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Tahmana1

Seller needs advice

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Tahmana1   

I have sold a puppy at 8 weeks old

Mum had c section puppies perfectly fine at birth. Vet Checked microchipped and vaccinated at 6 weeks perfectly healthy.

new owner has just messaged and asked for refund without return of puppy stating puppy has heart murmur but no proof of vet receipts or proof of condition.

I have contacted my vet who is happy to pass on records to new owners vet but all new owners want is refund without proof 

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You obviously need proof. 
Perhaps they don't understand they are required to provide proof?It would be the same for an insurance claim for a car/fridge/whatever...the insurer can not just take a buyer's word. 
Maybe just ask for their Vet's contact details ..that way you can bypass them and get correct information , so as to provide whatever support is necessary . 

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Tahmana1   

I spoke to my vet and  gave the new owner my vet details and asked them to get their vet to contact my vet but they keep saying how are you going to compensate us? 

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22 minutes ago, Tahmana1 said:

I spoke to my vet and  gave the new owner my vet details and asked them to get their vet to contact my vet but they keep saying how are you going to compensate us? 

You cannot compensate them until you have seen proof of the illness. That seems simple enough to understand .

explain that you cannot decide on compensation, until you have seen  the extent of the murmur, and the prognosis .

Edited by persephone
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BDJ   

As persephone said - it is not realistic to expect compensation for something just because someone says it's so.   Regardless of whether it is a puppy, a horse or a dishwasher - contacting someone and saying 'there is an issue, I won't provide any information - but give me money' is (at best) naive and unrealistic or (at worst) likely to escalate and become nasty.

 

I would strongly recommend putting everything in writing (email, SMS, snail mail).   Even if the conversation is verbal, make (and keep) notes and follow up in writing (... thanks for the information/update, as I said ... here are my vet details/please send me XYZ/who is your vet etc/I am happy to take back the puppy and return your money.... whatever).  No ones memory is perfect, so it is useful for all parties.

 

Assuming it is above board and not someone trying the shonk, they are most likely extremely stressed and scared about their new family member, and quite possibly are getting some silly advice (could be anything from 'they (the breeder) HAS to .......'  or 'dont tell them anything, they will use it against you' or something equally unhelpful.   Which is another reason why putting something in writing is helpful, they can read it later when they are not as emotion and may later realise the request is common sense.

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Tahmana1   

I will definitely put everything in writing and make sure I get proof of everything before anything is decided thank you all for your comments0

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Dogsfevr   

How old is puppy at present ??
Does your puppy sales contract have a"this kind of scenario" mentioned in it ??
You need to keep the relationship between yourself & the person feeling like there being heard whilst also ensuring the same applies to you
We like all the others would request a written report from the vet who diagnosed it note a verbal chat .
This could be a case of a vet scaring the new owners who jumped to the next level,many vets seem to screw up in this area as well  & alot seem to get it wrong with heart murmurs.
Either way for both parties what you need to make clear is its important for you to get the correct info .
Once that is received depending on the way the vet has written it we would get our vet to read it .
We would then offer to pay for a second opinion with a a heart specialist or a heart savvy vet if we felt the owner needs that middle person to go forward .
Dont mention anything about there vet  just stick what has been presented that there is an issue & you need the vets written report to go forward .
Make sure you copy all the messages & place in a folder .


 

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8 hours ago, Tahmana1 said:

I have sold a puppy at 8 weeks old

Mum had c section puppies perfectly fine at birth. Vet Checked microchipped and vaccinated at 6 weeks perfectly healthy.

new owner has just messaged and asked for refund without return of puppy stating puppy has heart murmur but no proof of vet receipts or proof of condition.

Normally refunds require return of merchandise, and under law, puppies are merchandise.  Often breeders are generous and agree to pay some vet costs or give a partial refund if the pup isn't returned.  Of course you can do a full refund, but as others say, you need proof.  Not just detection of a minor heart murmur, either. I suspect you are entitled to demand a second opinion from a specialist. 

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asal   

a pup my brother bred, the vet said his heart sounded so bad he wasn't even going to vaccinate him. My brother told him to vaccinate him and kept him as a pet.

he lived to 7 years and they only lost him when he knocked over the kitchen tidy and stole cooked chicken bones and one perforated his stomach.

