M United Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Before i start i have to say that i do not agree with the way this person handles his dogs and i don't agree with his dogs behaviour. One of my customers who comes past my shop owns a couple of dogs. The one i'm talking about is a Bull Mastiff cross Bull Arab registered as a Bullmastiff Cross for obvious reasons. He got the dog at 9 months old, before that it lived on a farm as a pig hunting dog. Anyhow he had no issues with the dog at first, could leave it off the lead, he would play with other dogs all was well. At 1 year old he was attacked and he never was the same after that. When he sees dogs now 9/10 (mostly males) he wants to attack, and to be honest i think its to kill. Basically to me its like attack first ask questions later attitude. The owner knows this, understands this and never ever takes him off the lead. Whenever this dog sees a skateboarder he goes into attack mode, chest out barking loud goes for the ankles to take the person down. HE obviusly stops him from reaching the person. When his other pets bark also he attacks them as there in his way, for a few seconds to put them in there place i suppose. An issue i see here is he gets angry at the skateboarders for riding illegally on the footpath and says nothing to his dog, that aggressive behaviour from him to me rubs off on his dog. I think he is not the Alpha his dog is. He has taken the dog to a boot camp for 1 week, cost him $1500 and was told never to let him off the leash. The next day after the boot camp he got into a fight with a dog near his house which he doesn't like. The issue is when he gets into a fight ( been a couple) he really hurts the other dog, he is very very strong. Just the other month he took his dog to the vet to get his pupp vaccinated, The vet took him off the leash to weight him, no dogs where in there that time. A lady went to walk in with her big boxer he screamed no dont come in as he knew his dog will attack. It did took him around couple of minutes to get his dog off the boxer. Unfortunately the boxer after a few operations died a month or so later due to health issues, it got a common sickness which can easily be cured (foget which one) but i think it couldn't recover due to the complications from the fight. His dog is now classified a dangerous dog and even though i know his dog and he loves humans (unless there riding a skateboard) he is not in control when other dogs or skateboarders are around. Any other time he looks like the most calm innocent dog you have ever seen. The conditions given to him (which he will fight and lose in my opinion) are very strict. Here are some off the top of my head: 1) Can only handle him and no other dog (he has 3) 2) Has to be desexed 3) Has to always be on a leash and have strong leash, chains, collars etc (his on a 4mm choker at all times) 4) Has to be on a muzzle at all times when leaving his propery 5) has to sleep in a cage in the yard ( but he sleeps in his bedroom so not sure how that will work) He has no issues having him on a muzzle the hole time but doesn't want it to be classified dangerous as he thinks its not dangerous. The man in his 50s is a pensioner and also doesn't think like you and me. For example his dog peed on some asian tourists in the city (in front of there hotel) on there suitcase and them and he blamed them for standing on a corner and what can the dog to. I personally think his dogs issues is purely down to his attitude and the way he doesn't keep his dogs in line. i haven't told him this i will leave the council to deal with him i dont want any problems. Do you think that breed dog can be a good dog and can he trained to be a well behaved dog or cant that breed be trusted ever? Anyhow i thought i would share this as it is interesting topic to talk about but very sad that a dog passed away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 It has nothing to do with the breed. Any breed can be aggressive, but because of the size and strength I guess he can do more damage than some smaller dogs. Only way to tell if any improvements can be made to the dogs behaviour is by seeing a behavourist but it doesn't sound as though the owner would go for that. The owner sounds like he doesn't have a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosetta Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 My gosh has nobody complained about this dog to the council? Poor boxer owner taking her dog to the vet only to have him attacked The vet should have had him better restrained IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M United Posted February 11, 2013 Author Share Posted February 11, 2013 I didn't think it has nothing to do with the breed either but the people at the boot camp seemed to think he cant be fixed and said its his breed. They are obviously clueless. I am seeing it from the poor ladies view. I can't imaging taking your dog to a vet, having it get into a serious fight and dying. I would be devastated. Anyhow i got him the info through someone i know of the Australian version of the dog whisperer. He will need to save some money as he is a pensioner, i think he charges around $300 per 30 mins but gaurantes to fix your dog or you don't pay anything. But the handler will also need to be sorted out (training) as he doesn't always think like a normal logical person would. Don't get me wrong he is a nice guy and loves his dogs but how can you enjoy a dog which you can never let him off the leash anywhere even a park? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazar Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Hi, Overall it is not a good siutation but two things stand out to me. 1. why on earth would a vet take a lead off a dog to weigh it?????? Absolute stupidity. 2. 1 week of bootcamp - what on earth did he think could be achieved in such a short period of time?? With effective rehabilitation training he should improve (in the right hands they will be able to tell him if it is possible) but it will be an ongoing management process... