Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I think I have confused people by calling the Sporn Halter a harness when it is actually a halter. Though it isn't really like a harness or a halter. It has a collar that goes around the dog's neck, but it sits further down the neck near the shoulders. And the two sherpa loops (where the dog's front legs go through) are attached to the collar and sit snugly under the armpits. Also the lead is attached to the back of the neck near the shoulders (someone mentioned that it was attached to the front of the chest). My sporn doesn't have a collar, it merely has the loops under the legs and the lead attaches to the back like a normal harness. Perhaps we should make it clear in this thread which Sporn product we are talking about (when we are talking about it)? Mine has a collar and it is called a Sporn Halter. They both work on the same "under the arm" concept to help stop leash pulling, mines just minus the collar because my fattys have chunky necks and the collars were too small for them. I might have to get one of those for Frankenpuggie. He pulls like anything in his Puppia harness and he is a determined little bugger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) Oops, double post. Edited November 23, 2012 by Labradork Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I think I have confused people by calling the Sporn Halter a harness when it is actually a halter. Though it isn't really like a harness or a halter. It has a collar that goes around the dog's neck, but it sits further down the neck near the shoulders. And the two sherpa loops (where the dog's front legs go through) are attached to the collar and sit snugly under the armpits. Also the lead is attached to the back of the neck near the shoulders (someone mentioned that it was attached to the front of the chest). My sporn doesn't have a collar, it merely has the loops under the legs and the lead attaches to the back like a normal harness. Perhaps we should make it clear in this thread which Sporn product we are talking about (when we are talking about it)? Mine has a collar and it is called a Sporn Halter. They both work on the same "under the arm" concept to help stop leash pulling, mines just minus the collar because my fattys have chunky necks and the collars were too small for them. I might have to get one of those for Frankenpuggie. He pulls like anything in his Puppia harness and he is a determined little bugger. That's why I got the Sporn, I had Max in a Puppia from when she was tiny and they just encourage pulling because they can lean all their weight in and pulllll and really get good momentum going. I started my other pug in a rope harness and he's never had a pulling issue. Puppia's are bad :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) I think I have confused people by calling the Sporn Halter a harness when it is actually a halter. Though it isn't really like a harness or a halter. It has a collar that goes around the dog's neck, but it sits further down the neck near the shoulders. And the two sherpa loops (where the dog's front legs go through) are attached to the collar and sit snugly under the armpits. Also the lead is attached to the back of the neck near the shoulders (someone mentioned that it was attached to the front of the chest). My sporn doesn't have a collar, it merely has the loops under the legs and the lead attaches to the back like a normal harness. Perhaps we should make it clear in this thread which Sporn product we are talking about (when we are talking about it)? Mine has a collar and it is called a Sporn Halter. They both work on the same "under the arm" concept to help stop leash pulling, mines just minus the collar because my fattys have chunky necks and the collars were too small for them. I might have to get one of those for Frankenpuggie. He pulls like anything in his Puppia harness and he is a determined little bugger. That's why I got the Sporn, I had Max in a Puppia from when she was tiny and they just encourage pulling because they can lean all their weight in and pulllll and really get good momentum going. I started my other pug in a rope harness and he's never had a pulling issue. Puppia's are bad :/ He is my sister's Pug and the Puppia harness came with him... But seeing as though he is in my care I don't see why I can't buy him a Sporn harness. Edited November 23, 2012 by Labradork Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I think I have confused people by calling the Sporn Halter a harness when it is actually a halter. Though it isn't really like a harness or a halter. It has a collar that goes around the dog's neck, but it sits further down the neck near the shoulders. And the two sherpa loops (where the dog's front legs go through) are attached to the collar and sit snugly under the armpits. Also the lead is attached to the back of the neck near the shoulders (someone mentioned that it was attached to the front of the chest). My sporn doesn't have a collar, it merely has the loops under the legs and the lead attaches to the back like a normal harness. Perhaps we should make it clear in this thread which Sporn product we are talking about (when we are talking about it)? Mine has a collar and it is called a Sporn Halter. They both work on the same "under the arm" concept to help stop leash pulling, mines just minus the collar because my fattys have chunky necks and the collars were too small for them. I might have to get one of those for Frankenpuggie. He pulls like anything in his Puppia harness and he is a determined little bugger. That's why I got the Sporn, I had Max in a Puppia from when she was tiny and they just encourage pulling because they can lean all their weight in and pulllll and really get good momentum going. I started my other pug in a rope harness and he's never had a pulling issue. Puppia's are bad :/ He is my sister's Pug and the Puppia harness came with him... But seeing as though he is in my care I don't