crispy

She looks good to me. Personally I would keep her weight reasonably the same, maybe a very slight increase(talking half a kilo at the most) and just concentrate on giving her a good quality diet and getting and keeping her fitness up.

has this owner ever had a dog before, doesnt sound like it. Dogs are far better off lean. Its great lots of experienced dog owners are giving their views.

A fat dog is not a healthy dog. This breed in particular should look the way your dog does.

So, are you all suggesting she is fine the way she is and not try and put weight on her?

I will upload more photos after work.

If she looks anything like the pic that PF posted I wouldn't be in a rush to get weight on her. I also wouldn't be in a rush to change her diet until she has settled in. If you don't know much about raw feeding do your research on it first too - the Ian Billinghurst books are a good starting point: http://www.drianbillinghurst.com/products.php?pid=2

Just a question though. If you were so digusted by her condition, she was wobbly on her feet and the breeders story seemed dodgy (ie, she was at a mates place for 4 weeks) then why did you take her in the first place Aren't you getting a new pup in a few weeks anyway? Just curious...

That dog looks great in the photo. Dogs are not meant to be bulky. The more they weigh the more chance of complications. Most dogs in Aus are overweight, probably because the Aussie just loves their dog so much they overfeed. Be grateful you can always feed the dog a bit more to put on weight but it's dam hard to get an overweight dog to lose weight.

So, are you all suggesting she is fine the way she is and not try and put weight on her?

I will upload more photos after work.

If she looks anything like the pic that PF posted I wouldn't be in a rush to get weight on her. I also wouldn't be in a rush to change her diet until she has settled in. If you don't know much about raw feeding do your research on it first too - the Ian Billinghurst books are a good starting point: http://www.drianbillinghurst.com/products.php?pid=2

Just a question though. If you were so digusted by her condition, she was wobbly on her feet and the breeders story seemed dodgy (ie, she was at a mates place for 4 weeks) then why did you take her in the first place Aren't you getting a new pup in a few weeks anyway? Just curious...

That dog looks great in the photo. Dogs are not meant to be bulky. The more they weigh the more chance of complications. Most dogs in Aus are overweight, probably because the Aussie just loves their dog so much they overfeed. Be grateful you can always feed the dog a bit more to put on weight but it's dam hard to get an overweight dog to lose weight.

R.I.P. Smudge.

to you Crispy.

Bully I appreciate the hug. I sure need something to get me thru. I can still feel smudge mulling around my feet. I guess that's a good thing. I know she is gone but I can still feel her presence. Weird I know, but I guess after 13 years, that's normal.

So sorry to hear about your lovely Smudge. What was the vaccine for...not heartworm by any chance Some collies have adverse reactions to the heartworm injection.

Hi Sheena, not heartworm as I was told not required.Just the usual , distemper, hepititis, paranfluenza, bordetella. She also had a glucosamine shot.

Your BC is gorgeous. Thank you for sharing your photo.

* I suggest making this a sticky *

The below link is to an Australian Government portal where anyone and everyone can - and should - report adverse reactions to veterinary medications and chemicals. I believe this includes vaccines. A very tiny percentage of medication-related adverse events are ever reported by vets themselves, so we, as pet owners, must make sure that we always submit our own reports. This will hopefully help researchers and legislators to monitor and improve the safety and efficacy of our pets' medicines.

Report Your Pet's Adverse Reaction Here

Good work UltimatePup. I will certainly be submitting my report tonight.

Thanks,

Crispy

:D RIP beautiful girl, you were much loved.

Dont beat your self up Crispy, we all try to to the best we can for our pals and somethings do involve risks that we cant allways know about.

Thank you BCPuppy. What a beautiful photo. BC'S are always puppies at heart. :rolleyes:

I am so very sorry. What an awful thing to happen. A similar thing just happened to my friend's 7 year old dog, who just made it through. My heart goes out to you.

I find it truly amazing - really amazing - that so many vets are still giving annual vaccine shots when the guidelines for several years now have been to not to that due to the known health risks and lack of immunological benefit. The official vet guidelines are to do triannual - a happy medium. It's so hard, though, to find a vet who abides by this and does not just ignorantly jab our pets so unnecessarily.

