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Powerlegs

Latest; $100 Boosts A Pet's Social Profile

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A genuine question. Some of the charities I've donated to ... have a list of amounts of money indicating what that money would buy. So you tick whichever amount/use you're donating to ... & it gives an idea of what the value of that money might support. For example, respected charities like Doctors Without Borders (one of my favourites) will indicate something like $50 will buy an ante-natal kit for 1 woman' . I think I've also seen the same method used by a large animal welfare organization, where the options relate to services/items for the animals. Is this Pet Rescue attributions to various amounts, just doing the same?

Broadly speaking - it's against regulations to say money goes one place then it's used in another. I dont mean saying your "$5 will buy a magazine for someone to read during chemo" means tht $5 must be spent on a mag but it must be used for the "recreational supplies" line or what ever magazines would be written off.

We used to come up against this a lot when I worked for MS Australia - as MSA used monies fundraised for people "living with MS" - this covered therapy, doctors, aide. We had one event where all monies raised went to scholarships for people with MS to use for education or a few other things.

We often found people wanting us to use their money specifically for research - which was under the umbrella of MS Research Australia. In those cases we'd have to agree to a variation and give the money to MSRA.

My point is - they'd *technically* be allowed to do what they're doing - otherwise they're at risk of losing their fundraising approval.

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mita   

A genuine question. Some of the charities I've donated to ... have a list of amounts of money indicating what that money would buy. So you tick whichever amount/use you're donating to ... & it gives an idea of what the value of that money might support. For example, respected charities like Doctors Without Borders (one of my favourites) will indicate something like $50 will buy an ante-natal kit for 1 woman' . I think I've also seen the same method used by a large animal welfare organization, where the options relate to services/items for the animals. Is this Pet Rescue attributions to various amounts, just doing the same?

Broadly speaking - it's against regulations to say money goes one place then it's used in another. I dont mean saying your "$5 will buy a magazine for someone to read during chemo" means tht $5 must be spent on a mag but it must be used for the "recreational supplies" line or what ever magazines would be written off.

We used to come up against this a lot when I worked for MS Australia - as MSA used monies fundraised for people "living with MS" - this covered therapy, doctors, aide. We had one event where all monies raised went to scholarships for people with MS to use for education or a few other things.

We often found people wanting us to use their money specifically for research - which was under the umbrella of MS Research Australia. In those cases we'd have to agree to a variation and give the money to MSRA.

My point is - they'd *technically* be allowed to do what they're doing - otherwise they're at risk of losing their fundraising approval.

Thanks for that explanation,it was just what I wanted to know. It must be technically OK to do this, as you say. I'd always thought it must be just giving an idea of values in using donated money. Like, I didn't really think my $50 would have to appear on the charity's accounts as buying an ante-natal kit, so I was glad to read your example about the $5 for the magazine. I'd only been guessing before... so it was good to hear how it applied to your work in an actual charity.

BTW the equivalent of PetRescue in North America, is PetFinder. It started as a data base, too, back in the 1990s, then not for profit. But, as it grew, it became for profit & today is owned by Nestle Purina Petfood Company. I'm not suggesting that Australia's PetRescue should go the same way. It's just interesting. North America (US + Canada) has a much bigger population so I guess it would've looked attractive to big business.

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Steve   

If you go here you can click on 2015 financials and what they get in - how they get it and what they do with it Pre Michelle leaving is all spelled out

My link

If you go here you will see their total of grants received is NIL.

My link

Interesting to note that they list their beneficiaries as 780 rescue groups but also say they do not operate in NT or NSW.

Edited by Steve

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Interesting. So why can't they try harder to source income from anywhere other than off the backs of our rescues?

No idea how they claim Foster Carer Signups in their stats confused.gif they have literally nothing to do with carers signing up (unless someone can correct me) except for just being there as the brand.

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Steve   

Interesting. So why can't they try harder to source income from anywhere other than off the backs of our rescues?

No idea how they claim Foster Carer Signups in their stats confused.gif they have literally nothing to do with carers signing up (unless someone can correct me) except for just being there as the brand.

Most people don't see it as sourcing income off the backs of rescue. They provide a legitimate service for rescue groups giving them access to free advertising, resources, putting a higher focus on rescue generally and they provide a good resource for people who want to find a rescue dog.

