SchnauzerMax

Hi Everyone :)

Renae is just over 10 now, and has had a few minor concerning symptoms over last few months of things not being right.

Last Sat, we decided she should have a blood test done to check on her.

Today we got the results and her liver enzymes are very elevated. They suggested she have a ultrasound done soon. She is booked in this Thurs.

They mentioned a few things it could be, can't remember atm as i was upset with just hearing about the results.

There were some other levels that were not quite right, but the vet said he wasn't too overly concerned with them at this stage.

She's healthy otherwise, has a good heart for her age, hasn't lost any weight, if anything has put on.

The reason we had her tested was because she has had a few tremors/shakes/trance like states over the last few months, only mildly and they only last a few seconds. If you touch her she stops/comes out of it.

I did mention she has been excessively hungry, which most cavs are always on the look out for food, but hers has been really bad .

She's been lethargic for a while now but then shes a 10 year old Cav. She has her moments of being active.

We won't know what is causing it until her Ultrasound, but am just wondering of anyone's else experiences with high liver enzymes levels in their dogs?

I guess there are few different things that it can be in different dogs, but Im just curious about it..

We have schnauzers (a mini and a standard) and elevated liver enzymes to us means pancreatitis or an infection in or around the liver/pancreas/gall bladder area. One of the liver enzymes that they test for shows how hard the liver is working (it's ALP or ALT I can't remember exactly). If this has been happening over a few months then whatever it is sounds more like a chronic condition rather than an acute condition like pancreatitis. We do watch the amount of fat in their diet just to be safe. Depending on what is wrong, there are supplements that might help.

Fingers crossed for good news

I know. The vet explained to me that it is not only through eating too much fat. She also said it could be through just having a tummy upset and it just progresses. My first mini now departed had a dreadful bout of pancreatitis a few years ago which I believe was brought about by Prednisol. Schnauzers apparently predisposed to this horrible affliction. Hubby says it's time to change breeds but I won't hear of it.

Once you're schnauzered, you're schnauzered for life :laugh: .

TwoDoggies.

there are other causes for pancreatitis.

My 2 old dogs (mini schnauzer Zeppi, and standard schnauzer Lui, now both gone to the bridge) both had attacks of pancreatitis from anti-inflammatories (previcoxx and rimadyl). In both cases, they were on regular daily doses for arthritis. Lui ended up not being able to tolerate any anti-inflammatory at all but he was elderly. Zeppi could tolerate one day on and one day off.

Also, infection can cause pancreatitis. If Jasper ate something bad and vomited it, it could put bacteria in the wrong area internally and whammo pancreatitis or a whole range of -itises. Max (my mini in my avatar) had ascending choleohepatitis (sp?) from this which was incredibly scary.

Point being, fat content is only one part of the picture.

Fingers crossed that Jasper is OK.

My vet friend just put a warning on her FB about Yesterday today tomorrow (Brunfelsia) and how poisonous it is for dogs.

I have a lovely one of those growing right next to the dwarf oleander & the dogs do zoomies around them. I don't really see why a dog would bother to eat it or the leaves from any other bush as long as they have some good grass to nibble on. A good idea for dogs is to plant some Cat Grass...they love it. Maybe put some in a pot & get it established.

It produces berries that can be attractive to some dogs. As I remember, I saw a dog being treated for Brunfelsia poisoning on Bondi Vet and they had to pump the dogs stomach which was full of these brown berries. I think the dog survived but it was touch and go and very nasty.

Hi,

Facts:

*3 year old kelpie ideal weight.

*Fed once per day dinner, dry food + meat or sardines

*Fussy eater

Problem:

*I give her some raw bones occasionally to help teeth and give variety.

*Will eat the meaty ones but will bury the bony ones and then dig them up at a later date when they are disgusting and maggoty, then will chew on them.

*Husband says dogs only bury food if they not hungry and I should have NO food days

Any thoughts?

Many thanks

My two only bury stuff if I feed them too much.

