Why French Bulldogs And Dachshunds Are On Trend

[huga]

They've always been at the higher end. I paid $3000 for Sid 5 years ago.

[trinabean]

I can see the appeal in French Bulldogs. Without exception, the ones I have met have been sweet, personable little dogs.

[asal]

Aside from health problems related to being brachy, French Bulldogs are almost the ideal pet for inner city people. They're generally friendly, low maintenance, have moderate exercise requirements, come in a range of colors and are cute. I can see why they are popular.

I agree - its supply and demand. People want them so if the registered breeders dont want to rise to the occasion someone will take up the option. In fact why dont registered breeders who have the best for the breed at heart increase their production a bit to get in on the action ? They dont have to do it solely for the pet market but can also have more choices for the show ring and the gene pool.

In some apartment buildings you can only have a dog where you can carry it off and on the premises so demand for small dogs suitable for small spaces that can be carried will be more in demand anyway.

By the way they dont have anywhere near the problems that many brachy head breeds have - yet.

dont know if its true but a lady whose puppies i chip said there are moves afoot to bring in a maximum number of litters bred per year any one breeder is allowed (to discourage puppy farm members) and after that is reached no puppies over the limit can be registered . Cant remember if she said there would be fines or membership suspended.

but as it is many members keep a check on fellow breeders and any they dont like make complaints to the animal welfare groups to harass and hopefully drive them out, been done for decades.

so little incentive to increase production, to be "ethical"and stay under the radar for elimination, stick to producing a litter for a keep puppy and surplus in the litter limit registerd only. Just read the adds here.

its not impossible down the track if someone wants a dog if the animals rights group continue to succeed in branding all who dont keep what they bred as "puppy farmers" some will find it so hard to find a puppy they will turn to the cloning companies for their pet to be cloned instead?

Sci-fi? time will tell

the crash is already documented. just check the ANKC registrations dating back to the 80's our population increases, puppies bred steady decline

Edited May 23, 2016 by asal

[moosmum]

Aside from health problems related to being brachy, French Bulldogs are almost the ideal pet for inner city people. They're generally friendly, low maintenance, have moderate exercise requirements, come in a range of colors and are cute. I can see why they are popular.

I agree - its supply and demand. People want them so if the registered breeders dont want to rise to the occasion someone will take up the option. In fact why dont registered breeders who have the best for the breed at heart increase their production a bit to get in on the action ? They dont have to do it solely for the pet market but can also have more choices for the show ring and the gene pool.

In some apartment buildings you can only have a dog where you can carry it off and on the premises so demand for small dogs suitable for small spaces that can be carried will be more in demand anyway.

By the way they dont have anywhere near the problems that many brachy head breeds have - yet.

dont know if its true but a lady whose puppies i chip said there are moves afoot to bring in a maximum number of litters bred per year any one breeder is allowed (to discourage puppy farm members) and after that is reached no puppies over the limit can be registered . Cant remember if she said there would be fines or membership suspended.

but as it is many members keep a check on fellow breeders and any they dont like make complaints to the animal welfare groups to harass and hopefully drive them out, been done for decades.

so little incentive to increase production, to be "ethical"and stay under the radar for elimination, stick to producing a litter for a keep puppy and surplus in the litter limit registerd only. Just read the adds here.

its not impossible down the track if someone wants a dog if the animals rights group continue to succeed in branding all who dont keep what they bred as "puppy farmers" some will find it so hard to find a puppy they will turn to the cloning companies for their pet to be cloned instead?

Sci-fi? time will tell

the crash is already documented. just check the ANKC registrations dating back to the 80's our population increases, puppies bred steady decline

ANKC trying to distance themselves from what happens out side their membership and the accusations of 'being in it for the money' brought in the rule that "No breeder shall breed primarily for profit".

A mistake I believe, since in a market driven world those who can earn biggest profits are those who best meet demands.

But now those who earn biggest profits are open to the sort of harassment you mention. The K.Cs are not designed to meet the needs of their environment, but to remain distinctly separate. This rule is a reflection of that and came about because of that.

A reaction typical to a biological organism that does not recognize its environment.

If the environment for dogs was considered as the single environment it is, that accusation would have likely been taken as a more general one, with a different response aimed more at demonstrating/educating the benefits of NOT buying from a breeder whos primary goal is profit.

