woody2shoes

benedryl is good for kennel cough.

10ml twice a day for dogs 20-30 kg

5ml twice a day for dogs 5-10kg

Thanks for the tip! At this stage only two of our gang has KC - the younger of the two has it worst so think I'll pick some Benadryl up at lunchtime for her.

Cheers!

w2s

We used sump oil and sulphur powder on our farm dog years ago - worked a treat... mix well and rub it into the affected area...

sump oil cured lots of things.. but made for very durty oily dogs!! :D

Thanks to everyone for your input.

I am very happy to report that our older girl with the sm is vastly improved. We were lucky to catch it early and only the hair around her eyes was affected and that is clearing up nicely. We don't have wombats around here but we do have lots of foxes and it's not uncommon for my dogs to put one up out of the dead cumbungi in the sidecut up our road every now and again. I guess that's where she's caught it.

In the meantime, I am now fighting Kennel Cough caught thanks to my sister bringing a coughing pup to my place for a visit!!!!

Thanks again to everyone.

w2s

I hate to admit it but one of my (six) dogs has been diagnosed with Sarcoptic Mange!!!!

We've never had fox mange here before despite living in the country and I still have no idea where she's managed to pick it up. She was barely showing any signs and in our ignorace, we had no idea what we were seeing - just some darkening of the skin around her eyes which was then followed by her rubbing her face on the wire of her pen. And I thought it was an allergy! Thankfully, only her closest kennel mate is showing some signs of scratching at his elbows and even he has improved vastly since being treated. All the others seem just fine, at least for now!

Needless to say, our girl has had one injection of Ivermectin (two more to follow) and all the others have been treated with Advocate and will be done again in a month's time.

In the meantime, I was just wondering what experience others have had (if any) with Sarcoptic Mange and how long it's likely to be before physical signs start to improve? Also, can anyone hazard a guess as to how she most likley caught the damn thing???? All our dogs are exercised regularly along a country road with access to the adjoining paddocks where they do, on occasion, like to have a roll in dead things Can a very old, dry piece of fox skin pass on mange mites???? Someone suggested that Sarcoptic Mange can only be caught from a live fox.

Did you 'quarantine' your affected dog from the others and if so, for how long?

Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks in advance,

w2s

Thanks everyone. That makes sense now.

w2s

The thing that has helped my old girl the most is a coat. Has had a more positive effect then even anti-inflam drugs.

Interesting that you should say that JulesP. My vet recently went through a list of things which should (hopefully! ;) ) help minimise future arthritic issues in my young lab who recently had bilateral surgery for elbow dyspalsia - and right near the top of that list was keeping my girl warm through the cold weather. Thankfully, I hald already thought to do that. More to the point though, it makes perfect sense when you consider how older, already arthritic dogs benefit from such a simple thing and a warm dog coat is an ideal way to do that.

Good luck BDL. Please keep us posted.

w2s

Hi,

Just wondering if anyone has had experience with this particular Anti Inflammatory drug? A friend of mine has had it prescribed for her dog as a less expensive alternative to Metacam. I would appreciate any feedback.

Thanks in advance.

w2s

Thank you very much for all the advice. I did forget to mention that my girl has been receiving cartrophen injections monthly, daily glucosamine/chondroitin, fish oil and cartrin (concentrated liquid cartilage) - all introduced as soon as she was diagnosed.

She is as lean as I can have her and I supplement her Royal Canin regularly with all the goodies people have been suggesting on these forums i.e. raw bones, yoghurt, grated apple, rolled oats soaked overnight, grated carrot and broccoli stems, etc.

I have already left a message with her vet regarding the gold beads and Ester C - and there is a bottle of Metacam on standby as well.

You have given me hope that perhaps - fingers and toes crossed - this is a temporary healing phase?!?!?!

Hi again Mossie,

There's no reason not to believe that this is all par of the healing process but whatever the outcome, rest easy knowing you're doing everything that's humanly possible to help your girl. Keep at it and don't lose heart.

w2s

I would love to hear from other members whose dog/s have undergone elbow arthroscopy.

My beautiful girl was diagnosed with elbow dysplasia - fragmentation of the medial coronoid process (FCP) at approx 10mths old. She subsequently underwent a double elbow arthroscopy to remove the chips. She was doing great until now - nearly 6 months later - she is limping again I am so sad for her!

