Squinter Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Is severe generalised demodectic mange at 16 weeks a reason to return a pup?? I am totally besotted with my pup, my husband is LIVID that the dog is now "useless" (as in cannot ETHICALLY breed from it and cannot show it etc) and is about to cost us a lifetime of skin care. Vet said it was a very severe case with such a fast onset we are in trouble. Advice please.....I don't want to lose my baby but my husband is so angry about the cost of the dog and of course the ongoing costs that are coming when the vet said it is genetic immune suppression... I highly doubt the breeder would want it back anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melinda10786 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I think you should contact the breeder to ask their advice and see what they say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scales of Justice Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) Demodex is treatable and not necessarily a lifetime problem. Consult your vet for treatment or perhaps get a second opinion. All dogs carry demodex as latent, just some react and break out for some reason. Demodex is the result of an immune response, but that does not mean that you will have lifelong issues. It is quite feasible that you could go on with this puppy, after treatment, and for it to have a normal life without recurrence. Edited June 13, 2012 by Scales of Justice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skully Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Our English stafford got generalised mange, a fairly bad case said the vet, just after we got her desexed at 5 months. We had to get injections for her every 5 days for around 8 weeks. it cleared up and her hair grew back and we haven't had a problem since. her's came on very quickly but it's been treated and all good now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 please contact the breeder now ..don't wait until it's decision time . tell them exactly what the vet said ..and maybe ask them to recommend someone for a second opinion...before making a decision based on health . What did you agree with the breeder when buying the pup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Just out of interest what breed/ colour is the pup? Is it on Main Register? If bought as a serious show/breeding prospect, your husband is right. Return it. If you are happy that this pup be a pet only then the prospects of a trouble free future are a lot brighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squinter Posted June 13, 2012 Author Share Posted June 13, 2012 Yes it is on the main reg. I called the breeder as soon as we got home and she recommended a product to use but said it's common and that was about it. Didn't seem to bother her, even when I explained the extent and what the vet said about life long issues and not breeding. She said you can still breed it.. I didn't ask about taking it back or anything then, just wanted to tell her what the vet said and see what she said. We have definitely started treatments, of course. I can message the breed and colour to you Haredown Whippets, I would prefer not to say too much on here in case I get in trouble somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) Yes please on the message but it's only curiosity on my part. Some breeds do seem prone to Dermo after vaccinations so this may be playing a part. When and what has your pup been vaccinated with? Edited June 13, 2012 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Wasn't there a thread a while ago, similiar to this, where the person had purchased a Blue Staffy & had this same problem. Not sure how that one ended up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisovar Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Whilst it is true that Demodex is treatable and many dogs will never suffer from Demodex again generalised Demodex is definitely an far more serious issue and one that should certainly rule out the dog for breeding. Your Vet is correct an animal with generalised Demodex most probably has an inherited immune weakness and I would steer well clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Whilst it is true that Demodex is treatable and many dogs will never suffer from Demodex again generalised Demodex is definitely an far more serious issue and one that should certainly rule out the dog for breeding. Your Vet is correct an animal with generalised Demodex most probably has an inherited immune weakness and I would steer well clear. x2 You may have a good chance of curing the problem and having no more issues once it has grown up... You could even show the dog once the condition is cured BUT you have to consider what you will do if this doesn't happen and you are still fighting this horrible condition in 12 months time. As for "the breeder won't want it back" - if the pup has been purchased as a breeding prospect then it doesn't really matter what the breeder might want - it is not fit for purpose and you would have a very good case for a refund. Generalised Demodex is very serious and no ethical breeder would brush it aside as anything less. (The jury's still out on localised Demodex) Honestly I would take a step back. Of course you love your pup, but do you love the pup more than you love the good relationship with your husband? If the vet thinks this is serious and could be an on going (lifetime) problem then I would suggest a second opinion - ask your vet for suggestions - and reconsider when you have this additional information. I don't think anyone can say for sure if this will be a lifetime problem, but the severity could be an indicator. Sorry you have found yourself in this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Poor little puppy. I've just had a dog with Demodectic Mange, he was OK after 3 months but if you got this puppy for showing then it would be high risk. I'm not sure if it is genetic but you'd have to wonder if any of the other puppies had come down with it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 The person with the blue SBT puppy ended up sending it back and I think the thread got deleted. She wanted to breed and show too so I'm not sure why she got a blue SBT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Send the pup back, get a full refund and find a breeder that actually knows about their breed and most importantly cares. No breeder worth a pinch of salt is going to sell a pup with demodex and tell yout it's fine to breed from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Send the pup back, get a full refund and find a breeder that actually knows about their breed and most importantly cares.