They don't charge for rescue to use their website ,their forms or other resources etc but do ask for donations from those who think the service they provide is worthy of receiving a donation to help pay for running costs required for being able to produce the service as well as and as effectively as they have.

They could do just as well by working less outside of the website provision as that is where most of the income is coming from and they could easily have set up as a private business and simply taken all of the profits for themselves. The money they put back into projects and promotion of rescue etc is voluntary and a massive amount of full time and part time work and its the rescue world which have 100% been the beneficiaries of that. The only difference is that donations over $2 would not be tax deductible.

Most websites actually provide a free advertising service for a short time until they build their presence and website profile and then charge those who want to continue using their services.These guys haven't done that .

Foster Carers They provide lots of articles in their library for anyone considering foster caring and any search for foster carer takes you to their website. For a lot of people thinking about having a go its the first port of call.

From their website.

How do I get started?

Go to PetRescue.com.au, select Dog, Cat or Other Pets, select size and state, then click ‘Show advanced search’ and select ‘Pets looking for foster care’. If you find a pet you’d like to enquire about and offer your services as a foster carer, click the ‘Enquire about this pet’ button at the top of the pet’s profile, or scroll to the bottom of the profile page to find the contact details of the rescue group caring for the pet.

Alternatively, contact [email protected] and we’ll help connect you with a rescue group in your area.

We've also launched our Workplace Foster Care Program, to encourage Australian businesses to unleash the life-saving power of the workplace. For all the info you need to convince your staff or boss that this is a pawsitively brilliant idea for your business, download the FREE guide to our Workplace Foster Care Program here.

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A genuine question. Some of the charities I've donated to ... have a list of amounts of money indicating what that money would buy. So you tick whichever amount/use you're donating to ... & it gives an idea of what the value of that money might support. For example, respected charities like Doctors Without Borders (one of my favourites) will indicate something like $50 will buy an ante-natal kit for 1 woman' . I think I've also seen the same method used by a large animal welfare organization, where the options relate to services/items for the animals. Is this Pet Rescue attributions to various amounts, just doing the same?
Broadly speaking - it's against regulations to say money goes one place then it's used in another. I dont mean saying your "$5 will buy a magazine for someone to read during chemo" means tht $5 must be spent on a mag but it must be used for the "recreational supplies" line or what ever magazines would be written off.We used to come up against this a lot when I worked for MS Australia - as MSA used monies fundraised for people "living with MS" - this covered therapy, doctors, aide. We had one event where all monies raised went to scholarships for people with MS to use for education or a few other things. We often found people wanting us to use their money specifically for research - which was under the umbrella of MS Research Australia. In those cases we'd have to agree to a variation and give the money to MSRA.My point is - they'd *technically* be allowed to do what they're doing - otherwise they're at risk of losing their fundraising approval.
Thanks for that explanation,it was just what I wanted to know. It must be technically OK to do this, as you say. I'd always thought it must be just giving an idea of values in using donated money. Like, I didn't really think my $50 would have to appear on the charity's accounts as buying an ante-natal kit, so I was glad to read your example about the $5 for the magazine. I'd only been guessing before... so it was good to hear how it applied to your work in an actual charity.BTW the equivalent of PetRescue in North America, is PetFinder. It started as a data base, too, back in the 1990s, then not for profit. But, as it grew, it became for profit & today is owned by Nestle Purina Petfood Company. I'm not suggesting that Australia's PetRescue should go the same way. It's just interesting. North America (US + Canada) has a much bigger population so I guess it would've looked attractive to big business.

It's a really tough one. After MSA I worked for another not for profit which was really struggling and the thing is while they're NFP they do still have to cover overheads - expenses such as wages and rent. It's a very fine line between just covering your expenses and putting a little aside to pay for the next months rent.

The second NFP I have mentioned above couldn't do this style fundraising because we were not set up properly - actually we were probably a bit like pet rescue in a lot of ways - not on the ground doing the work but in the background.

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Interesting. So why can't they try harder to source income from anywhere other than off the backs of our rescues?

No idea how they claim Foster Carer Signups in their stats confused.gif they have literally nothing to do with carers signing up (unless someone can correct me) except for just being there as the brand.

