poodle proud

A lot of the modern treatments for both human and animals can have adverse side effects. Even the debate over child immunization due to deaths occurring in small children due to the vaccines highlights the danger of modern health treatments. Generally it is a balance as to how much benefit is derived from the treatment and what the associated risk is. A dog with a flea infestation has a miserable life, and most dogs in Australia would not be managed as and maintained to the level as many of the show dogs referred to here on DOL, and therefore will have fleas.

I agree but I also think there should be greater warning of possible adverse reactions as in human medication. If you read the leaflet of any human medication they list every possible side effect. There are usually so many that you wonder whether or not you should take it! But at least then you will observe for those reactions. It shouldnt be any different with animal meds.

I'm not sure how often these burns happen but Bayer themselves told me that SWF dogs who use advantix have a greater suceptibility to seizures and other adverse reactions. They know this yet there is no disclosure with consumers. At least if these things were listed as possible side effects people could make informed decisions and take the risk on themselves.

Mine have had upset tums and bums of late also.

I have been using paws probiotic powder and done the chicken and rice for food and things have improved tremendously.

So sorry to read of what has happened!

Mine have reacted to advantix with seizures and vomiting. When I rang bayer they were quite good but I don't know if they will look into it further. But I figure if enough people ring up when these things happen they will have to take notice.

I'd ring ACA or TT if they don't cover the costs as has been suggested. The local paper may even want to do a piece and I'd and send the company the clipping.

I hope she gets better soon!

Well they have been on the cooked chicken and rice for the past few days on advice from the vet. So if I was going to switch to raw would I need to do it gradually? Also what about salmonella? Are dogs guts strong enough to cope with it?

Personally, I wouldn't feed raw chicken at this stage.

Best way to go - ask your vet. Go over some of the tips mentioned here and discuss it with him.

Everyone can give you advice going by their past experiences but it all boils down to how your dog copes.

It's trial and error.

This is what my gut is telling me also. I may consider raw for the future (Thanks for all the info and advice Tomas!).

Osca had his first good poo today on the chicken and rice. Hooray! So I'm pretty happy things are settling down but will keep him on it until I talk to the vet and do a bit more research.

I think the probiotics have really helped. They werent cheap at $50 but it was cheaper than a vet's visit

Thanks for all the advice everyone. Ive got a few brands of dry I can research now and will investigate feeding raw also. Ive learnt now that I should stick to one or the other and I won't give into them by giving them treats until we have had good progress on a food for a substantaial length of time.

:p

P.S Kayne's mum,

I love the name Patou

If you are just feeding raw,poops are small,as they use much of what they eat,unlike dry where a lot passes through. Do not expect large poop with raw. Also whatever you feed will be whatever comes out. Today mine had beef heart,over a kg each. Tomorrow they will all have softish but formed black poop! :p

I have Vizslas and believe me some days there is very little and they all get over a kg a day! It also depends on what the meal is. Chicken usually gives them small firm poops

Base your initial amount on 2% of their weight. So for your 7kg dog you would feed around 200g a day and for your smaller dog about 120g a day...I would whack a whole chicken into portions and hand that out over quite a few days. Lucky you cos mine all get a small whole chicken at one sitting! I really need smaller dogs!

If you feel he is getting backed up,remember to add more meat....bone to firm things up and meat to loosen,organs work well in that regard too,but for a while just stick to meaty bits on the bone. A chicken is 27% bone which is more than enough without being too much. Oh and I would'nt bother with wings at all,just too bony. So legs and breast bone in bits it is :-)

Well they have been on the cooked chicken and rice for the past few days on advice from the vet. So if I was going to switch to raw would I need to do it gradually? Also what about salmonella? Are dogs guts strong enough to cope with it?

And I am a bit paranoid about them eating the bone in the chicken, even when raw. Could I just give chicken mince or cut up breast?

My little girl, Bambi, has had a sensitive stomach ever since we brought her home from the RSPCA. I don't feed her bones anymore as she tends to vomit an hour after she eats them and usually has diarrhea as well. My friend has started supplying me with the Eagle Pack and it has helped TREMENDOUSLY. I can't pimp it enough, my boy has dropped 2 kg just from eating this food as well, even though one of my housemates still overfeeds him when I'm not around to do it. This is a dog that used to throw up every day without fail. I love Eagle Pack. ♥

Thanks Koemi, Mine have been on eagle pack. If I went back to it I would go back to the holistic duck or chicken. The combined meat one for small-medium breed dogs was no good for mine. I'm glad Bambi is doing well!