Back to the vet we went only to be told that there is definitely pain in both elbows and pain killers/anti-inflammatories are the only option. Off to the surgeon we went as well only to be told that she would have this permanently. This was not supposed to happen - she is supposed to be pain free!!!!

Has anyone else experienced this? Is there a SAFE medication I can give my lovely lady on a long-term basis to offer some relief? Metacam was what I used post-op but do not want to use this long-term.

Hi Mossie,

I can so feel for what you're going through. I fully understand how heartbreaking the whole process is as I have recently had my 6mo lab bitch operated on for bilateral FCP - I went the open arthrotomy track though. Three months post surgery and she is progressing slowly but there are no guarantees this will continue so I am prepared for the worst if it should happen. I have to say that my surgeon was very, very guarded about the long term prognosis. At no point would he guarantee anything other than that she was better off with the fragments removed. I am 100% sure he was right in that regard, whatever happens down the track.

A good friend of mine has a male lab who was diagnosed with FCP, OCD and arthritic changes at 5mo and had bilateral arthroscopy. It took nearly 12 months for him to recover and he is in normal work now. I know he was intermittently lame over the recovery period. He is on a very low maintenance dose of 25mg Rimadyl/day which apparently, should have no effect but appears to help him! Go figure.

Each dog recovers differently which is why there are no guarantees I guess. My girl has had a couple of bouts of lameness after getting carried away (and like you, I was devastated!) but recovered over time and appears sound at this point. The thing I still see in her at times is a stiff-leggedness on rising, and some uncertainty when she runs which makes me believe that her joints just aren't 'right'...I guess there's a structural issue there. In any case, it is quite heartbreaking watching them when they aren't themselves, especially when you've done so much to try to get them right.

In an attempt to be proactive, I sounded my vet out about the long-term use of non-steroidal anti-inflammatories. Like you, I'd much rather not have to use any medication but my first priority is to have her as pain free as possible and from all the literature, NSAI appear to be very safe to use, particularly at a low dosage rate. I certainly won't hesitate if it comes to that.

As par for the course, my girl is on Joint Guard daily and will receive regular Pentosan injections. I'm keeping her lean and restricting her jumping activities wherever possible. Otherwise, she has returned to (albeit restricted) normal activities and is finally getting to act like a normal dog. Beyond that, it's a case of wait and see I guess.

Good luck.

w2s

I had an elderly Great Dane until very recently and my vehicle is a vito van with a raised floor for the dogs (gear goes underneath.) I looked around for steps or ramps and eventually did something completely different. I got a fold up table from 'Drifta' who make very hardy camping kitchens and the like. They had made the stuff I have already in the van. The table can support 100kgs but the legs fold down so its a little over one inch thick and the table top is about 2.5 foot by 3 foot. I had my very handy brother make me a non slip top for it which is made of canvas like a fitted sheet with pyramid matting attached to the top.

It is effectively a platform that is height adjustable (legs are adjustable in length) the dog setps up to the platform in one step then into the car on the next level. Easy!

Drifta here

Hi TJ,

Just out of curiousity, how much was the table you bought? I had a look at the link you supplied but couldn't seem to find the table you mentioned (but then I may have been having a boy's look! )

w2s

Thanks everyone!

On the recommendation of so many of you, I have ordered a Black Dog Treat Bag and Liner...should be here by Monday! Thanks for all your input.

w2s

I bought a plastic bait container from a fishing tackle store. It has a lock down lid & I can get my whole hand in it. It's also easy to clean.

That's a very clever idea!

w2s

Thanks everyone. The black dog ones do look good! I will see if I can get my local vet to order one in as they have black dog products available.

Cheers!

Hi all, I'd like to get myself a Treat Bag that's easier to access than the zip up 'bum bag' I currently own. I'd like something with a bigger opening and easier access. Any ideas please? And where can I buy one please (I'd have to get in by mail order)?

Thanks.

w2s

Hi everyone,

Thanks for all your input. I have a few options it seems...now I have to make a decision.

My lab with the elbows looks to be very sound following surgery (fingers crossed! ;)) I am just keen to reduce the amount of stress on her joints from jumping in and out of the ute over the years (and on my back from lifting her 25+kgs )

I really like the look of the stairs Caro, particularly the 5-step option as this would greatly reduce the angle of ascent/descent, as well as the distance between each step. And, being a horizontal plane, I think the likelihood of her taking to the equipment is greater. Caro, did your dog/s take to the stairs well? It sounds as though quite a few aren't too keen on the ramps or am I reading that wrong?

