MonElite Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 I am looking after friends dobie bitch for a while. She is one fantastic dog, willing to please, happy outgoing nature, very well behaved, no probs whatsoever. She is 3.5yo. She knows two comands (very well I might add) - come and wait. Since she is going to be at my place for quite sometime I though I will teach her some more words. After teaching my own dog (at the age of 5) few things with an ecollar and finding it very effective I thought about using it on the girl. I found the working level no probs and tried teaching her "sit", but I think that she somewhat shuts down with the ecollar on. I know that she used to wear an antibarking collar, which is a lot stronger than the collar Im using and perhaps she has a bad association with the probes on her neck, and fears them a bit? Any thoughts? Any advice? Perhaps someone has a dog that has two collars and can share the experiences. I might add that I only did one small training session so far, but this is my first observation, I might find it completly different in few days time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 K9: go back & read the manual I wrote. You need the first three steps to overcome the dogs association with the no bark, the dog will need more guidance too.... You never start with the sit.... the dog can get confused as it has no movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 (edited) I meant she becomes less happy immiediatelly when I put the collar on her neck, not when the stim is on. Its a bit hard to "teach" her come as she does it galloping back no probs. Thanks for advice K9 I will of course try later today, when it gets cooler, right now she is sitting under my desk pushing her head between my legs so that she can look into my eyes. Gotta love her, she is sooooo good. **** Edited to add the photo taken 3 minutes ago, she doesnt stop looking at me like that 24/7, if only man gave so much attention and devotion :D Edited January 27, 2006 by myszka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninaandted Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 from my experience - it depends on the dog - but they do have "collar memory". Nina has none and she had the anti-barking collar for a while. Ted has only ever set it off once but he knows when he has it on. This suits our purpose when he gets in a silly barking mood because he stops when we put it on (without any stim) so we've never bothered to "untrain" this. you might have to go back to the beginning with this girl and make it a really positive experience just having the collar on. she wouldn't have all the great training experiences with it yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cactus Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 :D What a bootiful girl myszka- however will you hand her back??!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cactus Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Wow myszka, looking at the prices of remote e-collars- over $400 Are they all that expensive?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 28, 2006 Author Share Posted January 28, 2006 I will hand her back, most likely with a broken heart. I have looked after her twice before, but this time it is going to be for quite a few weeks so it will be harder. A lot harder..... She is however a potential dam of my future puppy As to the price of ecollars - worth every dollar, very good investment. I wish I got one earlier when it was first recommended to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cactus Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 As to the price of ecollars - worth every dollar, very good investment. I wish I got one earlier when it was first recommended to me. It seems its not easy to get much information about them or where to get them- is there a brand that is more reputable? I dont want to pay $400 and find I got a poor quality product. Also, do they come with enough information to use them, as I dont know of any trainers here (Gold Coast) who use/allow them- its hard enough finding trainers that allow head halters or check chains. My main interest in using one would be to train her not to chase small dogs, but if I could get training on how to use it effectively in other more useful situations, that would be great. How long has your collar lasted myszka? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 28, 2006 Author Share Posted January 28, 2006 (edited) I got mine from K9 Force and its Innotek. Its one of the new designs 9 levels and 250m range. I also got a manual from K9 (that he mentions above) on how to use it along with lessons, and who knows how many ( I hope he isnt counting, are you K9? :D ) emails with questions and points of advice. I believe you can purchase the manual on its own from K9 if you get the collar from elswhere, its a 45 page book. The DVD that comes with it I dont think has enough info it bare minimum. I certainly will be using the collar again on my next dog, its not even a year old so I cant tell you how long does it last for. The plastic is a bit cr@py and I had pieces breaking off it, but rang Innotek and had it exchanged no questions asked straight away. I charge it once a week and its used every day on our walk. As to head halter and check chains, mine are collecting dust these days, I wont be using them ever again. A small update on the girl. I put the collar on and off over last couple of days with no stim, with probes at the back. I did a small lesson with the recall today and she was very happy coming to me, the q is did I make her collar literate? Probably not as yet, we will see how we go tomorrow. Also she seemes to forgotten the word wait all together and I have a velcro dog (not that she was different before) and those eyes, OMG will someone take those eyes off me plizzzz Edited