I said stick to just raw or just kibble,what I should have explained when sticking to just raw,was go back to that type of protein which was well tolerated and use that. Lets say chicken....buy whole chickens and feed only that whacked into appropriate sizes to teach the digestive tract to work normally.

This is what I am wondering., what is an appropriate size portion if I do that? He is low energy, 7kg and 5 years old. The toy is 4kg and just 12 months old, medium energy.

Also Poodle Proud I don't think the paper wrapper would have upset the tum to what you are seeing now and mucous is a sign of irritation...slippery elm would be very useful in your situation. Here is a link I found you to help http://www.holvet.net/slippery_soup.html dosage details are near the bottom of the page.

I also totally agree with a few of the other posters,not all dogs do well on the same foods...some ,though few I believe just cannot tolerate raw. But I do not think yours is one of those,I think you just have an irritated gut and once that is calmed ,whatever works will be whatever works. Raw or kibble. As I said I would just go raw chicken till things firm up...

Thanks Tomas, I will check out that website.

He is a lot better today. My only concern is that his poos are small. I don't know what to put this down to. Whether its because he is only getting what I am giving him rather than free access plus bones. They just seem even smaller than the toy poodles who is eating the same amount. The frequency has significantly reduced today though. I just don't want him to get backed up. (This was why I was questioning whether the wrapper had contributed to this)

Try going back to basics with no dairy, no beef, try steamed or boiled chicken. I wouldn't feed it raw at this stage.

Science Diet have their ID range for problem dogs if you'd rather try that instead of Royal Canin.

Start reading the ingredients on packaging to be sure you know what you're feeding your dog. Additives, preservatives, etc, can also upset their tummies.

It's a lengthy process but one well worth doing for the dogs sake.

good luck.

Thanks Kayne's Mum.

They are just getting the chicken and rice and the probiotics for the moment. I'll do a bit a research on the hypo-allergenic formulas and see what I come up with. I have looked at the hills science in the past but looking at the ingredients I havent been too impressed, same with Royal Canin. It just seemed like a lot of fillers.

Ill give the royal canin and hs another look.

My GR has a terrible stomach at times, she has with success tolerated Advance Sensitive skin and stomach & Eukanuba sensitive stomach, havent tried any other brands. I did find she was fine on those

I dont believe all dogs can tolerate RMB. But then i am sure some will debate that but going on personal experience my girl has issues tolerating RMB yet she can tolerate a small amount of roo a few times weekly then once a week she gets half a roo tail (way too rich to give a whole one).

This is my feeling about Osca, He loves them but doesnt seem to do well on them. Where do you get the roo tail from? Maybe something I could give him once all this is sorted out.

Thanks for the reccomendations

I just remembered that I caught Osca eating the wrapper from a hungry jacks hamburger at 3am 2 nights ago. I don't know how much he ate but could this be a potential cause?

He is only passing small amounts of stool each time he goes. Is it likely to break down in his gut or should I be concerned about maybe a partial obsruction?

Grrr, cant believe I didnt remember this earlier

I had a look at other things that have been reported as toxic and it seems I need to rip out almost my entire garden .

Totally know what you mean Erny. We were starting a garden and before I found that site we googled almost every plant while we were at the nursery only to find 95% of the ones we liked were toxic. OH was close to concreting the darn thing :cool:

From what I've read and been told its pretty common. We were very fortunate as midnight was the same age and after a lot of praying and frozen bones it came out by itself. But that was the last resort before anaesthetic and extraction.

I'm sure your pup will be bouncing around in no time. Keep an eye on her with the pain relief. She will think she is invincible and starting chewing on something that could aggravate the site where the tooth is.

I would try and keep her fairly quiet for a couple of days. The mouth is a very vascular (lots of blood vessels) part of the body and vigorous exercise can cause bleeds while the tissues are healing.

Hi Nicole,

I'm so sorry to hear that your little one is sick. I'm praying for clear results for the little guy.

I'm not sure about the symptoms but I might be able to help with the plant side of things. There are heaps of lists on the web and some plants are on them and some aren't so it's hard to know what to believe.