The lab that's going to be blind is currently fine and will be for a few years yet (hopefully!) so he has plenty of time to get used to whichever option I guess. I do suspect that it will be easier for him to 'feel' his way up and down a ramp in later years though so his owner (he's not my dog) will have to make a decision on that one.

Thanks once again to everyone for your help with this. Your feedback has been invaluable.

Cheers,

w2s

Love My Pet (www.lovemypet.com.au) sell the PetStep ramps (half and full size). I bought one myself and it's great, however Chloe won't go near it but enjoys watching me using it!! I think it's great though and will come in handy if I can ever get her to use it!!

hehehehehe

On that note, could I have some advice please (ideally anectdotal!) as to what type of equipment would best suit a) a dog with bad elbows and b) a blind dog who is otherwise fit and well - ramp or stairs? I am in a real quandary about this one.

Thank sin advance.

w2s

I have a twin cab ute and got pet loader stairs from the US and it still worked out cheaper than ordering a ramp from Australia (www.petloader.com). Plus the ramps take up a lot of space if you want to reach the back seat - too wide to get my dogs onto the backseat when parked in my driveway. I think they are designed for back of vehicle access or getting dogs onto floor level.

Otherwise prestige pets (the pet product distributors) does ramps and you can check their website for stockists of their ranges in your state. Plus most of the popular online pet stores have pet ramps. The main brands are 'petstep' and 'solvit'

If you do a search here I think there was a discussion last year about making your own ramp.

Thanks for the info Caro. I'll have a look at all the options you suggest.

Cheers.

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone can steer me in the direction of a lightweight, fold up dog ramp suitable for labs. It must be interchangeable between my 4WD ute and my husband's s/wagon. Most of the hits I've found on the internet are for American versions.

Thanks in advance.

w2s

I am having issues with a couple of my oldies that I was wondering if anyone has ever experienced before. For the past 12mths my gorgeous oldie Kayla has been having issues at meal times. She needs minimal food or she gets very fat and has difficulty walking. As a result food is extremely important to her and if I put the plate down in front of her she would consume it in seconds. This hasn’t really changed from years gone past but what has changed is her ability to swallow. I have to hand feed her over about 10 minutes or she chokes and even then at least once a fortnight I end up having to plunge my fingers down her throat and pull out food that has clogged in her throat, very scary.

Obviously she has been to the vet but he said there is nothing he can do, just old age. I have previously accepted that as she is in last stages lung cancer anyhow so I am really just trying to keep her comfortable but this last fortnight I have been having exactly the same issue with my other oldie Millie.

Millie is a fit and healthy 13 year old and not as easy to handle as Kayla – she bites. For the second time in 4 days tonight Millies has choked to the point she was losing consciousness. This is not normal and I don’t believe it is part of aging, I have had a number of oldies over the years and never had this before. Anyone had this? What did you do to overcome it?

Has your vet explored the possibility of laryngeal paralysis which is an 'old dog' condition?

In any event, perhaps you could try placing large smooth river stones amongst the food in your dogs' bowls. This is a good way to slow down fast eaters (I have labs - I know all about fast eaters!!! )

Good luck.

I changed from Bonnie working dog to the chicken frames about 6 weeks ago.

My dogs don't get any beef or roo etc any more, only the chicken frames!

It seems to be taking forever to get there coats back to being white, if it was the dry they were on.

My dogs are seperated into there own runs and cannot mouth each other at all either.

I have no idea as to what it is, or why they have come out in the stains.

I have a fantastic specimen out in a run and I cannot show him due to the condition of his coat!!

I'm at my witts end trying to get them ready for a specialty show.

I am going to try the bi carb, and then the sards soap.

Thanks

Shazz

Hi Shazz,

There is a super product on the market specifically for whitening horses' tails made by Champion Tails who produce a whole range of whitening/washing products for show horses. If you go to your local Horseland or Saddleworld, they'll be able to advise you. The particular one I used on my grey was in powder form which you added to warm water before applying. The stronger you make the mixture, the more it will strip stains out. It truly is fabulous stuff and will turn the grottiest manure and mud stained tail brilliant white... but be warned, it has a tendency to dry coats so use plenty of top quality conditioner afterwards. They also make a great shampoo for white/grey coats which I can highly recommend for regular washing and while I am sure it would be safe to use on dogs, I'd ask, just to be safe.