And not opened the gates to breeders whos ONLY concern is meeting demand, for profit.

[asal]

Aside from health problems related to being brachy, French Bulldogs are almost the ideal pet for inner city people. They're generally friendly, low maintenance, have moderate exercise requirements, come in a range of colors and are cute. I can see why they are popular.

I agree - its supply and demand. People want them so if the registered breeders dont want to rise to the occasion someone will take up the option. In fact why dont registered breeders who have the best for the breed at heart increase their production a bit to get in on the action ? They dont have to do it solely for the pet market but can also have more choices for the show ring and the gene pool.

In some apartment buildings you can only have a dog where you can carry it off and on the premises so demand for small dogs suitable for small spaces that can be carried will be more in demand anyway.

By the way they dont have anywhere near the problems that many brachy head breeds have - yet.

dont know if its true but a lady whose puppies i chip said there are moves afoot to bring in a maximum number of litters bred per year any one breeder is allowed (to discourage puppy farm members) and after that is reached no puppies over the limit can be registered . Cant remember if she said there would be fines or membership suspended.

but as it is many members keep a check on fellow breeders and any they dont like make complaints to the animal welfare groups to harass and hopefully drive them out, been done for decades.

so little incentive to increase production, to be "ethical"and stay under the radar for elimination, stick to producing a litter for a keep puppy and surplus in the litter limit registerd only. Just read the adds here.

its not impossible down the track if someone wants a dog if the animals rights group continue to succeed in branding all who dont keep what they bred as "puppy farmers" some will find it so hard to find a puppy they will turn to the cloning companies for their pet to be cloned instead?

Sci-fi? time will tell

the crash is already documented. just check the ANKC registrations dating back to the 80's our population increases, puppies bred steady decline

ANKC trying to distance themselves from what happens out side their membership and the accusations of 'being in it for the money' brought in the rule that "No breeder shall breed primarily for profit".

A mistake I believe, since in a market driven world those who can earn biggest profits are those who best meet demands.

But now those who earn biggest profits are open to the sort of harassment you mention. The K.Cs are not designed to meet the needs of their environment, but to remain distinctly separate. This rule is a reflection of that and came about because of that.

A reaction typical to a biological organism that does not recognize its environment.

If the environment for dogs was considered as the single environment it is, that accusation would have likely been taken as a more general one, with a different response aimed more at demonstrating/educating the benefits of NOT buying from a breeder whos primary goal is profit.

And not opened the gates to breeders whos ONLY concern is meeting demand, for profit.

curious isnt it. like your comment " A reaction typical to a biological organism that does not recognize its environment."

in this instance the "organism" seems intent on self destruction, once continually reducing numbers reach critical figures extinction is inevitable

[moosmum]

Aside from health problems related to being brachy, French Bulldogs are almost the ideal pet for inner city people. They're generally friendly, low maintenance, have moderate exercise requirements, come in a range of colors and are cute. I can see why they are popular.

I agree - its supply and demand. People want them so if the registered breeders dont want to rise to the occasion someone will take up the option. In fact why dont registered breeders who have the best for the breed at heart increase their production a bit to get in on the action ? They dont have to do it solely for the pet market but can also have more choices for the show ring and the gene pool.

In some apartment buildings you can only have a dog where you can carry it off and on the premises so demand for small dogs suitable for small spaces that can be carried will be more in demand anyway.

By the way they dont have anywhere near the problems that many brachy head breeds have - yet.

dont know if its true but a lady whose puppies i chip said there are moves afoot to bring in a maximum number of litters bred per year any one breeder is allowed (to discourage puppy farm members) and after that is reached no puppies over the limit can be registered . Cant remember if she said there would be fines or membership suspended.

but as it is many members keep a check on fellow breeders and any they dont like make complaints to the animal welfare groups to harass and hopefully drive them out, been done for decades.

so little incentive to increase production, to be "ethical"and stay under the radar for elimination, stick to producing a litter for a keep puppy and surplus in the litter limit registerd only. Just read the adds here.

its not impossible down the track if someone wants a dog if the animals rights group continue to succeed in branding all who dont keep what they bred as "puppy farmers" some will find it so hard to find a puppy they will turn to the cloning companies for their pet to be cloned instead?

