yap Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Or did the other dog have a bad start, ( got more than the usual attention when it was sick or something happened to it?) They develop dominate behaviours if their fused over obsesively by their owners unfortunately when they are not well. fine line I kinow. Its a long road to correct that behaviour. baby steps. Every new member introduced slowly. Give all equall attention. do not give extra attention to pup. I wouldn't let the older dog fight or be rough with him thats not on. Remember you are the leader of the pack! Good Luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodoggies2001 Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Whenever we have had two dogs at the same time it has always been males by personal choice. Schnauzers are 'talkers'. Some more than most. We have never had any trouble introducing a new puppy when the need arose in the past and honestly, nothing special was ever done. There will be growling at times but I think that is just a teaching thing from the older resident dog. We have had that in the past but there was not a time when we had to separate the two because of this. My younger dog at the moment 'talks' with soft growls, and to some people this is mistaken for aggression. That's just the way he is and you are , I am sure, able to distinguish between a "I mean business' growl to an educational or play growl. The older boy is most likely teaching him the ropes. Honestly, unless there is true aggression, from either side, I wouldn't interfere, let them eat together, play together etc., but give puppy time out to catch up on his much needed sleep for now. You want them to be great mates and bond and this will come in time and they will protect and look out for each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 I'm not sure whether its jealousy or not, the older dog doesnt seem to display any signs of it except for the barking and growling last night - that i'm not sure is jealousy either. If you're not sure what the cause is, the best bet IMO is to fall back on monitoring and treating behaviour. You can ignore any emotional cause for the moment and just concentrate on rewarding behaviour that you like. Seeing as the older dog isn't entirely sure of this puppy business, I would for the moment aim to prevent him from doing things you don't want him to keep doing. So if he starts growling at the puppy or chasing him down, put a stop to that and separate for a bit until everyone has calmed. For all you know it could be self-reinforcing, and if that's the case, the more he practices it the harder it will be to change down the track. It's a thin line, but to me the aim is to let the dogs sort themselves out where they are just getting to know each other, but not let one dog harass, pester, or frighten the other. It's not always easy to tell what's a dog learning boundaries with another dog and what's a dog learning to bully another dog. I say err on the side of caution. BTW, I have two boys. :D They are great together, playing rough contact sports, digging holes, chasing ducks in the mud, finding disgusting things to eat/roll in, striking up wrestling games in inappropriate places, generally getting very wet and dirty together... It's great fun. :D My older boy is a social butterfly and was over the moon when we got him a puppy, but he's such a good big brother. The pair are best buddies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 Ok thanks all for the helpful advice. We keep it in mind when dealing with them. so far so good today so its turned out to be a pretty good day.. but not over yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55chevy Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 The two boys are okay this morning. The older dog a bit of growling at first but stopped quickly. Not really sure what triggered the change in behaviour yesterday. The little one still wants to pounce on the big one and that is annoying the big one a bit. Hope it will be better today, the older dog is still not completely relaxed when the pup is in sight but is accepting. Although what you're experiencing now probably isn't gender related are you prepared for the fact that it might be later on? What made you go out and get another male rather than a female? Worse fights I have ever seen are female/female or a dominant female attacking a male. I prefer males together any day, they seem to sort out their differences less aggressively and don't hold a grudge as easily :D There are exeptions to the rule, but males together is not destined to result in fighting at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55chevy Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 My middle boy 3years old at the time wasn't overly fond of small dogs and puppies, we knew that when introducing our puppy and kept the 3 year old on leash and the pup in the crate. The 3 year old attempted to growl and lunge at the crate on the initial introduction and was corrected for the behaviour. There were 3 incidents in total with the 3 year old and puppy in crate until the boundaries were set. We didn't let the pup and 3 year old interact for a month until he got used to the pup's presence in the crate where they ended up licking each other through the wire acting in a friendly manner. We kept the 3 year old on leash 3 or 4 times in their initial interactions together in the flesh, but a year later today, they are good friends and have never experienced any aggression issues