sitting, a hydro bath and a dry will loosen up the dead coat and it will be surfacing, so that is something to consider. If she had come to me I would have charged you a lot more than $35 especially if I had to wrestle with her to get her done. I don't need my clients to be able to shake hands, but standing calmly for grooming is very helpful. For $35 in many places you would get a bath for a lab full stop. It is still cheap and if your dog was a handful they probably gave up instead of spending hours for that small amount of money trying to settle your dog.A pro groomer can not magically train your dog in a couple of hours - that is up to you to do. THe most they can do is try and wrestle the dog about which is 1) unsafe for them and 2) highly stressful for your animal. By this age she should be handlable, standing still and able to be groomed properly without wiggling. She's not a baby anymore and active is no excuse - I have a breed that can run rings around most other dogs and yet when she needs a groom, bath, nail grind, vet etc there is no issues it is done safely and quickly. I say enrol in obedience if you havnt already and start laying down some more rules for the dog. Start handling like you would a puppy every day and praise for calm behavior only never praise when she's over excited. That's guys for the honest posts, without judging and being rude... Sounds like we'll have to get her trained then... Can anyone recommend a trainer in the Penrith region? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 yes but do you have to wrestle the customer into a bathtub and then try and hold them in there, then stick them under a blow dryer while they're bouncing about I held a large dog once for a needle, the dog bounced up and I ended up at the osteo, on strong meds and a week off work you can't always talk a dog into submission like you would a person. And some dogs, if they dont want to well you can have 5 people and they still wont! They were not paid to obedience train your dog, they were paid to groom it. People dont ring tech support then keep you on the phone for 2-3 hours asking you to solve their personal problems as well as their tech problems? What would you tell them? Sorry sir/maam that is not my job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 yes but do you have to wrestle the customer into a bathtub and then try and hold them in there, then stick them under a blow dryer while they're bouncing aboutI held a large dog once for a needle, the dog bounced up and I ended up at the osteo, on strong meds and a week off work you can't always talk a dog into submission like you would a person. And some dogs, if they dont want to well you can have 5 people and they still wont! They were not paid to obedience train your dog, they were paid to groom it. People dont ring tech support then keep you on the phone for 2-3 hours asking you to solve their personal problems as well as their tech problems? What would you tell them? Sorry sir/maam that is not my job Point taken... Thanks again for the advice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisovar Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Having done grooming before, it can be VERY difficult to bathe and brush a large dog who is bouncing off the walls. Who refuses to get into the bath, freaks out in the bath and tries to jump out (difficult to hold a 30kg+dog in the bath and bathe them at the same time by yourself!) and then bounces around while you try to dry and brush them. Yeah... I totally understand what you're saying, but surely it's not unreasonable to expect a pro to be able to handle my ~30kg lab? I have little doubt that this is what she did... But it's their job... I work in tech support, if I have a customer who's a bit difficult, I don't hang up on them... Know what I mean? Grooming dogs is such a joy, it is taxing on your body at the best of times, and the risk of injury whist dealing with big dogs is always there. I now refuse difficult dogs. The Groomers job is to Groom your dog, not train it or wrestle with it. How would you like a PRO to manage your dog?? Maybe string it up in a grooming stand so it cannot move, sedate it or simply wrestle it. You don't expect a hairdresser to chase a toddler around the salon and sit on it whilst it is kicking and screaming and attempt to cut it's hair. If only grooming could be done over the phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
becks Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Stumpy, I'm going to let you into a secret! Groomers do NOT have a magic wand they can wave to calm a dog who is over excitable and never been TAUGHT to stand still and behave while being groomed. Groomers 'groom' dogs, we aren't being paid to also train your dog to behave. I also own a large and active breed that is a trimmed breed. Even as pups they are taught to stand still and let me get on with my work on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gayle. Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Thanks for your opinion... Although I personally think you're being uneccesarily harsh... But then again, when you're a perfect dog owner as you obviously are, I guess it's hard to understand that others might not be... You asked for opinions, I gave you mine based on your post. Did you just want everyone to agree with you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 Grooming dogs is such a joy, it is taxing on your body at the best of times, and the risk of injury whist dealing with big dogs is always there. I now refuse difficult dogs.The Groomers job is to Groom your dog, not train it or wrestle with it. How would you like a PRO to manage your dog?? Maybe string it up in a grooming stand so it cannot move, sedate it or simply wrestle it. You don't expect a hairdresser to chase a toddler around the salon and sit on it whilst it is kicking and screaming and attempt to cut it's hair. If only grooming could be done over the phone. Yeah, fair enough, perhaps my expectations we too high, hence the whole reason for this thread... Maybe my girl a total nutcase and badly behaved... But I assumed, evidently incorrectly, that my dog's behaviour wasn't unusual and that the groomer would have strategies to counter her behaviour... I'm not shirking my responsibility for having her trained, in fact, I've just asked for recommendations for trainers... I love my dog want her to be happy and healthy, she's come back the unhappiest I've ever seen her, and as such, perhaps I'm reacting emotionally and unfairly towards the groomer, but I will definitely do whatever I can to get her over her issues with being groomed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 Thanks for your opinion... Although I personally think you're being uneccesarily harsh... But then again, when you're a perfect dog owner as you obviously are, I guess it's hard to understand that others might not be... You asked for opinions, I gave you mine based on your post. Did you just want everyone to agree with you? No one in this thread has agreed with me... At the same time, no one else took an arrogant, condescending tone either... It's that I took offence too, not your opinion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogsfevr Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Having done grooming before, it can be VERY difficult to bathe and brush a large dog who is bouncing off the walls. Who refuses to get into the bath, freaks out in the bath and tries to jump out (difficult to hold a 30kg+dog in the bath and bathe them at the same time by yourself!) and then bounces around while you try to dry and brush them. Yeah... I totally understand what you're saying, but surely it's not unreasonable to expect a pro to be able to handle my ~30kg lab? I have little doubt that this is what she did... But it's their job... I work in tech support, if I have a customer who's a bit difficult, I don't hang up on them... Know what I mean? If it is so easy you wouldnt have to seek help.The groomer did there job it seems you have no idea about a lab coat & the shedding it does Labs shed all year by the bucket loads,if it hasnt been done properly for along time you can only get so much out fist go,Now the dog has been bathed & brushed through it will shed more for the next month as the coat has been stimulated to fall out,its now up to you to start brushing . People seem to have little respect for what a groomer has to tolerate & think its such an easy job. Grooming a lab should be easy but an untrained lab that has no clue isnt easy to handle & even the best of groomers will struggle with adog that has no concept of whats expected. Groomers are there to groom,not also teach obedience,manners & whats expected in 3 hrs. Your dog is 22 months old & you still have trouble brushing yet you expect a groomer to perform miracles in 3 hrs. Yes the groomer may have given up a tad simply BECAUSE you dog wasnt dealing well,It comes a point even as a groomer that you cant push the ability of the dog in one hit.An overwhelmed dog is very hard work & an experience that isnt pleasant for them either plus having to build a trust in the person attempting to do all the things they wont allow there owner to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5tumpy Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 Thanks guys for the honest posts, for the few who did it without judging and being rude...Sounds like we'll have to get her trained then... Can anyone recommend a trainer in the Penrith region? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretel Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Penrith Kennel and Obedience Club train at Erskine Park on Wednesday evenings and Sunday mornings at Werrington. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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