January 28, 2006 by myszka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cactus Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 I got mine from K9 Force and its Innotek. Its one of the new designs 9 levels and 250m range. Is it also waterproof? She is in the water a lot, so thats something I would really need. I also got a manual from K9 (that he mentions above) on how to use it along with lessons, and who knows how many ( I hope he isnt counting, are you K9? ) emails with questions and points of advice.I believe you can purchase the manual on its own from K9 if you get the collar from elswhere, its a 45 page book. The DVD that comes with it I dont think has enough info it bare minimum. I'll really need the manual, DVD and email support as I am nowhere near K9 Force so cant have lessons OMG will someone take those eyes off me plizzzz I can only guess with what love and adoration she gazes at her owner with those big brown eyes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 29, 2006 Author Share Posted January 29, 2006 Yes my collar is waterproof, Rex has been in the water in it few times, not that he swims, but at the beach he sort of splashes around in shallow water. DVD comes with the collar, but I dont think its enough info, gives you an idea no doubt. Contact K9 Force about the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lou Castle Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 (edited) There can be some problems if a dog has received high level stims as might come from a bark collar or from someone who uses them in his training. The dog will associate a low level stim with the high level stim for quite some time. With some, they'll react the same! It usually takes me a day or two before the dog starts to realize that the low level stim he's feeling now is NOT the same as the high level stim he's felt in the past. It's common for a dog who's had high level stim to be "down" when the Ecollar is first put on. This usually lasts until he realizes that he's not getting that anymore. I prefer to teach the recall first but haven't had any problems teaching the sit first. There are some articles on my website that will help people with their training. www.loucastle.com Edited January 29, 2006 by Lou Castle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenb Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 Why use the collar at all? You are teaching new behaviours so I would be using rewards and possibly clicker training depending on what I wanted to teach. I believe collars are best for stopping behaviours. Stephen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbbb Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 myszka, Flame has both. She is quite the little barker - I guess she gets that from her Mum, huh? Anyway, Steve put the collar slightly off-centre so that the stim is in a different place. We also had to use a higher stim than for most dogs as it seems she is a little desensitised from using the bark collar. At first she seemed a bit unhappy with the e-collar. Now she happily runs around with it on and obeys quite quickly most of the time (sometimes I think she wants to see how much she can get away with!) We have only done the basic - recall, sit, distance sit with the collar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 M: I meant she becomes less happy immiediatelly when I put the collar on her neck, not when the stim is on. K9: she will get past it when you teach her how to turn off the stim... S: Why use the collar at all? K9: why not? S: You are teaching new behaviours so I would be using rewards and possibly clicker training depending on what I wanted to teach. K9: not always possible when distance is a factor... S: I believe collars are best for stopping behaviours. K9: not so these days, look into modern training & you will see the advances that have transpired are great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 29, 2006 Author Share Posted January 29, 2006 Thank you everyone for your comments and advice. I have tried teaching her sit any other way I know and she just doesnt want to do it :p stubborn little thing Im guessing its a kickback from the showring where the dogs are tought not to sit. We are doing a lot better with the down command. And she had mastered "do you want a belly rubby bubby" in less than a day She also decided that the Kong on the string I train Rex with must be of some extra special value and is desperate to have it, or more Rex not to have it. WWIII almost broke out when I got it out once.... so now we are playing with the Kong seperatelly. Mind you they are happy to share the lounge and the teaddy bear and try to fit in the crate together And on top of that I think she decided that my place is her place now as well and barks her head off at anyone near the fence (not being unreasonably silly, just when they are almost touching the fence) - so maybe there is some truth into this jbbb She is quite the little barker - I guess she gets that from her Mum, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 29, 2006 Author Share Posted January 29, 2006 I would be using rewards I am using rewards in the training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted January 30, 2006 Share Posted January 30, 2006 I'll really need the manual, DVD and email support as I am nowhere near K9 Force so cant have lessons There's some fairly detailed articles online here: http://www.dobbsdogs.com/library/obedience/ Cheers, Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cactus Posted January 30, 2006 Share Posted January 30, 2006 There's some fairly detailed articles online here:http://www.dobbsdogs.com/library/obedience/ Thanks Steve! I've bookmarked that page and will read the articles before getting the collar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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