between them todate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 BTW, I have two boys. They are great together, playing rough contact sports, digging holes, chasing ducks in the mud, finding disgusting things to eat/roll in, striking up wrestling games in inappropriate places, generally getting very wet and dirty together... It's great fun. My older boy is a social butterfly and was over the moon when we got him a puppy, but he's such a good big brother. The pair are best buddies. Two boys here also :D This ^^^^^ is exactly what mine are like :D One is a 14 week old puppy and the other 8 years old. So far they are great buddies and play all the time. I separate them when I am out so the older dog is not hounded by the puppy, and so the puppy learns to be on his own. I'll probably do that for 6 to 8 months until the puppy well and truly knows the rules inside the house and then he'll get free reign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 i think i spotted whats aggravating my older dog - one of the reasons anyway. Its the pup crying. The pup is still crying since leaving the breeder. A lot less than initially and mostly at night. He is so tired but cries when we leave the room at night. We have been trying to ignore it but he is very persistent and goes on and on and on...... The older dog tolerates it until the puppy does it in his face and then he snaps. I'm trying to correct the behaviour of the older dog by offering treats which settles him down. But i can't seem to get the pup to stop the whinning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnauzer Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 i think i spotted whats aggravating my older dog - one of the reasons anyway. Its the pup crying. The pup is still crying since leaving the breeder. A lot less than initially and mostly at night. He is so tired but cries when we leave the room at night. We have been trying to ignore it but he is very persistent and goes on and on and on......The older dog tolerates it until the puppy does it in his face and then he snaps. I'm trying to correct the behaviour of the older dog by offering treats which settles him down. But i can't seem to get the pup to stop the whinning. If you are treating the older dog when he is snapping at your puppy you are rewarding his bad behaviour. Your pup will be missing his mum and littermates but will settle down in the next few days. Schnauzers ususally tolerate pups/other dogs very well. Give your older dog some time out from the puppy following him around by putting the pup in a puppy pen for a while. Supervise them when together and in a couple of days they will be playing non stop. Where is the pup sleeping at night? If your pup is crying, ensure that he is in a warm place - can you crate him in your room near you? You will then find he should sleep until he wants to go out to toilet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Yes, I found that crating my puppy in the bedroom made for a good nights sleep from the first night. He whined for 10 minutes the first night, 5 minutes the second night and not since. I also found putting a large soft toy in his crate for him to snuggle into helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 (edited) If you are treating the older dog when he is snapping at your puppy you are rewarding his bad behaviour. Your pup will be missing his mum and littermates but will settle down in the next few days. Schnauzers ususally tolerate pups/other dogs very well. Give your older dog some time out from the puppy following him around by putting the pup in a puppy pen for a while. Supervise them when together and in a couple of days they will be playing non stop. Where is the pup sleeping at night? If your pup is crying, ensure that he is in a warm place - can you crate him in your room near you? You will then find he should sleep until he wants to go out to toilet. What i'm doing is if he is snappy, i call him over to the treat table and ask him in a excited voice "where's puppy", he usually settles down when i get to the treat table and he would touch his nose on the puppy and then i treat. He totally forgets by that stage he was growling. Puppy's bed is nice and comfy with lots of soft fleecy blankets. Oh and he has a soft animal that is soft with him. He sleeps just outside my room. It seems he wants my presence until he falls asleep or too tired to move......it takes him a couple of minutes to fall asleep, should i stay with him or am i encouraging the whinning in the future? Edited November 19, 2010 by giraffez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnauzer Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 i think i spotted whats aggravating my older dog - one of the reasons anyway. Its the pup crying. The pup is still crying since leaving the breeder. A lot less than initially and mostly at night. He is so tired but cries when we leave the room at night. We have been trying to ignore it but he is very persistent and goes on and on and on......The older dog tolerates it until the puppy does it in his face and then he snaps. I'm trying to correct the behaviour of the older dog by offering treats which settles him down. But i can't seem to get the pup to stop the whinning. If you are treating the older dog when he is snapping at your puppy you are rewarding his bad behaviour. Your pup will be missing his mum and littermates but will settle down in the next few days. Schnauzers ususally tolerate pups/other dogs very well. Give your older