Max#1

Now? Sorry for being a pain in the woot - but thanks for the tutorial!

Now?

Gave it a whirl - like the first time : The number of opening and closing quote tags does not match. Please fix this to submit your post. You should charge for this stuff!

I'm very curious about what people think about the nature vs nurture debate when it comes to dogs, dog behaviour, puppies etc. For example, can a well-bred dog with parents with good temperament in a bad home - go bad? Or an ill-bred dog end up being in a good home and have no behavioural issues? I'm curious for opinions from people with some experience (I don't really know - that's why I'm asking!).

No dog futon - just an old european pillow. I balk at the cost of dog beds! I will however, and soon, invest in a good crate - I wish we'd done crate training sooner....... ps - I'm experimenting with quoting here.... did it work? Nope! pps - good to hear the herding went well - looking out for the movies!!!!

Yeah I had the suspicion he really liked playing ball - and that it wasn't about me at all! I was curious about the opinions that would be offered I guess. I do 'tricks' and 'training' mostly I think because I like spending time with my Puppy in an interactive way!

Okay my trick training experience has been with two dogs - a mini poodle when I was a teenager and now a bc cross. Both are (well the mini poodle is gone now) very smart dogs. But there's a huge difference in the perceived (as in, by me) willingness of the dog to do something for me, with Max (the bc cross) being far more interested/motivated in getting a reward. His initial response to my initial attempts at any kind of training has been what has spurred me on to keep going and learning more - for example, obedience training, more "tricks", and then dog sports. It seems to me that he really likes it. Its an interesting psychological question I think. And I think all because we think the dog is happy doing tricks, is it necessarily so? For example, my dog is ball-obsessed. But is it that he wants to play with the ball because he loves doing it - or because somehow he thinks it is what I want him to do? Too deep for a sunny Saturday afternoon? I think so. Procrastinating hanging out the washing - ha!

Clastic - I know what you mean about giggling and this thread. My OH also thinks I have 'issues'.... Niques - that grinning blinded puppy is just priceless! You have to put that on your Christmas cards! And as to dog hair in the bathroom... I often find it on the toilet seat Yes I know. I figure I'm sitting in it .... Though I have gotten over filling up the vacuum cleaner for each vacuum, and the hairballs that have now appeared under the fridge.... sighs.... As to Hills - we tried a few (another no no, I know) and it was the only food with big enough biscuits that they had to be eaten and not just inhaled. I do find though, and another gross out sorry, that what comes out is always > what went in, still not sure how that works..... I'm purposefully avoiding reading that thread. This is the comfy corner... remember? Okay I'm on a mac so no Microsoft. I have imovie, but its so fast, and I'm learning it as I go. Will get there. One day. Also have a crappy camera that takes fuzzy photos. Definitely looking forward to some herding videos and pictures! I think my Puppy spent some time today dreaming of sheep.......

Hee heeeeee! Upside down wall-hang! Well better late than never!

**raises hand to be included with the non-tech savy people** KTB - you made that video in one day?!?!?! I'm hopeless! I've been working on ONE on and off for weeks!!!!!! And Elbie does look so big! And shiny ... (we're on Hill Science - didn't realise it was 'reviled'.... good grief! It costs a bomb too!). lilli_star: what a beautiful puppy! Kuma: you're not alone with the PSD. I just want to let you know that..... You're not alone. The main symptom we experience is the unsuspecting chomping of sock, while it still contains a foot within, hurts more than stubbing your toe - and hard to foresee under a table!!!! My treatment strategy involves over-exposure (while I'm putting away washing and rolling the socks up, I throw them all at the little guy, and there's just too many so he gives up....! Bring on summer!).

Interesting question about pack dynamics. Like many, I'm the primary 'trainer', 'command giver', 'walker', 'feeder' etc. (OH works long long long hours). BUT!!!!! My OH has all the authority *somehow*. For example, Max is happy to follow me around, but as soon as OH comes home from work (usually quite late), then he can really settle. If I say 'no' or 'off', its obeyed, but not as enthusiastically as if my OH says it. A dog trainer explained to my OH how to make the 'grrrrr' noise to stop puppies from biting/being naughty. I can't make that noise, no matter how much I try, and usually just spur Max on to further excitement. When my OH did it, all naughty behaviour ceased immediately! Also, its come home greetings. I get launched at (I turn my back and ignore until puppy has settled down, getting better these days) - without even trying, Max rolls at my OH's feet when he walks in the door. What is with that????? I think it must be my OH's deep voice and that he's quite tall. Imagine what he could do if he could harness that power.......!!!!!! (For good of course!).

I guess you can see Mr Squeak wasn't very impressed...

