woody2shoes

Hi curlygirl, Thanks for those ideas. I've been thinking along those 'swimming' lines myself. I plan to check with the surgeon tomorrow (Monday) and make sure swimming is OK since I'm not sure if I am meant to cut back on all exercise or if it's purely a weight-bearing issue in which case swimming could be the answer. I have a nice long dam at home which actually has water in it so I could certainly give her as much swimming as she's allowed. It means we have to cut through a fenceline but my OH tells me he is more than happy to do that - my pup doesn't realise just how lucky she is! lol Cheers, w2s

Thanks for that. As far as I can tell I've been doing everything strictly by the book but it would seem that even that's too much too soon for my girl. I'll just have to be patient and proceed even more slowly than planned. Cheers. w2s

Hi everyone, I've posted before about my nearly 8mo lab bitch who had bilateral elbow surgery 4 weeks ago for Elbow Dysplasia (FCP). She has been progressing well till now but after commencing 10 minute slow lead walks last week, I noticed what looked like a bit of swelling on the outside of her elbows just in front of the point of the elbow. This week she is up to 15 minutes slow lead walking and the swelling is definitely there now and no longer a possible figment of my imagination. A firm lump on each joint about the size of a 20 cent piece. I rang her surgeon yesterday who suggested warm compresses 3-4 days/day to help the swelling, as well as slowing down the rate of exercise. He said this would resolve in time. He described it as joint effusion (swelling) due to a) the surgery b) the FCP and c) the increase in exercise. I was reluctant to hold him up for too long asking a heap of questions so am wondering if anyone out there has experienced this type of thing following joint surgery of any sort? Is this normal/typical? How long can it take to resolve? Is there something I'm doing that might be causing this eg. am I not restricting her enough? My priority is to get her back to normal as quickly as possible that's all. Cheers. w2s

Hey Optimus, any news on your boy???? I'd love an update if you feel so inclined. I'm pleased to report that my girl is recovering well. Her incisions have well and truly knitted and we are now into week three (actually, nearly week 4!) so have begun 10 minute slow lead walks each day. Next Monday, we get to step it up a notch and she can have 15 minutes a day!!!! Gotta laugh or I'd cry!!!! On a more serious note though, she is going stark raving bonkers through sheer boredom - so far she has managed to 1) kill several DVD's (thought they were safe - clearly I was wrong!!!!), 2) shred the foam stuffing out of one of her mats 3) consume half a thong and 4) pull the filling out of one of her doona blankets. I actually don't care what she destroys but am a bit concerned about what she ingests!!! And still over 3 weeks to go... I have her on House Rest as per the surgeon's instructions so she is confined to our lounge area courtesy of two puppy pens clipped together. I know it's for her own good but boy, it's heart wrenching. I took her to a nearby lake today which has a lovely sandy beach and walked her in on lead for a bit of easy swimming as advised by my vet. She seems much more relaxed tonight...thank God! :D She has lots of toys, kongs, chew things and bones to keep her occupied but at the end of the day, there's no substitute for just getting to run around and expend some of that energy. Roll on week 7!!! when she gets to 'resume normal activities'. By that time I hope to at least be able to give her some free running exercise. w2s

Hi Optimus, I sure hope you get the answer/s you're looking for. It sounds like your dog is either in some pain or unwell if he is not being his usual self. I think you'll find Wing Tip very approachable. Don't be afraid to ask ANYTHING as he is more than happy to answer all questions (and believe me, I asked lots of them! ) Please keep us up to date...and thanks for your good wishes. w2s