Sci-fi? time will tell

the crash is already documented. just check the ANKC registrations dating back to the 80's our population increases, puppies bred steady decline

ANKC trying to distance themselves from what happens out side their membership and the accusations of 'being in it for the money' brought in the rule that "No breeder shall breed primarily for profit".

A mistake I believe, since in a market driven world those who can earn biggest profits are those who best meet demands.

But now those who earn biggest profits are open to the sort of harassment you mention. The K.Cs are not designed to meet the needs of their environment, but to remain distinctly separate. This rule is a reflection of that and came about because of that.

A reaction typical to a biological organism that does not recognize its environment.

If the environment for dogs was considered as the single environment it is, that accusation would have likely been taken as a more general one, with a different response aimed more at demonstrating/educating the benefits of NOT buying from a breeder whos primary goal is profit.

And not opened the gates to breeders whos ONLY concern is meeting demand, for profit.

curious isnt it. like your comment " A reaction typical to a biological organism that does not recognize its environment."

in this instance the "organism" seems intent on self destruction, once continually reducing numbers reach critical figures extinction is inevitable

Yup.

Conjuring a demon in a pentagram, drawn on its own navel.

The more the environment tries to communicate its needs, The more the organism struggles to keep the environment out.

Edited May 23, 2016 by moosmum

[Steve]

Im all for not breeding primarily for profit because I believe that the health and welfare of the dogs MUST come first but whats wrong with profit if primarily its about what is best for the dogs and the breeds

Would appear that there is also a policy now via dogsnsw of more than 10 litters gets an inspection.

So its saying O.K. for a Great Dane breeder to have 10 litters per year = approx 100 puppies per year but a chi breeder can only have around 30 puppies per year before they are branded as potential animal abusers and inspected.

[asal]

Im all for not breeding primarily for profit because I believe that the health and welfare of the dogs MUST come first but whats wrong with profit if primarily its about what is best for the dogs and the breeds

Would appear that there is also a policy now via dogsnsw of more than 10 litters gets an inspection.

So its saying O.K. for a Great Dane breeder to have 10 litters per year = approx 100 puppies per year but a chi breeder can only have around 30 puppies per year before they are branded as potential animal abusers and inspected.

AS for the oft repeated to be ethical you shouldn't breed and price to make a profit? how many of the people who want a puppy will work for nothing? Where are they going to get the money to buy a puppy if they too work for free or at a loss? let alone pay for its food and vet bill. as well as food for themselves?

Many years ago the ANKC did a survey and discovered the majority of new members remained members 5 years or less.the majority of members were pensioners, they cant afford to breed if they cant make enough to buy feed for themselves and their dogs, pensions don't stretch very far. The dairy farmers would have to be the most ethical in australia at the moment. they are not only working for nothing, they lose money for every litre they milk because they are getting less thanit costs to produce it. 6,000 cattle went to the sales last week 77% of them dairy cows their owners cant afford to feed. That is where ethical gets anyone if profit is unethical

your only allowed one litter per year, two in a row but cant breed another for minimum 12 months or is it longer now?

either way that means a chi that has 1 pup per "litter' can only produce about 5 to six pups in her breeding life. Lucky for me I managed a 7th before she was too old and finally had the long awaited bitch pup.

so 7 litters for a great dane and 70 odd pups to choose from.

no wonder the toy breeds numbers bred are falling though the floor

in the bad old days a bitch had her 4 or five litters to select from before she was 4 or 5. many had their replacement daughter and were pet homed by 3 1/2 to 4 and there was great demand for then as they still had a long life as a pet ahead of them. now if you had bad luck until the 7th try, (pretty sure now you cant have a 7th try anymore)they are too old to rehome but keep too many to live out their lives with you is going to get you branded as a "collector/hoarder" last I heard they are pushing for legislation to have the threshold changed from 10 to 5 and any over that can be seized

so not too many oldies will shove u over the limit fast.

lets not forget now a newbie even if they find a main register pup or even worse a main register adult cannot apply for a prefix until they have been a member for 18 months. How many are going to wait 18 months without throwing in the towel and become a backyard breeder instead. Whatever happened to welcoming, educating and mentoring newbies instead of setting up an obstacle course to weed out the impatient?