see why I can't buy him a Sporn harness. Yeh, why not! My Max loves hers, she does this hilarious "leap" into it so both her front legs go through the straps at the same time. My OH doesn't use the sporn "properly", she just uses it likes its a normal harness and Max pulls with her like shes freight-train. But with me, at the start of each walk she still needs a few initials corrections but after that she's usually okay. I don't do as much training with her as I should, if I put more effort in she would probably walk much better on leash - but most of the time I walk with Boston and my OH walks with Max, which is why it doesn't bother me too much :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) I think I have confused people by calling the Sporn Halter a harness when it is actually a halter. Though it isn't really like a harness or a halter. It has a collar that goes around the dog's neck, but it sits further down the neck near the shoulders. And the two sherpa loops (where the dog's front legs go through) are attached to the collar and sit snugly under the armpits. Also the lead is attached to the back of the neck near the shoulders (someone mentioned that it was attached to the front of the chest). My sporn doesn't have a collar, it merely has the loops under the legs and the lead attaches to the back like a normal harness. Perhaps we should make it clear in this thread which Sporn product we are talking about (when we are talking about it)? Mine has a collar and it is called a Sporn Halter. They both work on the same "under the arm" concept to help stop leash pulling, mines just minus the collar because my fattys have chunky necks and the collars were too small for them. I might have to get one of those for Frankenpuggie. He pulls like anything in his Puppia harness and he is a determined little bugger. That's why I got the Sporn, I had Max in a Puppia from when she was tiny and they just encourage pulling because they can lean all their weight in and pulllll and really get good momentum going. I started my other pug in a rope harness and he's never had a pulling issue. Puppia's are bad :/ He is my sister's Pug and the Puppia harness came with him... But seeing as though he is in my care I don't see why I can't buy him a Sporn harness. Yeh, why not! My Max loves hers, she does this hilarious "leap" into it so both her front legs go through the straps at the same time. My OH doesn't use the sporn "properly", she just uses it likes its a normal harness and Max pulls with her like shes freight-train. But with me, at the start of each walk she still needs a few initials corrections but after that she's usually okay. I don't do as much training with her as I should, if I put more effort in she would probably walk much better on leash - but most of the time I walk with Boston and my OH walks with Max, which is why it doesn't bother me too much :laugh: Edited because it was off topic. Edited November 23, 2012 by Labradork Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allywil Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I honestly can't see the benefit of using any standard harness for control in an adult dog, particularly if your aim is competition obedience. Even less for a Sch/IPO dog when you want the dog to associate the harness with pulling. Though I can see the value of 'no pull' harnesses as a management tool for some pet owners. Just not something I'd bother with personally. But how does it reduce the pulling tendency without applying aversive pressure with the potential of pain for the dog to back out from pulling, or is that what it does.........ultimately no diffent than a prong collar except that the aversive action of the device is applied elsewhere on the dog's body to create a 'no pull" result? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 It does apply aversive pressure. Which does not make it the same as a prong. Because it applies it to different places in a different way. Aversive pressure comes in many different forms. Some forms more aversive than others. Obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan3 Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I honestly can't see the benefit of using any standard harness for control in an adult dog, particularly if your aim is competition obedience. Even less for a Sch/IPO dog when you want the dog to associate the harness with pulling. Though I can see the value of 'no pull' harnesses as a management tool for some pet owners. Just not something I'd bother with personally. But how does it reduce the pulling tendency without applying aversive pressure with the potential of pain for the dog to back out from pulling, or is that what it does.........ultimately no diffent than a prong collar except that the aversive action of the device is applied elsewhere on the dog's body to create a 'no pull" result? You should be all for them, then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) I'm not sure that anyone said it wasn't an aversive? Although really, a flat collar can be an aversive too, so Edited November 23, 2012 by minimax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I honestly can't see the benefit of using any standard harness for control in an adult dog, particularly if your aim is competition obedience. Even less for a Sch/IPO dog when you want the dog to associate the harness with pulling. Though I can see the value of 'no pull' harnesses as a management tool for some pet owners. Just not something I'd bother with personally. But how does it reduce the pulling tendency without applying aversive pressure with the potential of pain for the dog to back out from pulling, or is that what it does.........ultimately no diffent than a prong collar except that the aversive action of the device is applied elsewhere on the dog's body to create a 'no pull" result? You should be all for them, then. Why? I'm not a huge fan of them and personally I wouldn't use one. There are other, much more effective ways to train