Rilla-My-Rilla

Thanks everyone. I'll check them out :-)

Hi,

I own two Border Collies.

My first girl has just turned 2 and is from a show line, displaying only a small interest in working. I call her a hobby farm, not a worker :-)

My second is still a pup, he's nearly 6 months old and is from a line of good working border collies, his great grandmother was a kelpie so he's got the tan markings but has mostly border collie traits.

I'm looking for some good books on working with, living with and training working dogs.

We're on a small farm and have cattle, which I don't let the dogs work as my girl is too soft for them and Spud, the pup, is too young and inexperienced to handle cattle that haven't been "dog broken".

We will one day get sheep, hopefully in the near future, which they'll be able to work. I take the dogs to a friends in the mean time to get them started, Spud has only been once and has already proven he's going to be a really good worker.

The only Border Collie book I own is The Border Collie by Carol Price and I found it good for my first but it just doesn't cover enough about working instincts to be of any real help with Spud. He's in a bit of a funny situation as he's part pet part worker lol :-)

I would prefer the book to be Border Collie specific as I have found a difference between them and other working breeds mental abilities/state. Borders are a little weirder than other dogs I think... :-)

Anyway, any suggestions would be appreciated!

Sarah

Same breeder Rilla's from, the pup will actually be her cousin :-)

I'm not sure about showing or not yet...I really just want a pet and whether or not it's show quality comes second for me I guess! I can't wait until they're older and their little personalities start to show!

Ok though I might jump in here while I'm waiting for a puppy :-)

I bring home my second Border Collie in about 5 1/2 weeks. I'm not sure whether I'm getting a boy or a girl, as I haven't picked yet but have been doing weekly visits to the litter.

I've got a 16 month old female BC and she is still entire. She's had two seasons and will be getting desexed after the next one or so. I've noticed that she has a big growth spurt after each season, and as she is a petite girl I think this is important for her. Her breeder trusts me enough to let me keep her entire until I feel she is ready to be desexed and I have no problems keeping her secure during her seasons.

I noticed with my sister's male dog that he didn't stop growing until he was 18 months / 2 years and he has now been desexed as once he matured aggression was becoming an issue. He's now back to his lovely self.

I think it depends on the dog itself and believe it's really important for you to do what feels right, and be comfortable with your decision.

I'll just add that Rilla is on a raw food diet, so I don't have the option of using part of her dinner for training - not very practical to train with chicken wings or minced raw veggies :D

I think it depends on the dog. Try different treats & see which your dog absolutely loves.

When I'm doing basic tricks inside with Rilla, she'll work for plain cooked pasta bits - mostly because she loves doing her tricks, plus with me jumping around being silly she doesn't need a high value food reward.

When I'm training the recall I use cheese/any leftover cooked meat or liver/kangaroo treats.

I also used these super high value rewards when I did a photoshoot with her - she was surrounded by kids & doing a lot of staying in a high pressure situation she so needed something really great along side my praise.

Whenever I teach her something new, I use high value treats. I also make sure I mix her treats up, otherwise she starts getting bored with it. :)

My sister's dog is completely different though. He'll only work for dried liver at dog club, nothing else.

Just thinking about the waiting around thing. This is one of those situations where having the dog able to chill out in a crate or trolley (covered if necessary) is really valuable. My guys spend a lot of time in crates (and the occasional show boy in his trolley), so they're not at all fussed by having to spend a day waiting round at a trial. It's just a matter of getting them out for toilet breaks and then toilet and warm up just before going in - works for obedience, rally, agility and tracking. I think it's really important that they can relax in that situation. I hate to see people wandering round with their poor dogs all day - maybe it suits some dogs, but I thinkmost appreciate the rest time.

ETA Not saying it's what you guys do - but I see it over here sometimes.

Rilla loves her crate. The first night she wouldn't fall asleep so rotated from her crate to my lap (yep, my BC is a lap dog :laugh: )

Second night she slept soundly in her crate until I got her out for warm up.

To me a solid, proper recall means that the dog immediately turns and comes to you NO MATTER WHAT it's interested in. My 15 month old BC doesn't have one yet, although her recall is good enough for an obedience trial, I don't trust it once her herding instincts kick in.

Effective voice control is either when they have a solid recall, or perhaps if the dog stops, looks at you and doesn't keep going. Just charging on ahead & then coming back isn't control, it's the dog doing what ever it pleases. People shouldn't have their dogs of lead in a situation that they can't be controlled in. If I have any doubt of not being able to control Rilla, I don't let her off lead.

Well done Rilla and Mum!