I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesnt count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

Edited May 23, 2016 by asal

[Steve]

Im all for not breeding primarily for profit because I believe that the health and welfare of the dogs MUST come first but whats wrong with profit if primarily its about what is best for the dogs and the breeds

Would appear that there is also a policy now via dogsnsw of more than 10 litters gets an inspection.

So its saying O.K. for a Great Dane breeder to have 10 litters per year = approx 100 puppies per year but a chi breeder can only have around 30 puppies per year before they are branded as potential animal abusers and inspected.

AS for the oft repeated to be ethical you shouldn't breed and price to make a profit? how many of the people who want a puppy will work for nothing? Where are they going to get the money to buy a puppy if they too work for free or at a loss? let alone pay for its food and vet bill. as well as food for themselves?

Many years ago the ANKC did a survey and discovered the majority of new members remained members 5 years or less.the majority of members were pensioners, they cant afford to breed if they cant make enough to buy feed for themselves and their dogs, pensions don't stretch very far. The dairy farmers would have to be the most ethical in australia at the moment. they are not only working for nothing, they lose money for every litre they milk because they are getting less thanit costs to produce it. 6,000 cattle went to the sales last week 77% of them dairy cows their owners cant afford to feed. That is where ethical gets anyone if profit is unethical

your only allowed one litter per year, two in a row but cant breed another for minimum 12 months or is it longer now?

either way that means a chi that has 1 pup per "litter' can only produce about 5 to six pups in her breeding life. Lucky for me I managed a 7th before she was too old and finally had the long awaited bitch pup.

so 7 litters for a great dane and 70 odd pups to choose from.

no wonder the toy breeds numbers bred are falling though the floor

in the bad old days a bitch had her 4 or five litters to select from before she was 4 or 5. many had their replacement daughter and were pet homed by 3 1/2 to 4 and there was great demand for then as they still had a long life as a pet ahead of them. now if you had bad luck until the 7th try, (pretty sure now you cant have a 7th try anymore)they are too old to rehome but keep too many to live out their lives with you is going to get you branded as a "collector/hoarder" last I heard they are pushing for legislation to have the threshold changed from 10 to 5 and any over that can be seized

so not too many oldies will shove u over the limit fast.

lets not forget now a newbie even if they find a main register pup or even worse a main register adult cannot apply for a prefix until they have been a member for 18 months. How many are going to wait 18 months without throwing in the towel and become a backyard breeder instead. Whatever happened to welcoming, educating and mentoring newbies instead of setting up an obstacle course to weed out the impatient?

I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesn't count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

In NSW first and foremost breeders have to comply with the law which does restrict how often you have a litter but there is a loop hole -the vet.

Bitches must not have more than two litters in anytwo year period, unless with the written approval of aveterinary practitioner.

But then of course you also have to comply with Dogsnsw codes too.

There is no restriction in NSW on the numbers of dogs you can keep and this has been ruled out by state government , you can also breed as many litters as you want but it seems DogsNSW have determined that if you are one of their members you can only do that if you get inspected.

[Willem]

....I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesnt count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

...that makes also an interesting comment for the 'unethical desexing' thread...

[Steph M]

....I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesnt count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

...that makes also an interesting comment for the 'unethical desexing' thread...

Can you keep your ranting to one thread? There's a reason its an echo chamber in there.

[Willem]

....I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesnt count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

...that makes also an interesting comment for the 'unethical desexing' thread...

Can you keep your ranting to one thread? There's a reason its an echo chamber in there.

...who is ranting here?...me or you?

[Steve]

....I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesnt count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

...that makes also an interesting comment for the 'unethical desexing' thread...

Can you keep your ranting to one thread? There's a reason its an echo chamber in there.

[Steph M]

....I know how many once I explain the waiting time chuck it in to the too hard basket. one has three outstanding dogs and to my knowledge became a member 2 years ago so happily went in to apply for a prefix, except turns out when applied for membership was told if your only showing you only need to be an associate member. guess what, 2 years as an associate member doesnt count, have to be a full member for 18 months. and yes has given up. so 3 lovely dogs lost to be breed and one once enthusiastic potential addition to the rapidly thinning ranks

...that makes also an interesting comment for the 'unethical desexing' thread...

Can you keep your ranting to one thread? There's a reason its an echo chamber in there.

How clever.

But really, I'm tired of this same agenda being dragged into irrevelevant posts where people are trying to learn or ask questions.