 

One I bred developed serious heart murmour at six months and died in her sleep at 2 1/2.  it is a complete lottery.

 

Friend had one was diagnosed at first vaccination like my brothers and lived to 9

 

 

which makes it hard to as to what will be the outcome.

 

no proof no pay and right to second opinion, and you can decide on money back on return or pup or a percentage if they want to keep it, as the others have said.

 

 

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Boronia   
1 hour ago, asal said:

a pup my brother bred, the vet said his heart sounded so bad he wasn't even going to vaccinate him. My brother told him to vaccinate him and kept him as a pet.

he lived to 7 years and they only lost him when he knocked over the kitchen tidy and stole cooked chicken bones and one perforated his stomach.

 

One I bred developed serious heart murmour at six months and died in her sleep at 2 1/2.  it is a complete lottery.

 

Friend had one was diagnosed at first vaccination like my brothers and lived to 9

 

 

which makes it hard to as to what will be the outcome.

 

no proof no pay and right to second opinion, and you can decide on money back on return or pup or a percentage if they want to keep it, as the others have said.

 

 

what asal said 5f0265cfb4169_Screenshotfrom2018-02-2514-51-22.png.7ad596229932149aa94df5ba7da9d70f.png

...definitely get proof and get the puppy back and refund the money, bugger them and their wanting the money back and keeping the pup, that's just not on!

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Dogsfevr   
9 hours ago, Boronia said:

 

...definitely get proof and get the puppy back and refund the money, bugger them and their wanting the money back and keeping the pup, that's just not on!

Actually alot of breeders will fully refund the pup,partially refund  & allow them to keep it.Its not always that black n white BUT its based on having all the correct info at hand & making a decision in the best interests of all parties  & the dog .
Some may offer a replacement pup & still allow them to keep the current pup .
If the owners decide to keep it then its important to have a waiver signed about the agreement made & the owners decision fully aware off what is ahead .

There are times where it is in the dogs best interests for it to stay in a very loved home & an owner who is prepared to deal with the long term/short term or anything in between & the reason why still trying to keep a good relationship a must at this highly emotional time for puppy owners .
There vet may have explained it a manner that has created an issue ,there vet may have misdiagnosed or this pup does have an issue that the breeder needs to have info about just as much whether it comes under the Shit happens category or is something that can occur within the breed .

We breed a dog that had a murmur we held on to her until the age the vet felt it would age out or get worse.
It disappeared as per there diagnosis & she lived till 15 yrs with her adoring owners .

A good reason for breeders to send pup home with the free 6 weeks pet insurance
 

Edited by Dogsfevr
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JRG   

Does anyone know what the law is now in NSW?

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Tahmana1   

Pup is 5months old nothing was picked up at birth or 8week check and I kept in contact to inform of 12week check and worming etc and nothing was obviously picked up at 12week check have contacted new owner explained i can not come to a conclusion until we have proof of any illness and there vet has contacted mine 

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Tahmana1   

I haven't heard from my vet to let me know if new owners vet has contacted them.

New owners have said they have to wait 6 weeks to see cardiologist because of lock down laws in Victoria does any one know how true this would be or wether they would get an exemption because its serious???

 

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Dogsfevr   
4 hours ago, Tahmana1 said:

I haven't heard from my vet to let me know if new owners vet has contacted them.

New owners have said they have to wait 6 weeks to see cardiologist because of lock down laws in Victoria does any one know how true this would be or wether they would get an exemption because its serious???

 

I would imagine it could be legit .

Whilst the vet world is an essential service the specialist even if still working has to work to the guidelines so no doubt there appointment schedule wait time longer due to Covid 

 

Edited by Dogsfevr
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I have been going through victoria checkpoints to continue hydrotherapy for  my dog. I know other customers from outside the restricted areas have entered the restricted areas for same dog services. 
 

We have letters explaining and saying where we are going/rehab centre details etc. My checkpoint guy was equally happy to view receipts instead of letters but the letter was what I used. 
 

Then it’s just a matter of following the safety guidelines eg I hand the dog over and wait in the car park. 

Edited by Two Best Dogs!
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