BUT - and that is a HUGE BUT - it is your VET's responsibility to know this, not yours!!!!! We should be able to trust our vets, our doctors, but alas their training on vaccination is often from the profit-motivated manufacturers themselves. A crazy situation. Or, like my local vet, they do it for the income; the vet nurse told me that her boss does it only for fear of reduced income .

Another 'but' is that your pooch was 13 - quite a vulnerable age where the ice gets very thin. If it wan't that it may well have been the very next minor thing to affect her little old bod - a tummy upset, the sniffles, an injury. It was perhaps her time, too. I know that's little comfort right now. There's no 'right' time ever for these things!!! I am so very sorry. Please don't blame yourself. It sounds like you have been a very caring and thoughtful doggy parent.

Thanks Ultimate Pup. I'm glad your friend's dog made it through. We all work for the money, but it is so totally wrong for vets not to disclose possible complications, so that doggy owners can make an informed decision. I'm sure our vet is no different to all the others, considering I dropped in and reported Smudge's side effects and her night spent at another vets surgery to the receptionist. Our vet has not responded, no concern, no compassion. I guess it's all about liability.

What a sad, sad state of affairs. I just wanted the vet to show they cared.

It's true it is never a good time to go and it was perhaps her time. Sadly her passing away coincided with the vaccination.

Please doggy owners, just be aware that there are risks involved with vaccination.

We all love our little pals.

Crispy I'm so sorry for your loss. Don't blame yourself. It may be that it wasn't the actual vaccine, but that Smudge had an underlying problem that may have been worsened by the excitment of the trip to the vet.

Did they rule out bloat as a possible cause too?

I agree with others though, perhaps talk to your vet about completing the form.

Again I'm very sorry. RIP Smudge

Stormy yes I've thought of that, quite possible, I just think at her age perhaps a vaccine was not necessary. Also she like many dogs hated the vets and would stress and become quite anxious.

The vet didn't mention bloat at all, and I don't know much about it. They did say that the symptoms appeared to be a reaction to the vaccine.

Thank-you for your condolences. I am finding it so helpful and comforting to share my thoughts with so many caring people.

I'm so sorry Crispy. My dog had a bad reaction to Sentinel Spectrum, he was nearly 14 and he ended up having to be put to sleep. I found it so difficult to get over the fact that I had killed my dog. He was the most gentlest, kindest dog and I felt like a big ogre killing him. If you know in your heart that it was the vaccine, you have to find a way to get past that. What kind of helped me was to think that it was a rather quick & painless passing compared to the other multitude of ways that he could have died.... I dunno, it's so hard and I know exactly what you're going through. The irony of it all is that it happened because you loved your baby so much :-(

Thanks Akay for sharing your very, very sad story. It is so helpful to speak to people who have had to part with their beloved dog. You loved your dog so much, hard to over totally. Smudge was also gentle, kind and so trusting. I have the same feeling that I killed her and yes it happened because I cared for her so much. It is possible that she had an underlying condition that had not been diagnosed and the vaccine reaction even though she appeared to have semi recovered was just too much for body cope with. If I relive the past few days and with the knowledge that I have know, I would have not vaccinated.

And yes I've thought about how her final days could have been a lot worse. I am grateful that she died at home. The night before she died, she greeted a visitor with a bark, sneaked in the house and stole some cat food, ate her steak and had along massage from me. I kissed her goodnight and told her I loved her.

I know that time will help me heal, and I will always have wonderful memories of the time we spent together.

hi dollygirl,

you lost your baby, I lost my girl too. I feel your grief. My heart is heavy, I can't function well at the moment. Keep thinking of the good times you had. Only time heals.

keep your chin up

RIP Baby

So sorry for your loss, I can understand how devestated you must feel.

My oldest dog had a severe reaction to his first Kennel cough vaccine and if I had not have been with him and noticed the reaction, his whole face swelled, nose throat he couldn't breath etc. We raced him back to the vet where they gave him a anti hystamine (sp) shot and within a minute or so he could breath better but it took ages for the swelling to go down. The vet said it is uncommon but does happen on occasion. We were just very lucky.