<br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: verdana, tahoma, arial, sans-serif; line-height: 18px; background-color: rgb(238, 242, 247); "><br style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: verdana, tahoma, arial, sans-serif; line-height: 18px; background-color: rgb(238, 242, 247); ">No breeder worth a pinch of salt is going to sell a pup with demodex and tell yout it's fine to breed from. *nods* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeebie Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I Had a dog with same situation and by total slow ardous process of elimination discovered (A) it was heralded by a certain puppy shampoo - this was removed and a specialised one used until dog got its adult coat when things improved dramatically,(b) Dog definately was aggravated by diet so a strict control was implemented no grains, no yeast and no colours preserves etc and again we saw a huge difference, he was also treated with anti histamine type medication as I did not want any steriod injections or tablets used, I also applied a very old fasioned horse remedy onto the affected skin (Rawleighs Salve) this is basically petroleum jelly or vaseline with a sulphur compound and a couple other ingredients, and this helped with the irritation preventing the dog scatching and biting, we used an old cotton throw rug with loose ties to shelter him from insects and also to stop him plastering the gel all over the house. He had oral supplements of fish oil and vitamin A, once we got on top of it and maintained the diet etc he never looked back and by 2 yrs old was a totally different dog, but it was very time consuming and a labour of love, never shown and never bred with both could have happened but we just decided as he seemed to be a very easily stressed dog this would only add to the problem. Its a hard call for sure so good luck with this one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squinter Posted June 13, 2012 Author Share Posted June 13, 2012 Thank you everyone. Sandra I think you have hit the nail on the head, I need to step back and think long term- costs, issues, relationship. However my heart is saying the breeder will either put the pup down or breed from it, both of which are hard for me to hear. I want to help it :-( Zeebie, I applaud your dedication to helping a demodex pup, and I really want to help my baby...but I do *sort of* agree with my husband, it was sold to us as a breeding a show dog, and neither can be done. The breeder does not seem to have any issues with passing on hereditary problems, seems to have very limited regard for the health of the breed. This wasn't apparent when we secured the pup. I hope no one else goes through what we are going through. What shampoo were you finding an issue (please message me if needed)? we have slightly altered the diet to exclude types of grain after many readings, we have also made sure no steroids are to be used, I am seeking a second opinion as well but on the hunt for a really SUPER good vet. Fish oil is being added to his diet also after a lot of reading. Heart wrenching. situation to be in. So much time and effort and love given to a pup. I can't bear to be away from it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I would get a second opinion from the breeder's vet. If the prognosis is the same, then definitely return the puppy. Some breeds are prone to localised demodex just around the eyes, as puppies and once treated it goes away for good but others are prone to generalised demodex and that is completely different. I would definitely not breed from a dog with generalised demodex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) The person with the blue SBT puppy ended up sending it back and I think the thread got deleted. She wanted to breed and show too so I'm not sure why she got a blue SBT. If it's the same thread that I am thinking of, said pup went on to have a litter (all blues of course) on her first heat and was on-sold to another "breeder". According to the person who saw the litter, she still had a serious skin condition at the time the pups were 6 weeks old. Yes, the litter was registered. Squinter - yes if you return the pup the breeder might have it PTS. IF the pup is going to have life-long issues with a very painful condition this is probably the best outcome for the pup. Some times there are worse things than death. If you plan on breeding you need to understand that even people who do their best to produce "perfect" pups sometimes get messed with by mother nature and even in the best of breeding programmes there are sometimes pups you cannot save. It would be much more of a concern to me if the breeder bred from or on-sold the pup as happened in the case above, but honestly you have to think of you first and if this is a real concern to you then perhaps you have to make the decision to spay and rehome the pup OR PTS. Edited June 13, 2012 by Sandra777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Crazy Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) I would get a second opinion from the breeder's vet. If the prognosis is the same, then definitely return the puppy. Some breeds are prone to localised demodex just around the eyes, as puppies and once treated it goes away for good but others are prone to generalised demodex and that is completely different. I would definitely not breed from a dog with generalised demodex. Very true dancinbcs. Stella suffered a bout of demodex just around her right eye when she was about 6 months old. With treatment it went away, hair grew back & she hasn't had it again. I however brought her on limited reg. not main reg. Really feel for anyone in this position. Must be heartbreaking if you brought the puppy to breed from down the track. Edited June 14, 2012 by BC Crazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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