persephone Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 (edited) castrating him will lessen the hormone levels , for sure, and may help :) It takes a couple of months for levels to drop right down ...but it will be worth it . As I said earlier- you have your hands more than full ...and now there's more hard work to be done. Get him assessed first .. then make a plan . re: professionals .....please just don't look at websites, or ads in the paper ...often they are a waste of money For a powerful young male who has shown aggression,and unfortunately particularly the breed he is .. ..you really do need to pull out the big names - those very experienced ..and who are not just 'trainers'. Keep us posted after you get an appointment - it will be good to hear how you go :) Edited October 21, 2012 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ann21 Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 My two cents worth: I would go to the professional before castrating esp if it's a choice between the two. The professional could tell you whether the dog is fear aggressive in that case I believe castrating might make things worse rather than better. All the best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Personally, I would have him PTS...going solely on the info provided, I think he sounds like a ticking timebomb. Experience is a good teacher ..., Willow, and , if I had tried everything under the sun , I would do the same however, I really do feel that nothing constructive can be done until the dog /situation is checked personally by someone qualified . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r8chl Posted October 21, 2012 Author Share Posted October 21, 2012 I don't think there is a huge choice up here, but there is a lady up here that trained police dogs for years and now does training and behavior problems, I was going to give her a call tomorrow. I am not interested in just taking him down the park to one of the dog schools at this stage, firstly he would carry on like a nut and I think he needs more specialized treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I don't think there is a huge choice up here, but there is a lady up here that trained police dogs for years and now does training and behavior problems, I was going to give her a call tomorrow. I am not interested in just taking him down the park to one of the dog schools at this stage, firstly he would carry on like a nut and I think he needs more specialized treatment. :) Sounds worth a call ..and I think you are wise in not just taking him to park obedience . Let us know what she says ...good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r8chl Posted October 21, 2012 Author Share Posted October 21, 2012 Oh and he is fantastic with our children, he plays with them really well, he does jump up on them but my girls give him a stern no for that :) They sometimes dress him up and he is fine with that, so I don't think he is all bad and he is good with our cat, tries to play with her even though she wont have a bar of it - while we are looking that is :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r8chl Posted October 21, 2012 Author Share Posted October 21, 2012 Yeah Megan, finding a place to exercise could be a problem, depending on where R8chel lives. I was lucky to be able to find a place near me that was perfect (that said I didn't have to worry about my girl being aggressive toward people, only other dogs). R8chel, there is a very interesting thread on this forum that deals with the exercising of dogs with aggressive tendencies. One of the things I've realised from this thread is that sometimes it's NOT the owners fault the dog is so difficult. All the owners in that thread are dedicated, they put in the time, research and the effort to do the best for their dogs. The fact is that dogs are individuals and sometimes it's not the owners fault (ofc sometimes it is) the dog may simply have bad genetics, it may have had a bad experience that warped it's psychology - sometimes accidents happen, we can't control everything in life. Anyway, you might find some useful ideas and conversation there - I'm particularly interested in some of the training methods like BAT & LAT people use in this thread. It may be a good thread for you to find helpful practical solutions to some of your problems, appropriate training programs and discussions with people who are understanding of your predicament. http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/232274-exercising-reactive-dogs-thread/ In fact that entire Training subforum is a great section to read, so many interesting discussions about dog training there. There are also a few very good behaviourists and trainers who post there too, and they regularly give very good advice to people. http://www.dolforums.com.au/forum/9-training-obedience-dog-sports/ And of course that forum section is home to the absolutely amazing Triangle of Temptation thread, which I'll link again because IMO you can never link it too often. It's such an easy to do training program that produces outstanding results. http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/64101-triangle-of-temptation/ I would urge you to look beyond the people here who are criticising you in this thread, and take into account that there is a community here that can be very helpful. There is the odd prickly personality or two and disagreements will happen - but they happen in every community, both online and offline. Overall though, the discussions and information you can get here can really make all the difference to the way you approach your dog's issues, and help you end up with a great dog that you're proud to own. The amount of knowledge about dogs in general, and my own dog I've gotten from this forum is huge, and I'm profoundly grateful for it. I do hope you will continue to post here and let us know how your appointment with the behaviourist goes and how things are progressing. Will you see Jane Harper? It's actually pretty exciting to get the opportunity to work with an expert professional behaviourist, it's a really fantastic opportunity to learn about dog behaviour and psychology from the best in the field. It's worth every penny when you can get a really good training and behaviour expert to teach you the ropes. Good luck and keep us posted! I will read through these also :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juice Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 You need proffessional help, and not someone from the paper, someone who really knows what they are talking about. You need to spend money, most good trainers want the money upfront. Don't try and skimp on this problem, we are talking about kids and other dogs at risk, this will not go away on its own, in fact he will just up the anti each time. Its not worth the risk. If your cars brakes were failing, you would pay to fix them, not try and do them yourself to save some money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I don't think there is a huge choice up here, but there is a lady up here that trained police dogs for years and now does training and behavior problems, I was going to give her a call tomorrow. I am not interested in just taking him down the park to one of the dog schools at this stage, firstly he would carry on like a nut and I think he needs more specialized treatment. It sounds like you are a long way from Brisbane so this local trainer is probably your best bet for an independant assessment in your home. Castrating him earlier might have helped prevent a lot of these problems and still will if you are going to be able to work with him. In most states it is illegal to have an entire APBT anyway and also illegal to rehome them. Not sure on Qld law though. Barking frantically at other dogs is one step from a full scale attack and if he upsets another dog enough for it to have a go at him he is liable to kill it as the breed will not back down from a challenge. Nipping at children is also one very small step from a full scale attack so please be very careful. Dogs that don't like strange children can be managed in some households but not when you have children who may accidently open a gate or door or bring a friend in. It is good that you don't just want to get rid of a problem dog but with your current situation, if he is going to need far too much time to turn him around it is probably best and safest for everyone if you have him pts. I would much rather people do this than dump the dog at the pound or on someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Could be many reasons for the behaviour - might be as simple as frustration and excess drive, might not, you need a professional to assess the dog, not a diagnosis over the Internet from God knows who. You might need to make a trip to Brisbane. In the meantime I'd suggest that you crate train the dog and crate him inside in a quiet area when the kids have their friends over rather than chaining him (as chaining will build frustration and amplify the behaviour). If you can manage walking muzzle the dog (for safety) and use a weighted backpack which will tire him out faster. http://caninespirit.com.au/categories/canine-backpacks Also have a look here: http://leerburg.com/articles.htm http://leerburg.com/flix/category.php?categoryid=30 Plenty of free articles and vids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 (edited) I checked the QLD regulations and he is a restricted breed that must be desexed and you also need an annual permit to keep him as well as complying with any local council regulations. Since 2008 it has been illegal to breed sell or give away a restricted breed unless it is from a deceased estate or similar special circumstances. Edited October 21, 2012 by dancinbcs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobbly Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 (edited) I don't think there is a huge choice up here, but there is a lady up here that trained police dogs for years and now does training and behavior problems, I was going to give her a call tomorrow. I am not interested in just taking him down the park to one of the dog schools at this stage, firstly he would carry on like a nut and I think he needs more specialized treatment. It can be tough to find specialised services when you live in more regional areas. The police dog lady sounds like she might be a really good first step. I am not sure whether Police Dog trainers would be NDTF accredited? I would tend to assume so, but to be honest I don't know. For additional help and advice you could also call them - http://ndtf.net.au/ I think you're right about about not taking him to the group dog school at this point, it'd just be a nightmare for you both. I remember taking my girl to one of those places when she was at her most crazy adolescent stage, and it was soooo embarrassing. She carried on like a flea, leaping around like a maniac and being a general distraction and annoyance to all and sundry present, the trainer had to spend pretty much all the time with us and I was mortified, being dragged around by my uncontrollable dog and fervently praying that the ground would open up and swallow us. O the bad old days :laugh: But I took my girl to her first group obedience class not so long ago, and she made me so proud. "D Hopefully you get there too! No one can diagnose your boy over the internet, calls to put a beloved pet to sleep without giving the him the chance to be helped by a qualified, good quality behaviourist are unfounded. He needs an in-person assessment by a behaviourist qualified to deal with him, and take it from there. Good luck & let us know what the behaviourist says. Edited October 21, 2012 by Wobbly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mumof4girls Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Ha so the idiot that put a handwritten sign up near us "Purebread " Pitbull pups for sale ready to go now ( ha love that can't even spell it) needs to be reported :-) I will love doing that I checked the QLD regulations and he is a restricted breed that must be desexed and you also need an annual permit to keep him as well as complying with any local council regulations. Since 2008 it has been illegal to breed sell or give away a restricted breed unless it is from a deceased estate or similar special circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lavendergirl Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I think people are missing the point that this is not just a "beloved pet". This is a restricted breed that has shown aggression to children. The OP will be in a bucketload of trouble if this dog is reported to council and she does not have a permit and the dog is not desexed. I don't think people have been negative for pointing out the real