Think I might start a thread on what supplements people give their dogs for their joints. There are so many of us out there that have dogs, or in my case have cared for rescue dogs, that have joint problems. It would be great to know the best suppliments to give. W2S please don't think I was having a go at you. I just wanted to clarify for others that might be reading this thread what total rest is. There are so many people that have injured dogs that would recover with total rest but they think that total rest is just keeping them a bit quiet. Just wondering if ultrasound would have picked up the fragments? Or is a CT scan the only way? Hi again puggy_puggy, My turn to apologies if I sounded defensive. I guess it's all been a pretty stressful experience - and I just wanted you to understand that I had just about turned myself inside out trying to help my pup! And I agree with you, the term total rest is often misunderstood. I know what it means and I still found it incredibly hard to just lock her away all the time. Quite heart wrenching at times. I'm happy to say that my girl had her bandages removed this morning and is looking a million dollars. In a week's time, I start her on slow 10 minute lead walks once a day and as much swimming as I can manage. I am to build the walks up by 5 minutes a week (yes, a week!!!!) and by week 7 she is allowed normal activity so till then, she will still be restricted to House Rest. I can't wait...in the meantime, it's baby steps. Not sure about the ultrasound question. I believe that MRI's and CT scans are the best imaging for this kind of thing (from what I've read) since even digital x-rays won't show cartilage fragments. Trouble is that not everyone has the equipment to do this. I think a discussion on joint supplements would be great. w2s

Wow! That's a hell of a thread! Well done for persisting and seeking answers. I wouldn't berate myself for 'not having worked harder' - you did what seemed right at the time. You can't possibly do any more than that. I know exactly what you've been through and I fully understand your frustrations but in the end, persistence certainly paid off for you. I certainly have no regrets having gone to 3 different specialists (though my OH thought I was a bit loopy!) You have to do what you have to do...at the end of the day, our dogs only have us to look after them. I am really excited about my girls' prognosis having read about Diesel. Thanks for letting me in on your experience. w2s

Hi puggy-puggy, I have to tell you that I tried everything. She was initially crate/pen confined 24/7 for 4 weeks straight with nothing but on lead toilet walks and this made absolutely no difference to the degree of lameness. I then took her to Melbourne for a second opinion and this specialist told me she should be pen confined but could be walked quietly on lead for 5 minutes in the morning as part of her 'toilet' walk. Since she clearly had found no relief from full crate confinement, there seemed little point in persisting with that line of attack. Again, no difference to the degree of lameness. From the first day she pulled up lame to the day she was operated on, she showed no improvement to any conservative treatments. None of the NSAI (both Rimadyl and Metacam were tried) made any difference and the Pentosan (Cartrophen) injections she received had no effect. It became very clear to me that this was something which, left undiagnosed and untreated, couldn't possibly be doing her joints any good. She has been on joint supplements since she came to us at 8wo and her weight and exercise have been routinely managed as par for the course with lab pups. And, she's been on the very best premium dog food I could find for large/giant breed pups. In the end, it came down to doing something to ease her discomfort. It was constant and without relief for 8 weeks...I couldn't bear it in the end. Looking in her eyes now, she is a different dog. I am just glad she has found relief at long last. From eveything I've read about moderate to severe FCP, having been operated on at such an early age seems to be the best way to proceed. I hope this clears things up for you. w2s

Hi Shelbyville, You should get about a million hits! There is a lot of information out there on the subject...happy reading!!! w2s

Hi, She was operated on by Wing Tip Wong at Werribee and I couldn't be happier. I understand that he has, amongst other things, a long history in treating Guide Dogs so his knowledge of and experience with ED is obviously extensive. In any case, he came highly recommended and I am very happy with how things panned out. He was extremely thorough in his assessment and I really liked the way in which he talked everything through along the way. I had done a lot of research into both ED and Pano and he spoke to me with that in mind. And, most importantly, he didn't try to convince me of anything, just gave me the facts and let me decide. I must admit I had hoped all along to have the keyhole surgery done on my pup but in the end, it became more important to resolve her lameness issues quickly and, most importantly, to find someone who I believed would be 100% approachable during my pup's rehab since we live 4 hours from Melbourne. I suspect there may be a few phone calls along the way! Thankfully, Wing Tip fit the bill. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend him to anyone. Cheers, w2s