Rally O seems the way to go... From what I've seen it's much friendlier and "user friendly" than pure obedience.

I've got a confession to make (sorry to high jack your thread); we went to our first obedience trial on Saturday and it was a bit of a disaster. Turned up at 8.30 for vetting, and they started to trial the highest level (Udx I think) and worked their way back. So we were only called in the ring at 3.00 or so, after waiting all this time on a fairly warm day that had turned very windy.

By then I was a bit over it, and so was Penny who wouldn't focus and just wanted to go sniff out duck poo. Of course I stuffed up, used her name to get her attention when I shouldn't have, told her to sit once, etc... The works!

Incidentally everyone else failed their ccd. Kinda put me off obedience for good!

Do you train Rilla in Rally O at your club or did you just go to the trial to suss it out? There's no Rally O training where we are...

Oh I know exactly how you must have felt! I sat there for hours waiting for my turn at the obedience trial too - the longer it took the more nervous I got I think!

I haven't been to my local dog club for several months. I've never been very impressed by their training and finally had a enough of it. Before I left I ran through the Rally-O course once, but was completely on my own as the trainers there weren't the best.

I thought I might have forgotten how to do it, but the judge walked me through before going in, and I walked the course a second time by myself. All you need to know basically is your different turns, ie. 270 to the left/right, 360 to the left/right, ect. You can download the rules and signs from ANKC website, that's what I did a few days before the trial. Just don't let the signs confuse you, it's really easy and relaxed once you get there. Being able to talk to and pat your dog in the ring makes it really comfortable feeling. :)

I think you & Rilla are going so wonderfully well. She is still very young.So you have time on your side. From my very limited understanding of dog sports, obedience it is very structured

compared to RO. So I would stick with RO for a while if that is what you both have the most fun doing. I think having fun & feeling comfortable is really important. That is what it is all about isn't

it? As beautiful Rilla matures the sky will be the limit for you to. Hats off to both of you I reckon I would love to be in your shoes one day & have a dabble in dog sports :)

Thank-you! I hope you do have a dabble one day :)

Thank-you Tassie! :D A bit of maturity will go a long way for Rilla I think - she's a bit of a butter at the moment, her herding instincts have really kicked in & with that seems to come endless energy :)

I learnt something about heeling from the rally-o trial. You know the sign that says "1 step, halt. 2 steps, halt. 3 steps, halt" ? I realised that stopping and starting like that really keeps Rilla's attention focused on me, so I've been putting that kind of method into her heeling training - lots of stops, turning and games in between really keeps her happy & I think our heeling had improved a fair bit already. :D

Nutter (or even butter :laugh: ) is cool! When a pup's got attitude and a sense of fun, you have a heap to play with.

I guess one of the things I've learnt over the years (including from some of the WA gurus on here), and that is working well with Rory, is to do tiny bits of high quality stuff - break off, have a play, and do something else. Gradually build up the duration. Spend lots of time on the disc or perch box getting heel position perfect, and building up a very high reward history for the dog being in, and getting to, heel. Then when you start moving - literally one or two steps and reward for holding perfect position. (For heeling practice, don't always sit - sometimes reward for position before the dog sits.)

Other things you can do once you start getting more duration, is something like the Rally 360 right or left, and the 270 - huge party for the dog holding position. Another trick for energising the dog is to turn sideways on and sort of grapevine with the dog across your front - then turn back to heeling forwards and again huge reward for the dog hitting heel position.

For our BCs - and in truth, probably for most dogs, your own pace needs to be nice and brisk and happy.

(IMHO, the kind of paddock bashing that happens at dog clubs can be pretty demotivating, and you don't get the chance to pay attention to precision. Just something to think about.)

Oh yes doing the full turns really gets her attention - she's like "something interesting must be happening if we're walking in circles" :laugh:

Oops, meant nutter not butter - on my phone so can't fix it. Don't you love auto correct?

Thank-you Tassie! :D A bit of maturity will go a long way for Rilla I think - she's a bit of a butter at the moment, her herding instincts have really kicked in & with that seems to come endless energy :)

I learnt something about heeling from the rally-o trial. You know the sign that says "1 step, halt. 2 steps, halt. 3 steps, halt" ? I realised that stopping and starting like that really keeps Rilla's attention focused on me, so I've been putting that kind of method into her heeling training - lots of stops, turning and games in between really keeps her happy & I think our heeling had improved a fair bit already. :D

Haha BC Crazy - she looks grown up but is in THE most puppy like mode at the moment! Lots of fun but lots of challenges too.