Good luck and please, keep us posted.

w2s

Just an update...my neice spoke to the breeder and she has been really helpful and concerned. She also confirmed that both the mum and dad of this pup have a 0/0 score for both elbows and hips, so this must be a fluke/throwback? My neice must have mixed up her info when she was telling me, but she was pretty upset. Maybe those scores were for another pup that she was looking at? Who knows....

Out of that litter, this pup is the only one sold to a pet home and all other littermates are being shown and are healthy.

She offered a replacement pup if my neice chooses as well ( which is very nice)but at this stage it isn't an option.

My neice is going to play it by ear for the next couple of months, in conjunction to using joint guard/fish oil etc and keeping him confined. Then she will reassess what to do, with how he is responding. She *may* at that point get another xray and get a second opinion from a different specialist.

Thanks for all the help and imput on this thread.

Kym

Hi Kym,

I've just been down the surgery road with my young lab bitch (now 8mo) so I know how heartwrenching this all is for your neice.

We are now into my pup's 8th week post-surgery but it's been a long road to this point. I can only tell you what I've experienced.

My pup went lame aged 4 and a half months and was diagnosed with bilateral FCP at 6mo. She is from sound breeding stock with low hip scores and 0/0 elbows. I saw 4 different specialists before she was CT scanned and unequivocally diagnosed and she was subsequently operated on using the open athrotomy procedure (not keyhole surgery) to remove cartilage fragments. By week 7 post-surgery, she lost all signs of residual lameness. At the 8 week mark, she is now beginning to move quite normally in all three gaits.

I have no doubt that part of the recovery involves them becoming confident in their joints again, not to mention just getting fit from having been confined for so long. My pup is from working lines so time will tell if she will be able cope with training and trialling but all being well, I hope to be able to have her out there doing what she loves best - retrieving! Of course if that can't be then so be it - she will be a lounge lizard instead. I understand that she will be arthritic in those joints in time but if she gets a few years of good quality of life, I'll be delighted.

IMHO, I believe that early diagnosis and treatment is vital. My understanding is that the longer Elbow Dysplasia (whichever form it might be) continues untreated, the more damage is likely to be done to the joint/s. That is why I continued to search for a firm diagnosis when I was being told to just wait and see...I couldn't see any sense in that at all. My pup was in constant pain and that had to mean something wasn't right. Having said that, I wasn't about to let anyone operate unless they could give me absolute proof of what she had. Hence the CT scan.

Please let me know if I can be of any help. Oh, and by the way, my message is that there is light at the end of the tunnel - I personally know of another dog who was operated on aged 5mo with significant ED and joint changes who is now working hard and pulling up sound as any other dog I've seen.

Chin up,

w2s

Thanks everyone.

kimjm,

In an ideal world that would be a great idea! ;) I'm afraid I don't have any choice in the matter though living some 4 hours' drive from Melbourne.

My regular vet explained that in addition to providing a good source of non-weight bearing exercise, swimming makes the elbows flex in a way that creates enough pressure to force excess fluid out of the joint capsule. This in turn allows the body to reabsorb it more quickly.

I fully intend taking things nice and slowly - in fact, there's no reason I can't create my own hydrotherapy come to think of it. The local lake has a huge sandy beach where I can easily 'walk' her in chest deep (the dog's! ) water...that's not a bad idea. Looks like hubby's waders might come in handy after all! ;)

Hi again ILuvAmstaffs,

Wow, that's a long time for recovery. I give you full credit for being so patient. I guess when there's no other option, you do what you have to. When my dog curls up at my feet just to be near me, there's nothing I wouldn't do for her

Hi centitou,

That's great news about your pup! Sounds as though he is progressing well. I noticed that my girl was better from the day she had the surgery - not 100% but vastly more comfortable. Since then, there have been times when I would swear there's no lameness and other times when it's still there. I guess time will tell just how well she will be. It's definitely a game of patience.

w2s

Angs does not tolerate Drontal and was vomitting afterwards. I now use Interceptor and have no problems (other than remembering to do it once a month).

Out of 6 dogs, we have one terrier cross who is sensitive to Drontal and always vomits through the night if I forget and give it to him. He normally gets Propantel and is fine with that. None of our other dogs have a problem with it so go figure.

I agree with everyone else - if your pup is still unwell a week after treatment (it would be longer now!), I'd be seeing a vet.

Good luck.

w2s

Good to hear that your girl is showing signs of improvement. ;)

Diesel did have some swelling around the joint after his op as well & the leg still looks thicker around the scar. So hopefully that is all you are seeing.