I am interested to see the answer as I would also assume the product was made in large quantity then placed into the ampuoles.

I am also going to look at the active ingredeints in my livestock back liners as well to see if they have the same active ingredients as I hadn't thought of that.

A lot of manufacturing processes squirt set amounts of the ingredients into each container. they don't mix up a batch and then dole it out.

Canned goods for example put set amounts of the ingredients into each can and then seal it and boil it. They measure temperatures because they know its cooked after so many minutes at a certain temperature.

It would not surprise me to learn that the spot on treatments get a similar process (not the boiling part :laugh: ).

I'd suggest to go back to the vet - sounds very nauseus and perhaps even in pain from what you have described. Considering he's probably been fasted before anaesthetic he really needs to get something into him even perhaps IV fluids.

x 2

I would do the ultrasound to find out.

Ultrasound will be able to give you information about what's happening inside that will help you make the decision.

My old boy had a tumour on his adrenal gland. The symptoms started when he was 12 and got steadily worse. The ultrasound showed where it was and that there was a good chance it was only the one adrenal gland. He had an operation (a big scary dangerous operation) just before his 13th birthday and lived to be 16.

It is apparently the same or similar stuff that is used on slow release capsules and tablets

I'd be getting her to a vet for a checkup. It could be a seizure but one every couple of years probably doesn't require intervention.

You should keep records in case it happens again.

Someone else posted this link in another thread (it's for treatment of atopic dermititis but it lists the drug and brand names)

http://www.ingleburnvet.com.au/antihistamines.htm

Antihistimines are an individual thing. I personally dislike Pherergan it doesn't work very well for me and the side effects are not nice (for me).

The website is not just down I don't think it is still registered which would indicate that the business isn't operating anymore.

Hi

Snowy occasionally will vomit white foaming bile with a tinge of yellow. I think he has a very sensitive stomach. Some treats don't sit well in him. Other times, when the gap between the two meals are longer.

We've visited the vet last night, due to ear infections and also get the vet to look at the baby canine teeth that is still in tact. Will be performing surgery to remove it when I de-sex him. Do I need to consider an xray on his teeth before removing?

Ok, I am digressing...

The vet said that for dogs that tend to vomit bile out of hunger (no food out) is call the bilious vomiting syndrome. Alright, got a name to it.

Anyone has their pet having such syndrome? And does it last or tend to grow out of it?

I usually feed Snowy twice 6am and 6pm, with treats in between in the treat balls. But I do missed the treat ball or he is lazy to play with it, then the bile comes up. Or sometimes if I so happened to give lesser in the night (to cut down his weight) then the bile comes up next morning.

My guys get a dog biscuit before bed to stop this. How much fat is in his diet? Sometimes it's worse with a high fat diet.

Found this link for you: http://www.ehow.com/...drome-dogs.html

It does mention that it is usually found in older dogs so I wonder if it is applicable to your young dog??

What are you feeding?

Regarding teeth removal....XRay can determine if there are any retained teeth for future reference but if that isn't a problem then I don't see why you would XRay

You x-ray to find out if there is anything unusual about the roots of the retained teeth. Sometimes retained baby teeth have extra long weirdly placed roots. Makes getting them out easier (no surprises).

All of the litter has to be registered at the same time. If your breeder gave you the option of chosing the registered name (the bit after the kennel prefix), sometimes people get really indecisive and the breeder can't register until everyone has made up their mind. It happened to us - we knew exactly what name we wanted but someone else dithered. It took months to get the papers back.

Can anyone give me any information about a diagnoses of elevated liver enzyme levels which was revealed in a blood profile test in an old, small dog? I don't know the numbers but the vet said it was "significant" and has recommended an ultrasound. She mentioned cushings/liver disease as possible causes. The white blood count was low as well. We have booked in for an ultrasound, but the vet who does them is away for another week and a half. Has anyone been there with all this, and how worried should I be at this point - obviously I am worried! Anything I should/should not be doing?

