Dr Bruce Syme

Does your Sensitive Skin mix contain oats as well? I have a 5kg BichonX with itchy skin who I feed premium kibble supplemented with extra (cooked) chicken/tuna/salmon. I am interested in a Australian made natural product though. Does your Sensitive Complete Mix require mixing with raw meat? Yes, it does contain oats. The Sensitive Skin is the base Complete Mix with Protexin, milk thistle, omega 3, quercetin, green tea, zinc, colostrum, astragalus and perilla seed also added. Raw meat is required to be added to the Complete Mix. CM was designed to give people the option of feeding raw and knowing that they were providing a balanced diet for their dogs. We do have Premium Choice available, which is a refrigerated, already mixed diet. It is available in Puppy, Adult, Weight Loss etc. The sensitive skin version of Premium Choice is called Allerblend.

My puppy still eats sticks and bark lol Are they Lab's I spot in your signature :laugh:

A few tablespoons of whole oats per day for a ~ 25kg dog can help with faecal bulk. The Complete Mix mimics everything a wild dog might do in a day, including eating indigestible fibre. Many dogs are seen chewing on bark, sticks and mature grasses.

The whole grains that you see are supposed to be there they are added as roughage Correct, the rolled oats and barley is included for nutritional benefit, and the whole oats are to bulk up the faecal matter, to empty the anal glands by fully stretching the sphincter muscle. Small poos might be good for cleaning up, but they can lead to anal gland problems.

Have a read through here. Rabbit is included http://www.vetsallnatural.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=83&Itemid=95

Yes, unfortunately there are people who don't follow government regulations. They shouldn't continue as auditors and inspectors weed them out. Sadly, the cowboys probably exist. Getting to know your local supplier is a good idea. Every industry which involves animals should be held to the highest scrutiny.

I wont post a slab of info, but for anyone interested Dr Bruce Syme discusses what he sees as the positive's and negative's of each protein source. Kangaroo included. http://www.vetsallnatural.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=83&Itemid=95 Bruce believes organic chicken is a great meat source, just can be an expensive exercise.

Some information on Kangaroo meat. Someone also made an interesting and valid point on kangaroo's eating non organic pasture. We will investigate that futher to the theoretical % it could make up. KANGAROO This is my preferred choice of meats – kangaroo. Fresh kangaroo meat has been widely used in Australia as pet meat for over 30 years, and more recently, it has made significant in-roads into the pet food industry, with sales of roo meat in supermarkets escalating dramatically over the past 5 years. Kangaroo meat is widely available in Australia at most pet supply outlets, and in supermarkets. Due to increasing demand, the price of kangaroo has unfortunately increased significantly over the past 2 years, now retailing for $4.00 + per kg. Interestingly, roo meat has never really been used in processed pet foods, most likely due to concerns with negative consumer “perception”. Nutritionally, kangaroo meat is superior to all the farmed meats. It is low in fat (3 - 4%), high in protein, and high in vitamins and minerals. Because kangaroo is not farmed, the meat is truly free range, and organic. Kangaroos graze a very wide variety of pastures, wild grasses, shrubs and trees, and as a result of this variety, they enjoy excellent health, and their meat has a wide array of macro and micro nutrients. Kangaroo is a highly suitable meat source, and is a natural prey animal of the wild Australian dogs – the Dingo. Kangaroo is considered a “cooling” meat, as it lives in a very dry and arid environment, and as such, is ideal for treating pets with food allergies. Also, because it has never been widely used in processed pet foods, it is also a very unique source of animal protein, and is very valuable when formulating a diet for pets with food allergies. Kangaroo is not farmed in Australia, hence the meat itself is considered “wild game” meat, and is, by nature, free range and organic. Kangaroo numbers have escalated in Australia since the 19th Century, with modern farming practices opening up large areas of grazing land. Culling of kangaroos is vital, both to prevent over-competition with domesticated farm animals (primarily sheep and cattle), but also to prevent massive overpopulation in good seasons, where kangaroo numbers can escalate out of control, which can then lead to massive death tolls in subsequent drought years. Culling of Kangaroos is a very closely controlled, government regulated, business. Every year, aerial surveillance is undertaken to record accurate population numbers, and a cull quota is established for each state, to maintain an appropriate sustainable base population of kangaroos. Kangaroos are shot in the wild by professionally accredited shooters; every shooter is licensed and must purchase government issued ear tags, which are immediately attached to any kangaroo that is harvested. Kangaroos must be killed with a single clean head shot. There is no stressful period of mustering, handling or transport involved at all. The kangaroos are then transported to a local chilled container, which is then transported to the local processing plant. Every animal is then inspected by a government appointed meat inspector, and then approved for processing. Carcasses to be used for human consumption are processed in separate production areas, and have a second inspection before being cleared for HC. The quality of meat used for HC is no different to that harvested for pet food, and differs only in the processing and inspection stages