Most people don't see it as sourcing income off the backs of rescue. They provide a legitimate service for rescue groups giving them access to free advertising, resources, putting a higher focus on rescue generally and they provide a good resource for people who want to find a rescue dog.

They don't charge for rescue to use their website ,their forms or other resources etc but do ask for donations from those who think the service they provide is worthy of receiving a donation to help pay for running costs required for being able to produce the service as well as and as effectively as they have.

They could do just as well by working less outside of the website provision as that is where most of the income is coming from and they could easily have set up as a private business and simply taken all of the profits for themselves. The money they put back into projects and promotion of rescue etc is voluntary and a massive amount of full time and part time work and its the rescue world which have 100% been the beneficiaries of that. The only difference is that donations over $2 would not be tax deductible.

Most websites actually provide a free advertising service for a short time until they build their presence and website profile and then charge those who want to continue using their services.These guys haven't done that .

Foster Carers They provide lots of articles in their library for anyone considering foster caring and any search for foster carer takes you to their website. For a lot of people thinking about having a go its the first port of call.

From their website.

How do I get started?

Go to PetRescue.com.au, select Dog, Cat or Other Pets, select size and state, then click 'Show advanced search' and select 'Pets looking for foster care'. If you find a pet you'd like to enquire about and offer your services as a foster carer, click the 'Enquire about this pet' button at the top of the pet's profile, or scroll to the bottom of the profile page to find the contact details of the rescue group caring for the pet.

Alternatively, contact [email protected] and we'll help connect you with a rescue group in your area.

We've also launched our Workplace Foster Care Program, to encourage Australian businesses to unleash the life-saving power of the workplace. For all the info you need to convince your staff or boss that this is a pawsitively brilliant idea for your business, download the FREE guide to our Workplace Foster Care Program here.

Except we are getting charged. And your 'most people' are exactly the ones who believe that by giving to them, it goes to a rescue.

In every donation they ask for, they are making money from us. We do the hard work and with our work we drive traffic to their site.

They use those stats - membership - carers - adoptions to either a) boost rescue in the eyes of the public and provide much needed services or b) grow into what could potentially be the single biggest drain on already shoestring rescues. PR doesn't pay our bills. They help me advertise a dog for $450 that cost us $5000. And believe me, now that there's more rescues there is a lot less to go around.

Using the exact points you make; we could be charged.

They do pro-active stuff etc which isn't in question (but only some members can benefit from things like workplace foster care and adoption days.); I just don't believe they need to be using methods that are a constant drain on the finite donations available by asking for more and more and more. How about we get paid $10 a listing when we are the ones bringing in their donations?

They have at their disposal, the profile and known brand to hit up others for funds like corporations and grants. If they have no grants income then why?? It's easier to use the generous and trusting audience they already have.

Take a look at their facebook page to see the confusion.

Or ask rescuers what this is doing to us as the brand grows.

Do you work for Pet Rescue? - No

Are you Pet Rescue volunteers? - No

Did Pet Rescue give you the dog to sell? - No

Are you paid by Pet Rescue? - No

What group? I adopted my dog from Pet Rescue. - No

Why haven't you replied to me? - Because you must have contacted someone else.

It's constant and not the fault of the public because the public see a message that could be taken in more that one way when they don't process the existing arrangement.

People believe Pet Rescue are the rescue.

I feel SSR is pretty well branded when it comes to pointing out an independent rescue. People do have to come from PR to our site to see the full profiles and click through to apply but we've had so many applications giving a list of names (of dogs) that aren't ours, we've been forced to amend the form into check-boxes with only OUR dogs listed.

Of course, it's all nicely worded on their site that they only help. Then have their hand out for money to help, which you can see by their financials is above and beyond what they need to provide the services rescues receive and not ploughed back in. I will be able to point this out clearly when the 2016 - 2017 financials are in.

I see where you're coming from but it's frustrating to know that this was coming and I'm trying to get through to people the fact that the press doesn't match what is happening on the ground.

Edited by Powerlegs

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As I said earlier in the thread, Petrescue are unlikely to be eligible for 99% of animal welfare grants, which require your organisation to be directly caring for animals. It is you, the rescues, who are eligible for such grants.