Stellnme,

It depends on which liver enzymes are elevated compared to what is normal for your dog.

Sometimes it can indicate pancreatitis or an infection in or around the liver. Sometimes it is other things.

Sometimes liver enzyme levels are elevated in older dogs due to old age (same as humans - an old liver doesn't work as well as a young one). Has your vet suggested a second blood test to see if the liver enzyme levels are changing?

A high fat diet can put a strain on the liver, so I would be avoiding feeding high fat treats or foods.

You should talk to your vet about how significant the numbers are and why she thinks it might be cushings or liver disease. It may have more to do with the low white blood cell count. If she is happy to wait a week and a half for an ultrasound then I wouldn't be panicking just yet.

My first thought would be fat content. I try and keep the fat % below 15%. I have a mini and a standard schnauzer.

Schnauzers commonly have hyperlipidemia (sp?) which is elevated levels of fats in the blood and with that (according to my vet) comes a predisposition to pancreatitis.

I don't go overboard, I just avoid giving them really fatty things to eat. So, for example, they don't get pigs ears.

Great work! I was talking to a bloke today at the dogs nsw day (I think he had mastiffs?) who told me Stevie looked like Sarbi and thought I wouldn't know who Sarbi is! He said when he was in Vietnam the Sarge asked for anyone who knew anything about dogs. He put his hand up and was sent to clean kennels, but ended up working with the tracker dogs in a special unit. He wants to get Sarbi and another dog to an Anzac day show next year.

ETA Sarbi went AWL and still got two medals? Or was she a deserter?

I thought she was a POW :laugh:

Oh, so you're saying that a dog can be pedigree but be a crossbreed? But the ANKC normally won't paper a dog that isn't pedigree purebred will it?

I'll give an example:

Miniature schnauzers were 'created' by crossing standard schnauzers with smaller dogs such as affenpinschers and poodles.

A pedigreed miniature schnauzer will have pedigreed miniature schnauzer parents but their ancestors will include standard schnauzers and the other breeds.

EFS

Mine love apples. I'm lucky to get half if I try to eat one in front of them! :D

Mrs rusty bucket - that is how some of the cheaper insurance companies work.

As best I can tell - from reading a lot of pdfs (product disclosures or the fine print) - all the ones backed by Holl ards - which is all of them except the Alli a nz one - they all changed some time last year. All the H-backed ones except maybe medibank for people on that before they changed (not sure how the renewals are going now), no longer cover "bilateral" ie they will cover the first cateract in the first eye - but not any in the other eye... and there is a 20% co-payment in addition to the excess (which was reduced). I didn't get a say in that, they just changed all the cover to less cover and upped the premium. I considered swapping but I couldn't find one that was different.

I think if my dog gets something nasty that doesn't go away with one treatment - like cancer - then I have life time cover up to a limit around $15,000. But if she gets something that drastically ruins quality of life - I'm not likely to spend squillions keeping her alive just because I have insurance to cover it.

As best I can tell - paying a higher premium can get some preventative treatment covered (but why would you claim with the excess and co-payment making a net nothing for you) or it gets a higher annual or lifetime cover limit eg different premimums affect whether they cover up to $10K to about $15K max annual or lifetime (for one disease).

Point me at a pdf that says something different (and isnt the big A) and I'll consider swapping to them.

Not all insurance is bad - I've been very glad of my car insurance (although the company refused to pay for the listed accessories which I was pretty mad about) and health insurance.

With Medibank pet insurance I think the excess/co-payment doesn't apply to the preventative stuff for the higher premium.

It's just a straight amount for 3 of the listed items, each one a maximum of $50 (?).

Not that it makes that much difference.

Have you tried the UK version of Amazon - amazon.co.uk ???

It doesn't seem to have the same restrictions (?)

Has to be said, poor Dougal, not saying anymore

touche!

I didn't get much a feel of remorse for poor Dougals passing either.

Just because they didn't write it doesn't mean they didn't feel it.