Her ears are perfect some days, other days they're feral - I don't mind but her poor breeder asks me all the time of I'd like her to tape them for me lol! :D

Thank-you so much for the encouragement everyone! It's really lovely :-)

Here's the pic of madam Rilla that I promised:

How was the second trial?

I was less nervous but still pretty bad. We got full marks for the drop-stay, 15/20 for the recall (she stuffed around a bit before I put her in the stay), 10/30 for heeling - our heeling sucks & I'm working on it; 0 for the sit-stay as she broke as soon as I left - I buggered up the signal on nerves; & 0 for the stand for exam as she broke position - she felt the need to kiss the judge :)

So 40 points, a fairly terrible score but I actually pretty happy with our performance, considering the night before we got 0 points on everything! I know that I have to work on how I feel a lot, because at home in the paddock (which is full of distractions), she does everything perfectly 90% of the time - because I'm absolutely relaxed!

I think for now I might just stick to Rally-O, as although everyone at the trial was super encouraging, the amount of pressure I put on myself about it isn't good for me or Rilla I don't think. However, with Rally-O, I have an very laid back attitude towards it.

I think in the obedience ring Rilla picks up on my nerves, doesn't take my commands seriously & so plays up on me a bit as I'm so nervous that I don't control her that well. The joys of owning a smart breed! As soon as the trial was finished I took her out to where the ring had been to play with her, and the little angel heeled on a perfectly loose lead all the way across it!! But I was relaxed and feeling really happy.

The judge told me that she never trials with a dog until it is 2 years old, as although she's done the training with them, they don't really settle down and "click" with whats going on until maturity.

My Mum came to the trial with me and pointed out that I do a lot of "front" work with Rilla - I do lots of tricks with her with her in front of me, facing me, not at my side. Plus I take her herding, which encourages her natural instinct to run out in front of me, and take my commands at a distance.

So overall I think I learnt a lot from the Obedience Trial. I know there's a lot for me to work on not only with Rilla, but with how stressed I let myself become in situations with her. I think we'll just do Rally-O for the mean time, in another 4 months I'll be able to start training her for Agility which I'm really looking forward to & think Rilla will really enjoy.

Haha you make is sound so easy Tassie! :D

I plan on being relaxed...but we'll see!

Thank-you! All the judges were really friendly & helpful - I was under the impression that judges were kind of mean lol!

By BC's name is Rilla & it carries a good distance ie when I take her up the paddock. I shorten it to Rill & lengthen it to Rillie or Rilla-My-Rilla :-)

So...the trial was last night....

Rilla was so calm but I was a nervous wreck, which (of course) really affected out performance in the ring. My sister took a video clip of me either the phone & I watched it as soon as I finished. No wonder my poor dog wouldn't do anything! My signals were WAY out, my body language was completly off - Oh my goodness! I think Rilla took one look at me at the beginning & said "you've clearly gone crazy Mum! Oh we'll, guess I'll do my own thing" LOL! I'm laughing about it this morning. I've got to go back tonight & I'm hoping I won't get as nervous!

On a more successful note - we ran the Rally-O course after that, it was heaps of fun & I was surprised & happy to hear at the end that we'd gotten a qualifying score of 92! I'm not actually sure what that means - I thought they had to get 3 qualifying scores under at least 3 different judges??

I'll take a pic of miss Rilla later with her medal & certificate :D

Plus I'm a firm believer in something I read somewhere which basically said whenever your dog stuffs up, it's almost always the handler's fault, not the dog's :)

Lol - thanks for that Tassie & TSD! I'm not at all worried about how Rilla behaves - she's technically still a puppy! :)

I'd be SHOCKED if I got a decent amount of points - just cause I know myself, plus Rilla's incredible at picking up on my moods/feelings :D

So I'm taking Rilla to her very first Obedience trial tonight...and I'm freaking out!!! I'm just going for fun, have a fair amount of confidence in her - it's my nerves I'm worried about! What do you do to stop nerves before a trial - and someone please tell me that after your first trial you won't feel nervous lol!

I won't even be attending the meeting - just thought I'd spread it around. Sorry if I have caused distress to anyone.

For anyone in the Atherton Tablelands area -

No doubt you will have heard of the horrible abuse of dogs being stolen for dog fighting in the area at the moment. A public meeting is being held for concerned residents, anyone who may have seen suspicious activity in their area and to discuss what the authorities are going to do about it.

When: Monday August 19th, 5:30pm

Where: Atherton Show Grounds, Merrilands Hall Cafeteria

The Mayor, local MP Shane Knuth, the police & stock squad will be present.

Thank-you! All sorted now - I hope we do have fun! :D