This site is the best I have found. Most of the plants listed have pictures. It saved our sanity over the weekend when choosing plants for our new garden.

http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/poison-control/plants/

You can do a search for the plant and then it says and whether it is toxic to cats, dogs or horses and the clinical signs to look for.

But as your vet knows what has been going on I'd ask them what to look for and if you are worried ring an emergency vet overnight.

Please keep us updated.

The only way to know for sure what is causing the problem is to do a food trial.

True but doing this is easier to start with.

I think this will be the start of my food trial anyway. At the moment I just want to get their tums settled.

I noticed a small amount of mucous in the poos this afternoon, but the last one was about 5 hours ago so things seem to be settling and the chicken and rice seems to have been tolerated well. He was actually running around and playing this afternoon and his tummy wasnt as guarded so I'm hoping he's past the worst of it.

What probiotics do you use? what is the difference between dog and human ones?

It's good to know you're not squeamish, I'm not, but I'm a nurse and my dinner table stories arent always popular

Yes agreed, more info please!!

Tomas.

No it doesnt need refrigeration.

I read online that if it needs refrigeration this should be a red flag as it means the cultures are unstable and can lose their benefit when they meet with the body that is much warmer than a refrigerator.

As for feeding one or the other dry or raw, this is where I keep getting confused as everyone says something different. But I may just have to at least to eliminate the source of the problems. I'd go back to dry only if anything.

green as in khaki green colour all over. Not runny but soft-formed. At first I thought he was constipated as he was straining but now it looks to be diarrhoea that his irritated his tail end, making him think he needs to evacuate when he doesnt. (Apologies for squeamish tummies!)

I am suspecting the raw meaty bones. There does seem to be issues after bones, even though I only let them eat the meat.

Does your dog like the eukanuba light?

Yes, she eats all of it. For breaky she gets it plain, and dinner she gets it mixed with the sardines, yoghurt or something to add some variety so she doesn't get bored. What colour is the diarrhoea?

Thanks vjb,

It varies but over the past couple days it has been a bit green.

I have been on cortisone myself and have also had a friends dog on cortsione.

In the dog (who was given them for skin problems) she gained weight. She was also a bit skittish on them but I don't know if that was just her.

From personal experience at 50mg per day; increased appetitie, fluid retention, agitation.

The reason they reccomend not abruptly ceasing steroids is because the body actually produces cortisone and when these drugs are used they sort of take over this responsibility and when they are ceased the body is not used to producing suffiecient levels of natural cortisone which is why they need to be weaned off them. To start producing adequate levels of cortisone again.

I don't know what doses are considered high in dogs but I would just ring your vet and talk to them about it. It's not a particularly nice drug but as Cavalier said it can be very effective when needed.

Hope your girl is feeling better soon.

Thanks so much everyone for your replies!

I bought some probiotic powder from the vets so I hope that adding that to their food will help. It's called Paw probiotic powder. It says for animal treatment only so will it still do the same thing as human grade probiotics Tomas?

As for worming they are both on sentinel spectrum and up to date.

Mish13 and CBL thanks for those reccs I will check them out

Poodle Wrangler

I'm fine to ditch the pasta as it's only occasional. But I'm a bit worried about upping the rmb. I don't know whether it's just coincidence but it seems that gut issues often occur within a few days of eating them. They get brisket bones, lamb shanks, beef bones and turkey necks.

The vet nurse said that some dogs just don't tolerate raw well, particularly the high fat content. I'm not sure.

Ive been told to have them on the chicken and rice for 4 days and probiotic stint for 14. I'll be interested to see if that at least settles things down. OH think's I am a bit vet-happy so I am trying to get it sorted at home :rolleyes:

RMB?

Raw meaty bones.

Have you considered it's not the dry food but what else you're giving them?

This is entirely possible but it is the dry food that is the constant. The others are only occasional.

It is difficult because whatever I read on here or even my vet say that an entirely dry diet is not good, so I'm a bit stuck with what to do?

My dog reacts to anything with red meat in it (causing loose stools etc), so we are on Eukanuba Light and everything has been great since. I also add sardines once or twice a week, or natural yoghurt. The only reason we are on the 'light' is because she cannot have anything with much fat in it as is causes loose stools too. I can only give her venison ears as chew treats as they are very low in fat.

