Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 Thank you all so much - I can finally stop worrying that I should feel bad (but kinda don't). I appreciate your suggestions and Mrs RB, am just looking at the harness link now. I actually took her out of a harness and put her into a half choker, simply because in fear (especially when there were offlead dogs) she would pull back violently in an attempt to get away, and Houdini her way out of it. Is it possible a dog could slip this one? She is a chronic slipper, however I find has gotten better in that respect after I taught her to sit if she was afraid, rather than simply pull back and run. The problem is, that at just near 40kgs, and full of pure muscle, if she launches (and I'm totally unprepared and have no leverage) chances are I'll still go down, because of her strength and my now scattered centre of gravity. It's only happened three times, because usually I can restrain her - and even when I've gone down or lost leverage, I can still gain enough control for a situation (my fear for her safety and my need to protect her gives me additional strength I think). Generally she is quite a placid dog to walk, it's just when others invade our space (without consideration or warning) that things can sometimes go haywire. We have been rushed many, many times by offlead dogs (about 8 times by the same dog in the space of a few months) and very rarely has Sasha ever had a go back (even when they've come growling). I think after so many times she's just had a gutful of it. That in itself makes me mad, because I have worked so hard to get Sasha to a good point, and people who think they know better and the 'but my dog is friendly and obedient' crew, sadly set her back in progress we make. There is a german shepherd that walks in the area, and is not dog friendly. The owner takes great pains to always ensure he gives other people and dogs space, and always has effective control of the dog. I've seen other people (even though it's quite obvious he is trying to avoid conflict) take their dogs right up to him. I just don't understand. Sometimes people just want to be left alone to walk their dogs in peace, I don't need (or want) Sasha to be friends with every dog, especially when I have no time for people who don't know or won't accept their own dogs limitations. JulesP, he said he will be walking her from now on - but because I want to stay fit during pregnancy, I will go with them too. It's just not the same though as I won't be able to just go when I please, have to wait and fit into his schedule as well. I guess it's only for a few months, but still, it k!lls me!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 Just think of it as some pre baby bonding time with your hubby. Soon enough you will be rushed and trying to fit everything in, for now you can enjoy the relaxing walks with your man and your dog. Yep, that's a good way to look at it!!! He's just not as patient with doggy matters as I am though, so it's more of a 'chore' to him (although he does love her to pieces) - whereas to me it's something I look forward to and enjoy thoroughly (and wish I had the time to walk for miles with her)!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 A dog that was off leash in a public area rushed your dog and a fight broke out because of that, I don't really think there's any other possible way to interpret it other than it being the other person's fault. Exactly. The lady knew she'd been at fault & apologised. I agree with lavendergirl that these kind of problems happen when all sizes of dogs are walked off-lead in a public area. It's the thoughtless human at the end of the non-existent leash, not the size of the dog. Here's hoping the lady learns her lesson & doesn't repeat letting her dog off-lead. A man who walked up our street with an unleashed dog, did. His dog, a large lithe x/breed was left running all around him...& up on people's driveways. I just caught this dog as it sighted Lily the tiny tibbie next door , who was standing inside her side gate. The dog raced up & was poised to jump over, when I yelled 'Stop!' Fortunately, the man followed up with a whistle & the dog took off. If he'd gone over that fence, he would've landed on top of Lily. Next time, that man came up the street, his dog was firmly on a lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 Yes Mita, unfortunately the dogs usually suffer from people's bad decisions. And usually it takes a drastic thing to happen before some people 'get it', and appreciate that not all dogs like each others behaviour. I feel bad that this little dog may become afraid of all other dogs (maybe just big dogs) as a result of this fight, I'm sure it wuold have affected the little dog too... but then, if she'd done the right thing in the first place, then the dog wouldn't have been put in that position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I feel bad that this little dog may become afraid of all other dogs (maybe just big dogs) as a result of this fight, I'm sure it wuold have affected the little dog too... but then, if she'd done the right thing in the first place, then the dog wouldn't have been put in that position. You're right. If the little dog has on-going issues because of the fight, the fault belongs to the lady who left it off-lead. And she knew it. That was the only part that was positive. She actually said so & apologised. In so many of the cases that DOLers post about, it's the person who caused a problem