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M United Posted February 11, 2013 Author Share Posted February 11, 2013 He is not the smartest guy and im sure the bootcamp team didn't explain to easy enough what needs to be done. The scales believe it or not where in the waiting room, how can a vet have scales in the waiting room? My vet i go to actually has the scale in the waiting room also surely that is not aloud by the council. To me the vet is to be part blamed to as they were passed over responsibility when he handed them the leash. They needed to take him off the leash to get his proper weight. Im sure the vet knows he is an aggressive dog as they treat him. Anyhow when he walks his dog into the vet he has it on a muzzle now still at the end of the day the boxer died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazar Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 (edited) Usually the vet nurse get people to weigh their dog on arrival, writes it down so that if medication is required the vet knows the right does. Common practice. This is why the scales are in the waiting room. Very basic training can be achieved in 7 days with an experienced trainer, rehabilitation of the issues you have decribed could not be fixed in that amount of time. Edited February 11, 2013 by Tazar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 how can a vet have scales in the waiting room? My vet i go to actually has the scale in the waiting room also surely that is not aloud by the council. ?? Why would council have anything to do with where a vet clinic has scales? Sorry ..Scales in a waiting area is the sensible option, as many owners just pop in to weigh their dog , prior to worming, or to see if they need to change food amounts ..prior to booking a surgery - all sorts of reasons . AFAIK it is all done on lead though ... a lead does not increase weight by any amount that matters ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 charges around $300 per 30 mins but gaurantes to fix your dog or you don't pay anything. This seems scary to me if this person really wants his money - just what may he do to obtain compliance from a dog? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M United Posted February 11, 2013 Author Share Posted February 11, 2013 Strange they took him off the lead. The council where the incident happened advised the owner the scales should not be in waiting room and only in the treatment room and they where going to talk to the vet about that as they where not happy. If you need to take your dog off the lead for whatever reason to weight the dog that would make sense if you don't then the waiting room is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chezy Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Why on earth would you take a lead off a dog to weigh it, surely it wouldn't make that much difference i have never taken mine off lead to weigh , even my lil girl . sounds like he has no clue and doesn't see the problem , I'd keep clear of that dog , as it will end in more pain and grief IMO . Sounds like it has got away with more than the council know about .This is the problem when people dont report ', hopefully one day it dpoesn;t take out somebodies child on a skateboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Have never taken a lead off a dog to weigh it and don't know anyone that ever would!! Sheer stupidity to take a dog off lead in this situation. And yes, scales are generally by common practice placed in the waiting room. As for the rest..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diva Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 I would contact K9 Pro for this dog although it doesn't sound like the owner is the type who would. I think Steve Courtney would be able to come up with an effective program for the dog, but owner compliance might be a big issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 The council where the incident happened advised the owner the scales should not be in waiting room and only in the treatment room and they where going to talk to the vet about that as they where not happy. O K ............... To me , It still sounds a very odd thing for council to be concerned with .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M United Posted February 12, 2013 Author Share Posted February 12, 2013 Maybe it has to do with his heavy choker he wears or the vet more likely is clueless. I haven't taken my sisters dog off the lead at the vet but her collar weighs nothing. His dog has been reported a couple of times to his local council for dog fights but because it never bit a human or killed a animal it was just classifed a nuisance. The council advised him though that was his last chance/warning and any other issues would make him a dangerous dog. Which is where he is at now. The 2 councils must have talked to each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 (edited) Maybe it has to do with his heavy choker he wears or the vet more likely is clueless. I haven't taken my sisters dog off the lead at the vet but her collar weighs nothing. His dog has been reported a couple of times to his local council for dog fights but because it never bit a human or killed a animal it was just classifed a nuisance. The council advised him though that was his last chance/warning and any other issues would make him a dangerous dog. Which is where he is at now. The 2 councils must have talked to each other. just whose dog is this? as you seem very involved. personally the dog has proven it is dangerous therefore it must live by those laws. And if the "owner' can find $1500 for boot camp then they can find the money for a professional assesment. Might be best if the "owner" just abides by the conditions imposed on the dog, at least that way other dogs will be safe. Edited February 12, 2013 by Rebanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M United Posted February 12, 2013 Author Share Posted February 12, 2013 It is a customer of mineswho has been coming to my shop for a good 8 months every single day. So i know his dogs very well and all his daily issues. Im not one to tell him what do do, i advise him nicely but its not my job to tell him how to handle his dogs and what to do. I knew issues would happen and the council will get involved and they will sort him out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M United Posted February 12, 2013 Author Share Posted February 12, 2013 He will have to take him to professional treatment if not im certain in the future he will be put down as there will be more issues. I didn't know him when he took him on the boot camp, he might of had a job back then and had more money but now he is on the pensions, and it will probably take him time to save money. But i think he wont take him for any help unless the courts order him to as he believes his dog is not dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huski Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 If the dog has been declared dangerous he can be in big trouble for not abiding by the dangerous dog requirements. It doesn't matter if the other trainer "fixes" the dog, the owner will still have to abide by the DD requirements unless he is able to get it over turned. Even if the dog never does anything wrong again if the council came to inspect his premises and found the dog wasn't being contained as it is supposed to be the owner will still face a large fine and the dog could be seized and PTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 (edited) Frankly, you can only do so much. The owner needs to abide by the law. And if they are not going to listen regarding their dog then I would be keeping well away and well out of the issue. Edited February 12, 2013 by espinay2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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