I am suspecting the raw meaty bones. There does seem to be issues after bones, even though I only let them eat the meat.

Does your dog like the eukanuba light?

Hi all,

I posted some time ago when changing my two poodles to a premium dry food. I switched them to eagle pack holistic duck and chicken vairieties. I recently switched them to the small and medium breed holistic formula which doesnt seem to be enjoyed or tolerated well.

I am thinking of going back to the duck but I'm open to other suggestions. My guys seem to get gurgly and upset tummies or diarrhoea fairly easily and I just wonder if there is a food I should try to keep them a bit more stable?

FYI: They get sardines, RMB, plain youghurt, egg, pasta and chicken/beef mince aswell.

Any reccomendations would be great.

My pup is almost a year and still loves to put everything in the backyard in her mouth. Rocks, chipbark, sticks etc.

Taking her out for walks reduces the amount of energy and desire to get into mischief in the backyard.

If it's late at night and Ive taken her out to go to the toilet and she picks up a rock I walk back calmly into the house and talk to the other dog or rattle the bag of chewies. 9 times out of ten she drops it and comes running and I give her one.

I'd just be checking what sort of plants you have in your garden to see if anything could actually be toxic. There are about 700 species of plants/shrubs that are known to be toxic to dogs. It may only take a couple of nibbles of the wrong thing to cause major problems.

This is a fabulous site to check if your specific plants are safe or toxic. It seems to have a huge database.

http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/poison-control/plants/

QUEENSLAND

'Tropic Tide' Toogoom, Qld.

Quiet dog friendly town about 20 minutes from hervey bay. House backs right onto water and every day when the tide goes out your dog gets to run around and play on the flats with hardly anybody in sight. Beautiful water, people, fishing. Just got back yesterday and will be going back for sure. All tiled or lino except bedrooms. Fully fenced backyard.

5/5 in my book.

Website

After getting a second dog this year Ive learnt some good lessons.

I'm not sure how your established dog will react to a newcomer but whatever you do don't pander to your dog if he gets jealous. It may feel harsh but walk away and let him get over it.

Also others have posted on here that times apart (as in you taking one dog out at a time sometimes) are good so they don't become too attached and fret as much if they ever have to be separated due to illness etc.

Also if your pup is overly exhuberant tire him out first before bringing the two together. It can be a bit overwhelming for the established dog with a pup getting up in it's face, biting ankles etc, even for the most tolerant dog.

Good luck and enjoy your new addition!

I'm not sure about eyes but have had two dogs at the albany creek specialist centre, 1 for a tumour and 1 for an emergency.

They were thorough and sooo lovely. They cried when there was nothing more they could do for my childhood dog. They rang when they said they would ring and they bent over backwards when my pet insurance company 'lost' my original claim documentation.

I can't fault them for anything.

Hope your little one is ok

PP.

After reading most of the posts I think everyone is agreed that it would be fabulous if all dogs were taught manners and that owners enforced these.

Sadly whether we own big or small dogs (and the experiences that come from both sides of the fence) we are forgetting that it's ultimately the owners responsibility.

I wish kids wouldnt tear around the supermarket so that I didnt have the dodge them with my shopping trolley for the WHOLE shopping trip. But the reality is that if the parent doesnt say a thing then really what can I do, even if I say something?

I have small dogs and understand totally about big dogs "just playing" with my dogs (yeah right) at the dog park. However I also understand that small dogs can also be psychos and that big dogs get pinned for things they shouldnt.

I daresay that most of us wouldnt be on this forum if we didnt want to be responsible dog owners and teach our dogs manners. I don't know how you get through to those who just think "dogs should be allowed to be dogs" no matter what behaviour they display. Really some people just don't have the time or inclination to go beyond the VERY basic care of their pet.

Its the dogs I feel sorry for.

Mine are on eagle pack Holistic for small and medium breed dogs. I'm not sure if I will stick to this or go back to the EPH duck formula as my dogs did really well on this.

But they also get raw meaty bones, egg, chicken and rice, sardines and yoghurt. My vet advised against all dry food for my guys because their tummies are a bit touchy.

There are lots of posts about dry food on here and many say the ingredients and the order in which they appear on the bag give you a good idea of the quality of the food.

Ive looked at others but havent been as happy with what I have seen in the ingredient lis compared to EPH.