I'm sorry but the idea of PetRescue paying rescue groups for each pet listing is absurd. You are provided a well designed and frequented website that gives major exposure to the pets in your care for free. The cost involved in running that website is huge, and not once has PetRescue ever attempted to charge rescues to use it. You speak as if rescues are doing PetRescue s favour for using the website and should be somehow compensated for that (???) but if PetRescue wasn't a valuable resource for rescues and pounds to use then they wouldn't use it, simple as that.

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Steve   

I also doubt that Petrescue would be eligible for such grants - Pacers was not when we were in that space.

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As I said earlier in the thread, Petrescue are unlikely to be eligible for 99% of animal welfare grants, which require your organisation to be directly caring for animals. It is you, the rescues, who are eligible for such grants.

I'm sorry but the idea of PetRescue paying rescue groups for each pet listing is absurd.

It's called sarcasm. And see how absurd it is to say $10 when PR are asking for $500 to make a Tinder app and $1000 to to run a Matchmaker's Project and nobody raises an eyebrow? We're not supposed to say anything because we get it for free. Free free free.

You speak as if rescues are doing PetRescue s favour for using the website and should be somehow compensated for that (???) but if PetRescue wasn't a valuable resource for rescues and pounds to use then they wouldn't use it, simple as that.

We are doing them a favour and I've no idea why nobody can see that. Where would Pet Rescue be without the groups who do the work? We have value despite the majority of groups not being able to 'remunerate' ourselves does that make us worthless and without right to question an organisation that represents us?

You aren't liquid right now. Tell me how much closer to your goal you would get if Team Dog was stuck working under PR as it's being run now.

And the Safe n Sound Pounds program was a $60,000 publicly funded project that has been taken up by 8 pounds at last count.

& More pounds use facebook to list their dogs than their PR accounts.

There was never an official announcement put out by them, but I left the organisation in November.

Major corporate funding partnerships - which rescue groups likely couldn't access anyway - always allowed us to run a small, well-resourced charity.

Animal care donations belong to rescue.

As above from the horse's mouth.

Profit needs to be sourced elsewhere.

banghead.gifbanghead.gifbanghead.gif

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Steve   

Powerlegs animal care donations were to me the donations they asked for to look after a litter of kittens etc I beleive that was a once only thing and they dont do that often if they do it at all now.

To me donations to support Petrescue made via their website are not in any way animal care donations.

PR have operated on donations and not just corporate sponsorship since day one.

Im sorry I can see how passionate you are about this and I'm trying to understand but I just cant see how private rescue are doing them any favours without ample reward. Clearly you are getting enquiries through - many of which lead to placement of animals and you have the ability to use them to promote your rescue which you wouldn't have if you didn't use them.If people didnt feel they were getting reward for using their site they would stop doing it even though you are getting the ability to do these things for free.

No one is saying that because some rescue groups dont have enough money to remunerate themselves that they are worthless and without right to question but any rescue group could have enough money to remunerate themselves with a revised business and management model.

I cant see how PR are taking money that you or any other rescue would get if they didn't get it or why they shouldn't ask and receive donations.

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Malti   

Powerlegs animal care donations were to me the donations they asked for to look after a litter of kittens etc I beleive that was a once only thing and they dont do that often if they do it at all now.

To me donations to support Petrescue made via their website are not in any way animal care donations.

PR have operated on donations and not just corporate sponsorship since day one.

Im sorry I can see how passionate you are about this and I'm trying to understand but I just cant see how private rescue are doing them any favours without ample reward. Clearly you are getting enquiries through - many of which lead to placement of animals and you have the ability to use them to promote your rescue which you wouldn't have if you didn't use them.If people didnt feel they were getting reward for using their site they would stop doing it even though you are getting the ability to do these things for free.

No one is saying that because some rescue groups dont have enough money to remunerate themselves that they are worthless and without right to question but any rescue group could have enough money to remunerate themselves with a revised business and management model.

I cant see how PR are taking money that you or any other rescue would get if they didn't get it or why they shouldn't ask and receive donations.