We get it, you guys have an agenda and are on the same side. Go team, but can we all be spared in threads that bear no relevance to said agenda?

I have no interest in getting further into it and driving things more off topic but a little consideration would be really nice.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Steph M

[Steve]

How clever.

But really, I'm tired of this same agenda being dragged into irrevelevant posts where people are trying to learn or ask questions.

We get it, you guys have an agenda and are on the same side. Go team, but can we all be spared in threads that bear no relevance to said agenda?

I have no interest in getting further into it and driving things more off topic but a little consideration would be really nice.

What is it exactly that you are complaining about ? Surely it cant be that some posts on dogz are irrelevent to you? What is it you want Willem and myself to do to be sure we are being considerate to you?

What agenda do you think we have and why do you think we are on some kind of team? How do we know what we can do or say so we dont upset you to a point where you feel you need to be so rude.

Its pretty hard to claim you are the victim of some terrible torture when you are punching into someone publicly without apparent concern for how you are making them feel.

I dont enjoy watching people being censored or bullied - you may not have meant it that way but that's how it felt and last time I looked people got to say and talk about what they think here as long as they don't break the rules.

Right now you are playing the man and not the ball [personal attacks breach forum rules ] and you are not the forum police nor do you have permission to tell anyone that they should not participate.

You have choices if you dont want to read someone's posts perhaps you should use them.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Steve

[sandgrubber]

Ok, I can go for no breeding for profit, but if you take on a full time job you deserve to earn a living wage.

People start wagging their fingers when someone has more than a couple bitches. But someone who works full time caring for their dogs can generally give more care to each of ten or so dogs than someone who has a full time job and keeps a couple bitches, especially if they have invested in facilities for excellent dog care. Some breeds are sociable, and are happier in a setting that allows them to have a sense of belonging to a pack. Heavy investment in a given breed results in greater understanding of breed traits, pedigrees, health problems, and the whole lot. It also facilitates importation of new bloodlines, which is critical for health of breeds that aren't well represented.

Should add that Frenchies and Bostons are not cheap to breed because they have smallish litters and more-often-than-not require C-sections, and stud fees are relatively high.

This is not to say that there aren't puppy farms, and expensive breeds are attractive material for puppy farms. But blanket condemnation of breeders because they have more than a certain number of dogs shows a sort of blindness.

[Roova]

Someone mentioned on a Facebook group Im in that five years ago there was regularly about 8 French bulldog breeders advertising on DOL, currently there are 52!

[drewob]

I can see the appeal in French Bulldogs. Without exception, the ones I have met have been sweet, personable little dogs.

I agree with this. The ones I've met are all pretty rad little dogs.

[sandgrubber]

Someone mentioned on a Facebook group Im in that five years ago there was regularly about 8 French bulldog breeders advertising on DOL, currently there are 52!

Just skimmed the DOL Frenchie puppy ads. A few patterns:

* prices are high. The lowest price listed is $4k, apart from one $3.5k in NZ.

* lots of new-ish breeders, relatively few advertize 10yr or more of experience with the breed.

* more males than females being sold, most selling on limited register, significant fraction selling speyed/neutered pups only.

* health testing far from uniform. Many ads mention only that pups are vet-checked. No mention of BOAS or steniotic nares.

* lots of imports

Btw., today there are 243 listed Frenchie breeders on DOL,50 ads for pups.

I'd say this looks like a lot of people cashing in on a newly popular breed and trying to protect their position as sellers in a situation where demand is high, supply low, and prices high. Presumably many of these are keeping pick female pup to enable more puppy sales in the future. There are also quite a few people who have been with the breed for a long while and are breeding to a high standard.

Edited May 30, 2016 by sandgrubber

[Roova]

There's quite a few 'puppy farms' in North Queensland who have waiting lists longer than you can image. A number sell females cheaper on the provision they have a litter or more when the breeder wants. I couldn't even imagine for many puppies are being pumped out over time. Dilutes and especially blues are ultra popular at the moment.

I just wish with this extra cash they'd at least health test but generally it seems that's a waste of money! I also wish they'd make some effort to breed to standard (not that half of them would know what it is). There are some funny looking Frenchie's out there, a lot with tongues which won't stay in their mouth. Their natures all seem lovely though. You just wouldn't wish popularity on your favourite breed.