Thanks - I'd like to follow up this comment with you directly - would you mind if I did? It is not to challenge you, but to make sure I have understood something correctly. Erny, by all means. I have spoken to Bruce about your query and he is more than happy to discuss. I will PM you his mobile number and email. EDIT: Erny, your PM box appears to be full, can you PM please

We often hear people say their dogs vomit up bones, and have noted this issue discussed here on Dogzonline. The following explains the gut acidity and conditioning that is required to digest raw meat and bones Gastric Acidity, Digesting Bones, Gut Transit Time and Salmonella There has been much debate about the “potential” dangers of feeding bones to dogs, and also of the potential risks of food poisoning and salmonella infection that the feeding of raw meat to dogs and cats may carry. So it may be of interest to note that much of this information, or mis-information, relates back to the very nature of the gastric environment of the dog and cat, which in turn, is directly related to diet. The gastric acidity (gastric PH) of the stomach of a dog or cat eating a diet predominantly made up of raw meat is very low (very acidic), with a PH of 2 or lower (relative to the level of meat protein). This highly acidic environment favours the breakdown of raw meats, and raw bones, into soft digestible material. The low PH also is highly effective at killing bacteria, particularly potentially pathogenic bacteria like salmonella spp, clostridia, campylobacter and E Coli. So the natural ‘wild” diet of dogs an cats has evolved a gastric environment that favours the breakdown of raw meats, raw bones, and a PH that kills potentially harmful bacteria – consistent with the requirements of carnivores, and in particular, the scavenging nature of dogs. Also matched to this highly carnivorous diet (raw meat diet) is a very effective digestive process, which occurs in a relatively short gastrointestinal tract. Dogs and cats have a significantly shorter GI tract compared to other non meat eating (herbivorous) animals, whereas man has an intermediate length. The relative length of the gut reflects that nature of the diet, and how efficiently or slowly the food is broken down and absorbed. Fresh raw meat is easily digested and absorbed compared to vegetable matter, and as such, carnivores have a short gut, and rapid gut transit time – fresh meat can be digested and processed in the carnivores body in as little as 8- 12 hrs, whereas plant and vegetable material in a herbivore’s gut can take 3-5 days to be processed. What we see with the advent of processed pet foods, is a significant change in the general nature of ingredients in the diet. It is a simple commercial fact that meat protein is the most expensive component in any pet food, and as a result, there is always commercial pressure to keep meat protein levels to a minimum, thereby keeping costs down of the end product (and / or maximising profits). Modern processed pet foods have adapted to these financial constraints firstly by significantly increasing the carbohydrate component of dog and cat foods – corn, wheat, rice, potatoe and other forms of carbohydrate are often the first and most major ingredient in many pet foods. Secondly, processed pet foods have also begun to substitute meat (animal) proteins with plant based proteins that are much cheaper – ingredients like Soya bean and lupins are cheap sources of protein that will increase the overall protein % on the label, but without the associated increase in cost. The problem with this type of substitution is that it does directly impact on the digestive environment of the dog or cat. In dogs and cats that eat these diets with high carbohydrate, high plant protein and lower meat protein, we find that the acidity level of the stomach begins to decrease (gastric acidity relates to meat protein), and the stomach becomes progressively more alkaline (PH 4 and above). In this less acidic environment, several key issues arise; 1. With the altered PH, gastric digestion and emptying slows down 2. With the altered PH, food bacteria and contaminants are not destroyed as effectively 3. With the altered PH, raw bones and bone material is not softened and broken down effectively (digestive enzymes loose function) and this can result in obstruction. These problems become clinically apparent when a dog that is fed a highly processed diet is offered a raw bone, or a meal of raw meat. Because the stomach acidity is directly dictated by the meat protein content of the diet, these dogs all ready have a less acidic stomach, which is not able to soften and breakdown raw bone material, nor is the stomach PH able to cope with a load of bacteria. The result can be a sudden “rejection” of the bone or meat, in the form of vomiting, or it can take the form of a bout of acute gastroenteritis, from an overgrowth of bacteria, or it may result in a bone obstruction in the stomach. With the delayed gastric emptying effect, any bacteria that do survive are also able to grow up into much larger numbers, and this effect is continued in the large bowel, with further fermentation of the plant fibre, and a delay in overall gut transit time (up to 24 hrs cf 12 hrs) – this can also result in constipation from excessive water reabsorption, or in loose stools from the over production of short chain fatty acids in the colon. The problem is that it takes from 7-10 days on a meat based diet for the gastric acidity levels to drop down to the natural (preferred) PH 2 level, so it is not possible for the body to quickly accommodate to such diet changes. What we learn from this are a few fundamental feeding tips : 1. If you intend to feed fresh meat or a raw food diet, you must make this change gradually over 7-10 days - a common complaint I hear is from people who feed bones or fresh meat on odd occasions to their dog that eats primarily dry food is that “he/she cant handle fresh meat or bones because she vomits” – as we see from above, these dogs can handle it if it is introduced gradually, and the gastric acidity is allowed to normalise. 2. If you intend to feed raw bones (which I strongly advise as an important part of every day pet health) then you must include some fresh meat every day as part of your overall diet plan to make sure the gastric PH remains low (acidic) 3. Feeding a raw food diet will actually protect your dog or cat from bacterial contamination and food poisoning, and greatly reduce the chance of an obstruction from eating raw bones. It is a fact that dogs that eat processed foods are even more likely to shed salmonella bacteria in their faeces than are dogs that eat raw food !! In summary, most of the dietary upsets we see that involve raw meat and bones are actually directly related to the dog or cats general everyday diet, and not so much in relation to the meat or bones. Given that cats and dogs have been eating raw meat and bones for over 40 million years, it just makes sense that this is what they will thrive on. Dr Bruce Syme BVSc(Hons).