I believe Powerlegs could be getting frustrated because no matter what anyone says, it is either dismissed, or 'no, not possible that people are donating to them thinking they are rescue' and take it up with ASIC or the ACNC if you have a problem. Why can't you just say things as you see them, even if they aren't all good things without someone replying that those people see the whole idea of the organisation as terrible?

Why should rescues have to 'revise business and management models'? May be that is not their intent to ever remunerate themselves, or ever want to have a larger organisation, but don't really want a listing site getting confused as rescue.

Here is some of the crystal clear understanding of the public and PR role as a listing website.

‘Thank you Pet Rescue for trying to rehome all sorts of Pooches & Kitties! They would be lost without you!’

‘****** added a new photo to PetRescue's Timeline — feeling blessed.

I owe you a massive thank you for the hard work and love you show countless animals day after day, year after year. Without you, this little rascal and I would never have crossed paths, and I just cant imagine life without her waggy tail by my side. She is without doubt, the happiest pup in the world, she makes friends everywhere we go, and has endless love to give’ - PR had to share it and add in the rescue group from where the dog came from

“*****‎ to PetRescue

Can your rescue help get an owner or foster for Benji at Renbury Farm pound Nsw . Very urgent... Also a white young male too . Both have been there for longer than they will keep them etc . Could you repost to sll groups you know please????’

A response to someone that aimed their comment at a specific rescue, so Petrescue now make adoptions quicker and are going ot make rescues to reply faster?

‘Thank you for taking the time to share your feedback with us and I'm sorry to hear that you didn't have a fantastic experience searching for a new fur baby.

Here at PetRescue, we have taken on board the feedback from adopters about the application process and we are on a mission to make it easier for all involved, meaning pets get in to loving homes a lot faster. At the moment we are currently fundraising for our MatchMakers Project in which we aim to build a new communication system that makes it quicker and faster for adopters to apply for a pet, but also to get a faster answer from the rescue groups. We are working hard to have this available over the next 6 months, so hopefully when you are ready to search again for a new family member you will be able to use this system.

When you feel ready to start looking again, we would be happy to recommend some groups around you that may be more responsive. Also, you may find that going to a shelter would be beneficial, as you can meet the dog there and then, and they often have very flexible adoption processes.

Thank you again for your feedback and opening your heart and home to a rescue pet.

Team PetRescue’

‎’*****‎ to PetRescue

Thanks pet rescue! A year ago we adopted 'Charlie Brown' from your site and our lives have changed for the better. This beautiful little boy loves the water, adventuring with his big fur sister Milly and generally loves life. He makes us laugh every day... And has perfected the art of destroying every bed we buy him. It's beautiful to see how in love Charlie Brown is with my fiancé too. We love him dearly and feel extremely privileged to be his forever mum and dad. Thankyou for the amazing work you do

Petrescues response

PetRescue It looks like Charlie Brown is pretty happy you chose him too! Thank you for giving him so much love <3 Which rescue group did you adopt him from so we can give them a shout out?

**New owner** No we don't know what the rescue group are called! It was a lovely lady in Wagga that we got him from..’

These are but a few, should I go on? The onus is not just on prospective owners, nor on the rescue groups, I imagine she would have received paperwork with the dog that would have had the rescue’s name. But people don’t go past the badging all over their website that states PR rehomed 36**** pets.

As Petrescue says

“PetRescue is a national animal welfare charity enabling all Australians to discover the joy and unconditional love a rescue pet brings. With the awesome support of a growing community of pet lovers, PetRescue.com.au is now Australia’s most visited charity website, helping to save the lives of thousands of homeless pets every month.”

They are a listing website just like Gumtree, not rescue. They can't save one life with their website on it's own, they need rescues and pounds to do that.

Since you are so clear on it, if I donate $1000 to PR how do I save 100 lives?

How $10 every month for 12mths saves 12 lives?

This is what PR tells me donation does.

You don’t mind that they got $60 000 donated to print safe pound booklets that saw a few pounds sign up? That was a good investment...... :confused:

There is no limit they are saying they need for their doggy tinder, for an app for phones, they just have both hands out, and as rescues put their animals on there, you now get ANOTHER donation ploy, you have a pop up to donate for 'The Adoptables' which has a corporate sponsor to donate the same amount as the public do.