LLW in my opinion if that is your goal. Doesn't mean I should care if other people choose to use a no pull harness though. If it's working for them, the dog is not being put at risk and the owner is happy 'managing' the problem then it's none of anyone else's business really... Either way this discussion has become way off topic and not really conductive to the OP.. Allywil, you are correct. It works by applying aversive pressure under the armpits of the dog, which reduces pulling on leash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) I honestly can't see the benefit of using any standard harness for control in an adult dog, particularly if your aim is competition obedience. Even less for a Sch/IPO dog when you want the dog to associate the harness with pulling. Though I can see the value of 'no pull' harnesses as a management tool for some pet owners. Just not something I'd bother with personally. But how does it reduce the pulling tendency without applying aversive pressure with the potential of pain for the dog to back out from pulling, or is that what it does.........ultimately no diffent than a prong collar except that the aversive action of the device is applied elsewhere on the dog's body to create a 'no pull" result? You should be all for them, then. Why? I'm not a huge fan of them and personally I wouldn't use one. There are other, much more effective ways to train LLW in my opinion if that is your goal. Doesn't mean I should care if other people choose to use a no pull harness though. If it's working for them, the dog is not being put at risk and the owner is happy 'managing' the problem then it's none of anyone else's business really... Either way this discussion has become way off topic and not really conductive to the OP.. Allywil, you are correct. It works by applying aversive pressure under the armpits of the dog, which reduces pulling on leash. Exactly. I don't get what the big deal is. At the end of the day, whatever you use on your dog is nobody's business but your own. Edited November 23, 2012 by Labradork Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 People ... people ... people ... we have totally forgotten the thing that will actually fix the dog! TRAINING! *faint* throw the equipment in the bin and train the dog. Really, stop worrying about what the dog likes and doesnt like, it's why the dog is needing more equipment and changing it. I don't think anyone said that the Sporn halter was a substitute for training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan3 Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I honestly can't see the benefit of using any standard harness for control in an adult dog, particularly if your aim is competition obedience. Even less for a Sch/IPO dog when you want the dog to associate the harness with pulling. Though I can see the value of 'no pull' harnesses as a management tool for some pet owners. Just not something I'd bother with personally. But how does it reduce the pulling tendency without applying aversive pressure with the potential of pain for the dog to back out from pulling, or is that what it does.........ultimately no diffent than a prong collar except that the aversive action of the device is applied elsewhere on the dog's body to create a 'no pull" result? You should be all for them, then. Why? Allywill is m-sass etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) . Edited November 23, 2012 by Labradork Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) . Edited November 23, 2012 by Labradork Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimax Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I honestly can't see the benefit of using any standard harness for control in an adult dog, particularly if your aim is competition obedience. Even less for a Sch/IPO dog when you want the dog to associate the harness with pulling. Though I can see the value of 'no pull' harnesses as a management tool for some pet owners. Just not something I'd bother with personally. But how does it reduce the pulling tendency without applying aversive pressure with the potential of pain for the dog to back out from pulling, or is that what it does.........ultimately no diffent than a prong collar except that the aversive action of the device is applied elsewhere on the dog's body to create a 'no pull" result? You should be all for them, then. Why? Allywill is m-sass etc Yes, I'd already figured that one out - only took one post to identify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Fox Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Really? Who cares? Their point was correct - the harness does work by applying aversive pressure. Seriously, hit the ignore button if it bothers you that much. No point 'discussing' anything if we all have the same opinion.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labradork Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I'm sorry, but it seemed funny in an Arrested Development kind of way. Now, where were we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Effectiveness may vary from dog to dog and handler to handler. FWIW, the assistance dogs organisation I'm working with at the moment uses Easywalk front attach harnesses to aid in teaching LLW. A lot of the dogs come in from puppy raisers at 12 months old without any LLW skills. It is a pretty big problem and drives the trainers crazy. They have better things to do than teach a dog to walk on leash nicely, but it has to be done or the whole thing has been a waste of time and resources. The dogs come good and they overcome some pretty ingrained habits just through sheer persistence and consistency. I'm guessing the front attach harnesses are adequately effective as a management tool while they train. At least for young labradors. Otherwise they wouldn't use them. They can't afford to be anything but very effective trainers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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