risks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobbly Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) Ha so the idiot that put a handwritten sign up near us "Purebread " Pitbull pups for sale ready to go now ( ha love that can't even spell it) needs to be reported :-) I will love doing that You'd love to be responsible for having a litter of puppies killed? (what else do you think will happen to that litter if you report it? If he can't get homes for them his only option is to have them PTS) People's callous attitude towards animals never ceases to amaze me, I didn't expect to see it in a puppy subforum though. I really have no words. What are you actually doing on dog lovers forum anyway? Since you wrote that yesterday morning I assume you have already reported it. Sleep well tonight mumof4girls, secure in the knowledge you have done your best to ensure a litter of innocent puppies will be denied the chance of a loving home and so will almost certainly be put down. I think people are missing the point that this is not just a "beloved pet". This is a restricted breed that has shown aggression to children. The OP will be in a bucketload of trouble if this dog is reported to council and she does not have a permit and the dog is not desexed. I don't think people have been negative for pointing out the real risks. R8chel is clearly a responsible owner as evidenced by the fact she is asking for advice om a dog forum, and has subsequently done the research to find a behaviourist - no easy task when you live in a regional area. The dog is obviously a beloved pet, with an owner determined to do the right thing by him, and he deserves a chance. Yes he's restricted, I'm sure she knows that. And if by some strange chance she didn't it's been pointed out numerous times already. She's asking for behaviour advice, not legal advice. Edited (for about the 50th time) this time to add: sorry if I seem harsh Lavendergirl, but the post prior to yours has really upset me. Edited October 22, 2012 by Wobbly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainers Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Ha so the idiot that put a handwritten sign up near us "Purebread " Pitbull pups for sale ready to go now ( ha love that can't even spell it) needs to be reported :-) I will love doing that You'd love to be responsible for having a litter of puppies killed? (what else do you think will happen to that litter if you report it? If he can't get homes for them his only option is to have them PTS) People's callous attitude towards animals never ceases to amaze me, I didn't expect to see it in a puppy subforum though. I really have no words. What are you actually doing on dog lovers forum anyway? Since you wrote that yesterday morning I assume you have already reported it. Sleep well tonight mumof4girls, secure in the knowledge you have done your best to ensure a litter of innocent puppies will be denied the chance of a loving home and so will almost certainly be put down. So it's not the "breeder" breaking the law that is responsible for these puppies? Just what we need more of, BYB litters of "purebread" pitbulls being sold via a sale sign at the local shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Ha so the idiot that put a handwritten sign up near us "Purebread " Pitbull pups for sale ready to go now ( ha love that can't even spell it) needs to be reported :-) I will love doing that You'd love to be responsible for having a litter of puppies killed? (what else do you think will happen to that litter if you report it? If he can't get homes for them his only option is to have them PTS) People's callous attitude towards animals never ceases to amaze me, I didn't expect to see it in a puppy subforum though. I really have no words. What are you actually doing on dog lovers forum anyway? Since you wrote that yesterday morning I assume you have already reported it. Sleep well tonight mumof4girls, secure in the knowledge you have done your best to ensure a litter of innocent puppies will be denied the chance of a loving home and so will almost certainly be put down. So it's not the "breeder" breaking the law that is responsible for these puppies? Just what we need more of, BYB litters of "purebread" pitbulls being sold via a sale sign at the local shops. Of course it is. I, however, wouldn't be dobbing them in so that the puppies are all PTS. I think that was all Wobbly was getting at . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simply Grand Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yes it would be sad for the puppies to be pts but if no one ever reports these people breeding and selling illegally and they never have to face consequences, how is it ever going to be stopped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Willow Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Yes it would be sad for the puppies to be pts but if no one ever reports these people breeding and selling illegally and they never have to face consequences, how is it ever going to be stopped? I agree. The person reporting the pups isn't at fault. The person who illegaly bred a litter of restricted breed pups is. It's very sad for the pups, but there are worse things than euthanasia....ending up in a "breeding program" of their own, or in the wrong hands with people who want a fighting dog, or chained in a backyard and hidden from the authorities...and eventually siezed and removed from their family and PTS anyway....not a good life eithe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainers Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Yes it would be sad for the puppies to be pts but if no one ever reports these people breeding and selling illegally and they never have to face consequences, how is it ever going to be stopped? I agree. The person reporting the pups isn't at fault. The person who illegaly bred a litter of restricted breed pups is. It's very sad for the pups, but there are worse things than euthanasia....ending up in a "breeding program" of their own, or in the wrong hands with people who want a fighting dog, or chained in a backyard and hidden from the authorities...and eventually siezed and removed from their family and PTS anyway....not a good life eithe That's how I feel. It's sad, but that's what happens if you do the wrong thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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