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Thank you Malti.

Apparently I'm one of the last rescuers to bother posting on Dol regularly anymore so it sounds like I'm alone in this but offline .... not so much. laugh.gif

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Steve   

Im hearing you and Im trying to see it from both points of view.

The 60,000 and only X amount of sign up isnt counted because thats an ongoing thing and if it goes anywhere its going to take years.

I cant understand if you are so convinced they are taking donations under any kind of false pretence why you don't report them and have it looked at

I would have thought small rescue would be more concerned about other things they are doing.

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Im hearing you and Im trying to see it from both points of view.

The 60,000 and only X amount of sign up isnt counted because thats an ongoing thing and if it goes anywhere its going to take years.

I cant understand if you are so convinced they are taking donations under any kind of false pretence why you don't report them and have it looked at

I would have thought small rescue would be more concerned about other things they are doing.

Now you're just getting condescending. I suggest as someone who has other things to do that don't involve rescuing, your time would be better spent elsewhere than perpetually going around in circles.

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Steve   

Im hearing you and Im trying to see it from both points of view.

The 60,000 and only X amount of sign up isnt counted because thats an ongoing thing and if it goes anywhere its going to take years.

I cant understand if you are so convinced they are taking donations under any kind of false pretence why you don't report them and have it looked at

I would have thought small rescue would be more concerned about other things they are doing.

Now you're just getting condescending. I suggest as someone who has other things to do that don't involve rescuing, your time would be better spent elsewhere than perpetually going around in circles.

I didn't mean to be condescending please accept my apologies if that's how I sounded and thank you for your rather rude advice but for your information much of what we do does involve rescue and it certainly does involve understanding current issues which affect our rescue and foster carer members. For the record On a daily basis part of what I do involves rescue including looking after the rescue dogs I have here and speaking to and meeting with hundreds of people involved in rescue and foster care each year.

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Im hearing you and Im trying to see it from both points of view.

The 60,000 and only X amount of sign up isnt counted because thats an ongoing thing and if it goes anywhere its going to take years.

I cant understand if you are so convinced they are taking donations under any kind of false pretence why you don't report them and have it looked at

I would have thought small rescue would be more concerned about other things they are doing.

Now you're just getting condescending. I suggest as someone who has other things to do that don't involve rescuing, your time would be better spent elsewhere than perpetually going around in circles.

I didn't mean to be condescending please accept my apologies if that's how I sounded and thank you for your rather rude advice but for your information much of what we do does involve rescue and it certainly does involve understanding current issues which affect our rescue and foster carer members. For the record On a daily basis part of what I do involves rescue including looking after the rescue dogs I have here and speaking to and meeting with hundreds of people involved in rescue and foster care each year.

I am fully aware of what you do.

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Steve   

Im hearing you and Im trying to see it from both points of view.

The 60,000 and only X amount of sign up isnt counted because thats an ongoing thing and if it goes anywhere its going to take years.

I cant understand if you are so convinced they are taking donations under any kind of false pretence why you don't report them and have it looked at

I would have thought small rescue would be more concerned about other things they are doing.

Now you're just getting condescending. I suggest as someone who has other things to do that don't involve rescuing, your time would be better spent elsewhere than perpetually going around in circles.

I didn't mean to be condescending please accept my apologies if that's how I sounded and thank you for your rather rude advice but for your information much of what we do does involve rescue and it certainly does involve understanding current issues which affect our rescue and foster carer members. For the record On a daily basis part of what I do involves rescue including looking after the rescue dogs I have here and speaking to and meeting with hundreds of people involved in rescue and foster care each year.

I am fully aware of what you do.

Im not interested in public tit for tat and find it hard to understand why you would say what you did if you were fully aware of what I do these days.

Ive taken your advice on board apologised if I sounded condescending and prefer to stay on topic and not have to feel I need to defend why I come here or why I wanted to understand what you see as a problem.

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dog_fan   

What I think is the relationship pet rescue and rescues have is a symbiotic relationship.

Each party gets something out of the relationship that helps them.

If a rescue does not want to be involved then they don't have to.

Building a website following is very hard and to reach as many people as pet rescue does is a good reason for rescue to use the free service.

I really do not understand what the issue is.

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