This link explains a bit about the ulna oestectomy & why it is done. Diesel was only 8 months at diagnosis, so was a good candidate.

http://www.sancarlosvet.com/Other/Prof/PUO/PUO_Primary.html

Hi again,

Thanks for that link - it's very interesting reading. I guess every case is different and has to be judged accordingly.

Can I ask you how long it took for Diesel to make a full recovery? Is FCP (or any type of Elbow Dysplasia) common in your breed? It's certainly far more common in labs than we'd like unfortunately. In spite of careful screening of breeding stock it still surfaces unexpectedly.

w2s

Wow, thats full on. Diesel has FCP & had the shard removed plus an ulna oestectomy. I think malleer was the same, so not really sure in that case.

Interesting that there would be no follow up x-rays... I would have thought that with FCP the main concern would be to make sure more pressure isn't being applied to the joint & another shard doesn't occur. Especially when the ulna was not shorten.

How is she doing now after a bit of rest?

Hi again,

I don't know anything at all about ulna osteotomy. I can only say that my girl had simple bilateral open arthrotomy. As I understand it, this involved opening the joints, removing the cartilage fragments and then abrading the opposing joint surfaces which had kissing lesions, in order to promote healthy cartilage growth...

I asked the surgeon if more fragments could occur in the future (thinking we might have to go through all this again! ) and he assured me that no, this was it. Apparently it's now a matter of allowing the surgery site to heal completely and slowly build up strength again. I also asked if there was any point in doing x-rays at some stage in the future (thinking that she might become arthritic early) and he said that would be of no real benefit and certainly not in the short term. If she does succumb to changes in the joint over time, we will be guided by her comfort level and treat her accordingly.

He wasn't able to give me any guarantees about whether she will recover completely in terms of soundness. He said that is very much an individual thing. But, at least the fragments are out and can't cause any more damage.

A friend of mine had her young male lab's elbows operated on for FCP, OCD and arthritic changes via keyhole surgery at 5mo. His elbows were a mess. It took a good 6 months of very slow rehab but he is now 4yo and going strong without a hint of lameness even after very strenuous work. Apparently the same dog had post-operative swelling in both elbow joints for months but this eventually resolved over time. I live in hope!

My girl is, I think, improving every day. The fluid build up has lessened and is softer I believe and she will start swimming tonight so that should also help. She is getting a slow 5 minute lead walk each day & I plan to build that up very gradually.

w2s

Yep, definately too much too soon. Diesel was on complete rest for 8 weeks, and that was with only one elbow having been operated on... and once we could start walking him, it was only to the corner & back (100metres or so each way) and as he got better rather than increase the duration, we increased the frequency to give him a rest in between, so a walk morning then one in the night etc. It was probably 6 months on before we would take him for around a 10-15minute walk. Swimming was recommended early on as the exercise of choice because it is low impact.

Also, something to look out for is that with FCP a fragment can cause a small fluidy lump to build around the shard. Not that it's likely this soon after surgery, but if the lump does not go down with rest I would be going back to see the ortho...

When if you follow-up check up due? Is she scheduled to have a course of pentisan shots from 8 weeks with follow up x-rays at 3 months?

Hi,

That's interesting to hear.

The rehab schedule I got from my surgeon is as follows (written handout from surgeon) -

Immediately following surgery, two weeks' house rest with only on lead toilet walks 3-4/day. Bandages removed at 7 days and a 4 week course of Pentosan commenced at the same time. Week three - commence SLOW lead held walks - 10 mins per day. Increase by 5 minutes/week for next 6 weeks so that by week 8, we should be doing 35 minutes SLOW lead walking a day. By week 7 'Resume Normal Activity' - by that I gather she could go back out to her pen, have quiet time off lead on her own in the yard etc.

I have been following this rehab regime to the letter.

Bear in mind that the surgical procedure was the most minimally invasive arthrotomy where the surgeon goes in, gets the fragments out and then he's out of there. Also, since there was no evidence of arthritic change on her x-rays and she only had kissing lesions ie. no OCD, persumably that also has some bearing?

There was no mention of follow-up x-rays or a visit. From everything the surgeon said, he has now done all that's possible. The rest is up to the individual dog and a careful rehab routine...not sure what else I can do but certainly swimming has been recommended by my regular vet so I plan to start off slowly with that tonight.

w2s