who finishes up abusing the person affected! Which makes me think this lady will never repeat her mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Hi KL The only time my dog looks like slipping out of the harness is when she rolls over on her back and sometimes slips an elbow under it. If she's pulling away from me - which almost never happens - it hooks behind her elbows and discourages effort there. I'm not sure how you'd go with 40kg of lunging dog - but someone I recommended it to went from not being able to walk her Rotti to being able to hold the Rotti with one hand and roll a smoke with the other. It does depend a bit on owner and dog - like all tools - it doesn't work for everyone. Some of the delta dog trainers sell them so you might be able to try one out to help you decide. Otherwise - I guess you'd need to talk to Steve C. This isn't going to be a problem before baby but also after baby ie lunging dog doesn't work well with pram either. And much as I have managed to train my dog not to lunge at cats, there's always something new - eg horse, alpacca, possum... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 The lady knew she'd been at fault & apologised. Actually - under the Civil Liability Act in NSW (and from memory its the same in other states), an apology is not to be taken as an admission of guilt or fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevorne Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I was walking my dog once on a bush track, a dog ran towards me out of the bush, it certainly gave me a scare and stopped and gave us the eye. A minute later the owner came around the corner and said 'Ãt is ok he will not hurt you' I reply 'how do I know that'. Further proof people are inconsiderate and self absorbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) The lady knew she'd been at fault & apologised. Actually - under the Civil Liability Act in NSW (and from memory its the same in other states), an apology is not to be taken as an admission of guilt or fault. I wasn't making a point about the status of her remarks under the law. But it's good that you've posted on that issue. That's very useful information to know for any future incident. And to have a reference to the particular Act. I was referring to KL's feeling of guilt, if the little dog goes on to have some issues. Edited August 17, 2011 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 Thanks Mrs RB, I might email them about it. She's generally so good though, even with cats - that same day a cat jumped out of the bushes at us (it's a little devil who shows no fear of any dog), and she went into the chest down,bum up - but one word from me and she was back to walking (albeit rather excitedly and keeping a close eye that kitty wasn't following). She's a breeze to manage in over excited situations, it's just these negative ones (which are few and far between) that I have trouble with, and not even all of them - she's usually the one who backs down. I find she's more so like that with smaller dogs, I think because she's been rushed by so many of them - only a few bigger dogs. I agree though that having her in that situation with a pram could be equally as messy, I've been thinking about that lately... so will have to think of ways to avoid the possibility of that, seeing that there will always be a plentiful supply of people who don't think the rules apply to them and don't understand dogs much, sadly. I have to admit, I was also surprised (quite pleasantly) that the lady admitted she was in the wrong and apologised - I find it's very rare too. It shows that she does have some level of sense and responsibility, so probably just wasn't thinking clearly that day of what could happen. And I'm glad that she explained it to her daughter, hopefully get some sense into her before she becomes a dog owner of her own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 KL, I wonder if something like this might help you when you are out walking Sasha alone: http://www.k9pro.com.au/products/Dog-Harness-DT-WORKS.html We have one with the GIVE ME SPACE patch. Obviously not foolproof but it helps. And I'd most certianly still use a martingale collar for control. Glad you are both okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 SecretKei That harness doesn't have a front attach point that I can see - so she wouldn't get any extra leverage from the pivot point. A dog would be able to pull very hard in that. I have sometimes clipped the front attach harness to the flat collar for a bit of extra security. And I have sometimes used two leads. One on the harness or flat collar and one on a head halter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 SecretKei That harness doesn't have a front attach point that I can see - so she wouldn't get any extra leverage from the pivot point. A dog would be able to pull very hard in that. I have sometimes clipped the front attach harness to the flat collar for a bit of extra security. And I have sometimes used two leads. One on the harness or flat collar and one on a head halter. I wasn't suggesting that KL use the harness to walk her dog, but rather use one with a GIVE ME SPACE patch attached as a deterrent against unwanted attention from other dogs/strangers. My post: KL, I wonder if something like this might help you when you are out walking Sasha alone: http://www.k9pro.com...s-DT-WORKS.htmlWe have one with the GIVE ME SPACE patch. Obviously not foolproof but it helps. And I'd most certianly