Very clever! Is that a clock on your wall???? Unfortunately only "Mr Squeak" would cooperate....

Yeah okay, stick to the wall, could be a good challenge to try..... Here's one at the aforementionedtwice dog park. Not so much like Elbie in this one. He's getting quite a 'collar' of fur around his neck. Makes him look very distinguished. Still, not as distinguished as a dog on a wall!

Oh no! Please don't think I'm smug! I know we're a work in progress.... just that we've progressed beyond luring and treating to get the dog into position in the first place! At class he's pretty good with the distractions (he only has eyes for me when I'm doing my mickey mouse on helium voice!) - and I was only just starting to fade out treating for every command. But we've got a long way to go, and I think the problem is I'm busting to get to the next challenge! And trust me.... someone's just ripped a whole in our couch while I'm sitting here typing this... :D But photos... Here's he is with his 'I want to be just like Elbie when I grow up' face.... And here he is showing he can 'heel' just like Elbie too: (Ignore my treating, its all over the shop! And all my videos are in the kitchen I know, but there's a handy drawer to rest the camera on!). KTB: thanks for the suggestions! Keep them coming! We can do 'speak' and 'touch' and 'eat the books in the bookshelf' (what he's trying to do right now. If you even notice I"m logged on here for ten hours straight, its because I've gotten a wee bit distracted). Clastic: a peg for the shy dog trick??? Eeeks! Poor puppy! Hmmmmm.... (looks from clothes line to naughty puppy) Nicques: I also have an avid TV watcher! Its hilarious! I really wonder what they can see when they're looking... That scratch on his nose is from aforementioned dog park..... And sorry for the distracted half sentences post. Someone's eating an immunology textbook.... and a long foresaken thesis (I should let him have it, shouldn't I?! Ha!)

Don't get me wrong. Its what we're going to do between now and then that's the problem. I'm already 'ahead' and 'in trouble' for doing sit and drop with hand signals rather than still luring and teaching him how to do it with treats. And I'm also 'in trouble' for teaching heel and rollover, which they don't do until the basic classes. If I keep going, inspired by all you guys of course (wink wink), and start trying to teach him to go to his mat or stay then it'll be the same for the basic class!!!! Which leaves me trowling the internet looking for really obscure things to teach! Or worse - getting really lazy with it all!

Dirt aggression! Ha! Do you know what the treatment is for BA (book aggression - the tendency to take advantage of unsupervised moments to pull books out of the bookshelf and rip up the pages)???? Unlike DA, somehow I don't think the solution will be to fill the hole with poo! I remember that picture of the peanut butter, which is why I tried it out with the vegemite. When I saw that photo I did think it was odd that you'd put it up on the poor guy's head - but I had a mental image of you tryingto get it on the snout, and little Elbie twisting his head around to get it off your finger, and him ending up with it on his head! In which case, I thought it was a pretty good shot!!! Ha! Max has his mouth open half the time we're working on this, and my attempts to put the sticky on his nose have once or twice ended up with me putting it directly in his mouth..... ooops! Now the game is he gets a treat when he spits it out and doesn't swallow it! What's wrong with being in the beginner's class... by the way????? What's even worse is that we can't do basic obedience til NEXT year - Feb. Max will be 10 months old by then! Don't even get me started....

KTB: no not peanut butter - I've got a vegemite puppy! Unfortunately he has a loooooong tongue - and so that strategy didn't work! Eek - this is all getting a bit radical! You all mean to tell me your dogs AREN'T perfect?! Ha!

"Reading DOL makes one terrified to do anything ... I now have visions of our puppy being disembowelled by hordes of vicious DA dogs while choking on chicken bones, a kong and being strangled by his own collar" Like lilli-star I'm also laughing at this. What a vision! But you're right about DOL. I try to be very careful what I write and KTB... your last post is very very very brave....... Luckily for me, I went to the dog park before reading about it on DOL!!!! And you know what? I'm addicted! I've met some lovely people there and we have a little group that meets every day. When I'm having a bad day, its something I look forward to! You stand there in the fresh air after being dragged to the park by your puppy (they know where they're going...!), and watch them run and play and tumble with the other dogs. Though I think I'm especially lucky because two of the people are actual dog trainers. You guys talking about going into drops from sits... that's what Max was doing when the instructor thought he'd 'lost' it. She was trying to get me to see how long Max could hold the sit for while giving me eye contact. Unfortunately, after about 5.5 seconds he'd drop. Now I have to get him to sit, then say 'yessss' and keep posting treats until I 'release' him. That seems to have fixed it. Cross fingers for this weekend anyway. I think tricks are very stimulating - and its work the dog is doing for you, which is something that makes them happy, in my opinion anyway! I have been working on 'shy puppy' at the moment..... soooooo..... how much sticky tape can a puppy eat before its going to cause an issue?! After watching that german shepard you tube video that KTB recommended. That dog just sits there so calmly while his owner puts the tape on his nose!!! Which dog does that?!?!?!?!!!

