Anyone here use prebiotics / probiotics?

[cyphix333]

I'm looking to add prebitoics/probiotics to our dogs diets and I know different dogs will get different results on different types, but I was just generally looking to see what others have had success with so I could then go on to read about each one further and see what one sounds best for our situation.

 

If you have used on or are currently using one, what one do you use and what was the primary purpose for adding it to your dogs diet?

 

Also, do you use it every day or say for a couple of weeks every few months to "maintain" a good balance?

[sandgrubber]

Evidence for probiotics isn't great

https://skeptvet.com/Blog/2019/10/no-good-news-for-veterinary-probiotics/

[Papillon Kisses]

My experience FWIW.
 

Protexin - I only have success with it after a course of one specific antibiotic that is prescribed to dogs post-operatively. That particular antibiotic can’t be given concurrently with Protexin. Prescribed by vet, I think for diarrhoea post antibiotics.

 

Purina Fortiflora - no effect. Prescribed by vet for IBD in conjunction with everything else (prescription diet, meds etc).

 

Big Dog - decided to give it a shot when the first two weren’t helping with his IBD but it too had no effect. Chose it instead of Blackmores as Blackmores has extra ingredients in it and I didn’t want to upset the IBD apple cart, and because Big Dog has the same strains as Purina Calming Care and it wasn’t available in Australia at the time (my dog has GAD and OCD).

 

Speaking of which, I’ve head good things about Purina Calming Care for some dogs with anxiety. It does not take the place of behaviour modification, management and medication (if meds also needed), but I’d give it a go if you are covering those essentials.

 

Perhaps ask your vet if they think it’s worthwhile spending money on probiotics, and if so keep a diary so you can try to be objective? It might be that something else is more appropriate like a diet change if there is GI upset?

 

That article you posted is interesting, sandgrubber. For Malcolm’s IBD flares, metronidazole is gold!

[cyphix333]

9 hours ago, sandgrubber said:

Evidence for probiotics isn't great

https://skeptvet.com/Blog/2019/10/no-good-news-for-veterinary-probiotics/

 

Thanks. I realise there isn't any conclusive evidence at the moment, but there has been some anecdotal reports as well as varying other studies of them being helpful for certain things; and honestly there shouldn't be any harm in trying them out and seeing if they help your dog, if they do, great, if not then nothing lost?

 

I checked out that link and the associated study, and came to pretty much the same conclusion, there is a lack of strong evidence to support probiotics, but that linked study isn't any evidence against them because of it's varied limitations, namely referencing many underpowered studies and also not having any information on the strains used, which make a BIG difference.

 

Additionally, this study doesn't factor in the use of prebiotics as well.

 

I also checked out some of the referenced studies regarding certain points, of which had some level of promise to them.

 

Potential advantages to using VSL#3 strains for dogs with IBD:

 

(Though study you referenced stated that "it took longer to achieve remission with probiotics compared with conventional treatment.")

 

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0094699

 

Stimulation of Immune Functions in young dogs with Enterococcus faecium:

 

https://academic.oup.com/jn/article/133/4/1158/4688074

 

Also, just as an interest point, I found this study previously and it found an association between gut microbiome structure and dog aggression:

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6330041/

 

Of note: "Consistently, the genus Lactobacillus was more abundant in aggressive dogs, while the genus Fusobacteria was more abundant in non-aggressive dogs (p < 0.05, q < 0.2). "

 

However they do stress that further studies are needed against other dog populations and larger sample sizes.

 

Just some other ones I found (if of interest):

 

https://www.vetfolio.com/learn/article/clinical-benefits-of-probiotic-canine-derived-bifidobacterium-animalis-strain-ahc7-in-dogs-with-acute-idiopathic-diarrhea

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29212912/

http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S0103-84782010001000019

 

8 hours ago, Papillon Kisses said:

Big Dog - decided to give it a shot when the first two weren’t helping with his IBD but it too had no effect. Chose it instead of Blackmores as Blackmores has extra ingredients in it and I didn’t want to upset the IBD apple cart, and because Big Dog has the same strains as Purina Calming Care and it wasn’t available in Australia at the time (my dog has GAD and OCD).

 

Thanks. We actually did ask our vet recently and yeah, he basically said there isn't a lot of evidence so far.

 

As for your dogs IBD, check out that study I posted above

Edited March 1, 2021 by cyphix333

[Papillon Kisses]

Oh. That’s interesting. I knew about the dog aggression study, but not that particular IBD one. Same bacteria implicated. It would be nice if it wasn’t a proprietary overseas product about which they refuse to give information.

[cyphix333]

36 minutes ago, Papillon Kisses said:

Oh. That’s interesting. I knew about the dog aggression study, but not that particular IBD one. Same bacteria implicated. It would be nice if it wasn’t a proprietary overseas product about which they refuse to give information.

 

Seems like it's caught up in some legality mess: https://www.visbiome.com/blogs/visbiome-vs-vsl-3/note-to-healthcare-professionals-and-patients

 

Without reading the whole page unsure if the same formula is still even made and is the one referenced in the study, and what the difference is between Visbiome and the below:

 

https://www.vsl3.com/

 

But either way, that is a massive amount of CFU's haha - usable for dogs?