RIP Smudge, Sounds like she had a beautiful and cherished life with you.

Thanks, tlc, for sharing your experience. It must have been frightening. Sometimes luck is on your side. The photos of your dogs are beautiful

I'm so sorry to read this, my condolences to you. RIP Smudge

I know it's all very raw at the moment, but when you can, could you check whether either vet has submitted an adverse reaction report. From the Australian Veterinary Association website "Any adverse event should be reported, identifying the product, animal and reaction involved, to the manufacturer and the Australian Pesticides and Veterinary Medicines Authority (APVMA) Adverse Experience Reporting Program." http://www.ava.com.au/policy/67-vaccination-dogs-and-cats

Thanks for the advise Jackie I will find out if the vet actually reported all this information to the right people

I'm so sorry to read this, my condolences to you. RIP Smudge

I know it's all very raw at the moment, but when you can, could you check whether either vet has submitted an adverse reaction report. From the Australian Veterinary Association website "Any adverse event should be reported, identifying the product, animal and reaction involved, to the manufacturer and the Australian Pesticides and Veterinary Medicines Authority (APVMA) Adverse Experience Reporting Program." http://www.ava.com.au/policy/67-vaccination-dogs-and-cats

Thanks for the advise Jackie I will find out if the vet actually reported all this information to the right people

So sorry for your loss. I have lost a dog to vaccine reaction, a much younger dog and much less peacefully.

Sorry to hear that Sandra777, I am grateful that I had 13 wonderful years with Smudge.

Was that the first time your dog had a reaction and have you got another dog now and do you have it vaccinated?

Oh You thought you were doing the right thing for your girl.... not your fault at all.She died at home.. amongst familiar things ...

R I P Smudge ...

Thanks persephone. That's right she passed away on the front lawn, her favourite viewing spot. We've laid her to rest in a lovely spot in the garden and I can visit her and look out at her from the window. I must be grateful for the 13 wonderful years we had together. :D

Oh dear, Crispy. I am so sorry for your very unexpected loss. Do not think for an instance that you contributed to Smudge's passing. Even if it was vaccination related, YOU FOLLOWED YOUR VET'S ADVICE AND RECOMMENDATION and it is the "Vets -vs- the bureaucracy of the manufacturers issue" who would be those who are at fault. Thank you for telling your tale though - I think it is worth the telling for someone else to read and think about. But in the meantime be kind to yourself. You love Smudge and Smudge knew that. RIP Smudge .

Thank-you so much for your reassurance. It's times like this that you doubt yourself & think what if I?????

I loved Smudge and yes she loved me. She knew that I only wanted to do my best for her.

I know she entered heaven through the doggy door in the front gates :D

I took my 13 year old border collie, Smudge in for her annual vaccine on Monday morning. She was old but healthy. After her shot she was quiet, sleepy & hardly moved all day. At 5.30 she got up to eat her tea, shortly after stood up looked disorientated and then threw up.

I took her to an after hours vet, she had a temperature, abdominal swelling and was dehydrated. They took a blood test and found nothing of any concern. She was placed on a drip for hydration overnight.

I took her home at 12 noon that day. The vet said it was a reaction to the shot. She had never had any reaction before. She wasn't interested in food but had a little & was drinking water. She was lethargic for another 2 days, then perked up was alert & started eating.

The next morning I found she had passed away.

My poor beautiful mate, I feel that because I took her to be vaccinated and contributed to her to her death.

If I had done some research I would have decided against vaccination at her age.

There are a lot of articles that discuss the pros & cons of vaccinating every 12 months & the risk that you take with an older dog.

By the way I dropped into the vet's that vaccinated her & left a message with the secretary about the reaction, I can't believe that I have not heard back from them as to how Smudge is. I attended this vet practice for over 13 years.

Please don't make the same mistake as I did, read all you can on the topic. Smudge would still be with us for a little bit longer. Thank to this forum I can discuss my grief.

Miss my beautiful Smudgie. :D