Nicques - you're definitely not alone with the feeling like giving up halfway through the lesson - and I've only had four!!!!! We also had a warm day here last Sunday, and I'm sure even Max was gagging by the end when I tried to give him yet ANOTHER piece of warm frankfurter.... The farts later were the worst ever! Our lesson was so bad, the instructor afterwards wanted to talk to me suggesting that Max had 'lost' his sits and drops and didn't know how to do them anymore. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm..... Clastic - those are some seriously cute puppies! And congratulations everyone for passing!!!!

Or 'Love, love, love.... its got to be looooove'.... Something like that! Agility also looks like a lot of fun and anything that gets them thinking and moving I think will be a winner! Our first day at dog obedience we walked past dogs training for agility with the upright sticks. First a bc went zoom zoom zoom through the sticks - beautiful to watch. Then an older dog came along. He walked around one, walked around another, then wandered off to say hello to a dog walking past! Hilarious! I was really surprised at the flyball competition how it all worked. The dogs go into the ring, they all start barking, they run maybe once or twice, then come out of the ring, (these dogs at least had their little paws put in water), and then straight into a crate. To them it was work, and once it was done they were calm. So I don't know if it would encourage bad hyperactivity. I hope! Anyway - I will definitely post updates - we start next week! Today I had an opportunity to practise 'ball recall'. It worked it worked it worked it worked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He wanted to go home with some other dogs (he thinks he's part of this other pack... I so have to get him a playmate!) - I gave a squeak, he came flying! (with five other dogs in the park.... welll.... nevermind....), and when he really came up close to me I gave a 'yessssss' and threw his ball for the reward. Yay!!!!!! The dog. The ball.

Kavik and dancinbcs - thank you for the advice. Especially for breaking it down like that too. That is really helpful for me the novice!!!!! Its very encouraging to hear that ball-obsessed dogs are easy to train! So far I'm having a lot of fun with training (though with a few frustrations - usually because I'm doing something wrong! Not the dog!) - and I'm always spurred on even further by how responsive and quick and so eager to please the little guy is! I like your story about walking backwards through the park, dancinbcs, especially. Not that I have sought out specifically this working characteristic in a dog, but its really nice knowing you can make him happy by giving him work to do! Max will walk backwards away from me when I'm about to throw a ball, and I'm trying to capture this behaviour to give it its own command. More difficult than I first thought.... Yesterday in the park we met a working kelpie (as in actually from a farm). I wish I had recorded their greeting!!! Both dogs stared at each other from metres away, then walked a few 'stalking' steps, then dropped, then a few 'stalking' steps, then dropped, and so on, until eventually one broke it and made a charge! They were the best play mates because the kelpie wanted to chase/herd, and Max loves to be chased and is constantly trying to stir someone up to chase him. Needless to say he slept well last night! But in that context I can understand that there is a definite difference to the terrier style of play. I will definitely avoid this situation in the future. lilli_star - I think flyball is cool too! I actually went and watched a competition and I like how serious it is and how pumped up the dogs are! (And KTB, as for music taste, when you google flyball you tube videos, you always get rocking music - whereas agility/tricks videos are always 'lovey' music - very funny contrast!).

Okay so the idea is to distract him from other balls with his ball? I think that can work.....! I used to always carry around his ball, the squeaky one, for just in case he didn't come back when I called. I should keep doing that. All I would have to do is squeak the ball and I would have his immediate full attention...... Of course then catching him would be another problem, but at least his eyes wouldn't leave me! KTB: sorry I have been slack with photos! I think we were having too much fun with the movie making - I wanted to try to put a movie together, with sub-titles, and music - and I can become very single focused - its nearly there....... We've had a bit of a traumatic last few days though with the little guy losing a whole bunch of teeth, I found four this past week alone! And they're all from the back of his mouth, which resulted in a lot of blood and other 'symptoms'. Could be another topic for discussion (is it okay that its so traumatic?), though if he's got more to lose I will eat my new bumbag!

Yeah okay. We're only four weeks into obedience, and we're only in the first puppy class so not much recall/down-stay as yet. So I guess I'll avoid the situation til then! We are going to start 'training' (ie not competing) for flyball soon so that should help to focus some of that ball-chasing energy!

Do you think its because I put the ball away? Thereby making it a 'special' game? Should I leave it out with his other toys to try to desensitize him to it? The one we have does squeak.... so it is a bit of a sanity thing!