still use a martingale collar for control. Glad you are both okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 Definately not your fault. Even if the dog was injured even severly, still not your fault. I am very glad you and your baby are okay and although you will have to share walks I can fully understand why. Won't be long and you will be able to slip out while bub is having some dad time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) Won't be long and you will be able to slip out while bub is having some dad time That's the plan - walking Sasha is my de-stress. I'm actually looking forward to maternity leave when I can take both Little Boy and Sasha out - I find there are less irresponsible people out during the daytimes!!! I'm actually really looking forward to that. Sasha loves kids, so I'm sure she will be thrilled to have one of her 'own' - as long as we do the intros correctly and keep including her in the family bonds. SK, thanks for that link - will look into it and see if it may benefit Sash (and in turn me/us). Edited to add - the martingale has been really good and helped us enormously, and allowed me better control over her... however strength wise the harness was better for me to get leverage of her. I just find it easier and less stressful (and she now actually listens to me much better) in the martingale. I appreciate everyone's help and support :D Edited August 17, 2011 by Kelly_Louise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 SK - I actually think this may be a fabulous idea for Sasha!!!! Plus, gives me some extra leverage with the handle should I need it, rather than yanking at her neck during an emergency. I can use both her lead and the harness handle. My only question is this... if I was to have it with the GIVE ME SPACE patch on it, does that announce that Sasha is a bad or dangerous dog in anyway? Not that I care what people think - but if there was an incident such as this one repeated and she accidentally injured the other dog (which I don't think she would, it's not her nature to hurt - just warn off) would I be liable for having a dog that 'needs space' or that the patch indicates I may lack some control on???? If that makes sense??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogsfevr Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 I would look at other things you can do. I am not sure if you already have a baby but if you don't at home you can still do special things with Sasha. You can practise pushing pram with dog We have encouraged our puppy owners who have bub coming along in adulthood to buy a pretend baby & even practice sitting in chair feeding/cuddling & teaching dog all about these new things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 18, 2011 Author Share Posted August 18, 2011 I would look at other things you can do. I am not sure if you already have a baby but if you don't at home you can still do special things with Sasha. You can practise pushing pram with dog We have encouraged our puppy owners who have bub coming along in adulthood to buy a pretend baby & even practice sitting in chair feeding/cuddling & teaching dog all about these new things Thanks showdog. We have the pram, but it's at my Mum's house atm - but definitely plan on getting her used to walking with it soon. No other babies as yet, doing practice runs with a pretend baby also sounds useful. I'm fairly confident she will be fine - but it's best to be be safe and practice in advance, so it's not a massive change for her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted August 18, 2011 Share Posted August 18, 2011 SK - I actually think this may be a fabulous idea for Sasha!!!! Plus, gives me some extra leverage with the handle should I need it, rather than yanking at her neck during an emergency. I can use both her lead and the harness handle. My only question is this... if I was to have it with the GIVE ME SPACE patch on it, does that announce that Sasha is a bad or dangerous dog in anyway? Not that I care what people think - but if there was an incident such as this one repeated and she accidentally injured the other dog (which I don't think she would, it's not her nature to hurt - just warn off) would I be liable for having a dog that 'needs space' or that the patch indicates I may lack some control on???? If that makes sense??? Not at all, it just tells people to give your dog some space and not to pat her. I have one for my boy and have found it to be very effective, particularly for trips to the school and walking through busy areas. People are generally quite respectful when he is wearing it. It's also great when running him on the long line, in the car, as a tracking harness, for TID work, and yes, the handle is great too. A pretty functional piece if equipment really! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly_Louise Posted August 18, 2011 Author Share Posted August 18, 2011 Thanks SK - I know it may be misunderstood by some of the ferals around my area - but if it also works and makes people show her the consideration she deserves (because she doesn't intrude in people's spaces) - then I think it will be fabulous It will help alleviate my stress as well. After incidents like this I lose confidence for a while Would the large size fit her? She is a big dog, but quite petite (currently just under 40kgs) and built very much like a large Ridgeback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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