dog some time out from the puppy following him around by putting the pup in a puppy pen for a while. Supervise them when together and in a couple of days they will be playing non stop. Where is the pup sleeping at night? If your pup is crying, ensure that he is in a warm place - can you crate him in your room near you? You will then find he should sleep until he wants to go out to toilet. What i'm doing is if he is snappy, i call him over to the treat table and ask him in a excited voice "where's puppy", he usually settles down when i get to the treat table and he would touch his nose on the puppy and then i treat. He totally forgets by that stage he was growling. Puppy's bed is nice and comfy with lots of soft fleecy blankets. He sleeps just outside my room. It seems he wants my presence until he falls asleep or too tired to move......it takes him a couple of minutes to fall asleep, should i stay with him or am i encouraging the whinning in the future? I still don't think I would be rewarding that behaviour. When the dog is very calm with the puppy and has not growled at him for a long period of time, I would reward the "good boy" behaviour. If the pup only cries for a few minutes you will find that it should stop in the next week or so when he settles in. Maybe a good idea to crate him near you if that is possible - where is your older dog sleeping - Is it possible that the pup wants to be near him and that's why he is whining? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 If the pup only cries for a few minutes you will find that it should stop in the next week or so when he settles in. Maybe a good idea to crate him near you if that is possible - where is your older dog sleeping - Is it possible that the pup wants to be near him and that's why he is whining? The older dog has the sofa which is very close to his bed. Unlikely he wants to be near the older dog as he only whines louder when i walk out the room. I thought it may be he is scared of the dark so i turn on the light closest to him but he still cries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnauzer Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 If the pup only cries for a few minutes you will find that it should stop in the next week or so when he settles in. Maybe a good idea to crate him near you if that is possible - where is your older dog sleeping - Is it possible that the pup wants to be near him and that's why he is whining? The older dog has the sofa which is very close to his bed. Unlikely he wants to be near the older dog as he only whines louder when i walk out the room. I thought it may be he is scared of the dark so i turn on the light closest to him but he still cries. He is only a baby in an unfamiliar environment - he will get used to it. I would crate the pup near you in your room, so that he settles down and not be leaving him unsupervised with the older dog at night. Also, you will find that crating him will make it easier for you to toilet train him so that when he stirs at night you will hear him and be able to take him outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 He is only a baby in an unfamiliar environment - he will get used to it.I would crate the pup near you in your room, so that he settles down and not be leaving him unsupervised with the older dog at night. Also, you will find that crating him will make it easier for you to toilet train him so that when he stirs at night you will hear him and be able to take him outside. Thanks schnauzer, i hope so too. We block his bed out from the older dog so that he can't get to it. As for toilet training, he has his big brother to thank (and so do we), he knows he has to go outside for that Haven't had an issue with that (yet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnauzer Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Wow, what a good puppy. Stop worrying and enjoy him - they will be fine. Piccies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 Wow, what a good puppy. Stop worrying and enjoy him - they will be fine. Piccies? Thanks, yeah he is a good boy. Thats the problem with being a mum - worry too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kynta Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Wow - too cute! Good luck with your boys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giraffez Posted November 19, 2010 Author Share Posted November 19, 2010 Wow - too cute! Good luck with your boys. Thanks kynta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monah Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 They are gorgeous! Not much to add really, some great advice already! try not to stress too much, don't rush it or expect them to be 'best friends' so quickly. It may take them a long time to bond, .take it nice and slowly. Mainly, keep the puppy safe, make sure the older dog has quiet and me time and is not hassled too much. Be patient with the crying etc. and be very aware, ie. dont get sucked into, Oh they've been great today' scenario as tomorrow IS another day. always supervise. Eventually they will get used to each other and it may take several months for them to be good friends, or only several days. Every dog is different. They appear to be behaving pretty normally to me for first days.. I've also found that often an older dog will be 'fine' with a pup until the dog realises this thing is now STAYING here!! not 'visiting'!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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