I have an update in case this is of interest/help to anyone else out there. In desperation following a total of 8 weeks' constant lameness, I sought yet a third specialist's opinion last Monday. He immediately diagnosed it as Fragmented Coronoid Process (a type of Elbow Dysplasia not uncommon in young labs) in both elbows and recommended CT Scans. These showed a definite fragment in the left elbow and some anomalies in the right. He operated on her the same day, removing a free floating fragment of cartilage from the left joint, and excising another 'fracture' which had not yet broken off from the right. She is due to have her bandages removed tomorrow and is already vastly improved. In fact, I would say she was 75% better the day following surgery and apart from some initial tenderness, has gone great guns ever since. Whilst it was very, very disappointing to hear the diagnosis at the time, at least I have been able to resolve the problem and she is much brighter for it. It will be a slow and lengthy rehabilitation if I ever want her to be able to work but she will be given every opportunity to improve. Fingers crossed the outcome will be a good one. I know I can expect early arthritis but with regular 6-monthly Pentosan as part of routine maintenance, together with daily joint supplements, and careful exercise and weight management for the rest of her life, I am optimistic. The ortho surgeon was guarded in his prognosis but having seen badly affected dogs improve remarkably well over time, I hold great hope for my pup. Thanks to all who shared their advice/experience earlier in this saga. Cheers, w2s

Hi, We feed Eagle Pack Large & Giant Breed Puppy Formula to our young labs, then at 12 months switch to an Adult Formula for those in active work/training. Our older girl and the two terriers are fed Bonnie - feeding 6 dogs Premium dry food was becoming a very expensive exercise! lol All of ours routinely get chicken carcasses, bones and some raw meat as part of their diet. We've always found our pups and those in work do brilliantly on EP. Two pups we recently bought (from two different litters) had both been raised on Advance Large Breed Puppy. Thinking I'd stick with their original diets, I rang a supplier in Melbourne to order some in. He told me that Advance (and I have no idea if he's right in saying this) is the only premium dry food brand which still uses chemical preservatives so they don't recommend it to their clients. I opted to change them over to Eagle Pack. I hope this helps. w2s

That's good to hear! I am really, really hoping all will be well in time. Thanks for your feedback.

Hi everyone, I have had her to two specialist surgeons and a physio/sports medicine vet - none of them could definitively say what it is. Two of the three suspect it's early Elbow Dysplasia but aren't prepared to recommend surgery just yet. The third, one of the surgeons, believes it is an idiopathic lameness which will resolve in time. In answer to some other questions - there is no heat or inflammation in the joint. She showed no response to a course Rimadyl (am about to try Metacam) and there is little if any pain on manipulation. I realise that x-rays can be inconclusive since fragments are often very small and/or hidden. We may try different imaging next time if it is available. At this point, I am not prepared to opt for surgery based just on someone's 'gut feeling'. Maybe I'm wrong but it makes sense to me that if she is this sore and it is ED, then there should be inflammation at the site which should produce swelling and heat. I am hoping it will all just go away quietly...the risk of course is that if they are right then the sooner we go in and fix the problem, the better the prognosis. Hmmmmmm, what to do????? The breeders have had some experience with panosteitis with two male lab pups who grew very quickly. Interestingly enough, my girl has also grown very, very quickly and is already at full adult height and weight at just 6mo (and no, she's not overweight, just big boned). I suggested pano to all 3 vets - none of them was prepared to consider it as an option. According to them, typically she is the wrong breed, wrong sex, and presents with the wrong clinical signs. So, back to the drawing board. Now that I know that pano has been an issue in her 'lines' before, it might be something they will consider more seriously if/when I go back. Thanks again for all your feedback. w2s

I dream about this being something quite inocuous like a strained ligament or tendon!!!! FINGERS (and everything else) CROSSED. I find the hardest part, without a doubt, is that she isn't allowed to do what pups do best - PLAY!!! Guess I just have to grin and bear it. Thanks for your feedback.

Hi all, I have a 6mo lab bitch puppy who has been consistently lame in the left foreleg for 5 weeks now. She has been confined since it commenced. I have had her to two specialists and the general consensus is that it is most likely to be very early Elbow Dysplasia (specifically FCP) but both feel it is too soon to recommend surgery just yet. X-rays so far are clear, no swelling or heat in the joint, some pain on manipulation but nothing drastic, no positive response to anti-inflammatories. She gets a short on lead walk morning and night and gets to swim as much as possible. She is currently on a course of Cartrophen. She is to be reviewed in two months' time and if the lameness persists till then, most likely will undergo elbow arthroscopy. Anyone out there had any experience with this condition and it's treatment (surgical or otherwise)? I'd be interested to hear how other dogs/owners have coped and what types of treatment were recommended. Thanks in advance... w2s