This would be in part why Mandela can only handle a meal of VAN here and there .... I used the Dr Jean Dodds & Nutriscan Food Intolerance Saliva test and one of the ingredients he has proven to be intolerant to is soy. Bruce has always said there are dogs with genuine allergies, and the saliva test could be incredibly beneficial in identifying those. Bruce does believe that too many dogs are diagnosed with carb intolerance, when in actual fact it is the processed carb's that are causing unnatural immune system responses. For Mandela, you could make up a meal with meat, the above recipe without the soybean and then add the VAN Health Booster. The Health Booster is the vitamin and mineral supplement that is used as a base in the Complete Mix. Each variety then has applicable ingredients. Senior has chondriotin and glucosamine, Sensitive Skin has our Skin & Coat Formula etc.

Hi Greyt, Bruce likes the use of the frames for dental health. Good question about the ratio of the frame to the meat/VAN portion. There is no definitive answer for the exact ratio, as with feeding raw the dogs body condition is the best indicator. If you are following the feeding guidelines with Complete Mix and also giving a frame every second day and the dog started to carry more condition, I would cut the frames in half and also slightly reduce the the amount of Complete Mix/meat. Bones are great for dental health, so we don't want to cut out the chicken frames. I am going to get Bruce, who is working in his clinic today, to provide a better answer as to the potential kilojoule and percentage of diet the chicken frames could make up.

Only for dogs who don't gulp their food. My two wouldn't chew a chicken wing. That's good, english.ivy, that you have identified your dogs not being suitable candidates for chicken wings. Have you found a suitable size bone for your two? Chicken wings are good, as both sides of the teeth get a little abrasive action, but as you have found, if they get gulped whole there isn't much tooth action happening.

We advocate bones for dental hygiene and environmental enrichment. Without the bones the diet is still balanced. Chicken wings are great for teeth cleaning.

Hi Megan, I have quoted the relevant section. We certainly do suggest bones, just not as the sole food source. The nutritional powder mix is part of our 'Home Made' recipe for people wanting to follow a totally home made, raw diet.

Hi Meh, Have a read of this article. Also the whole oats in Complete Mix are designed to not be digested. They are there to assist with anal gland expansion on the exiting journey. A grain of truth Dr Bruce Syme BVSc(Hons), MRCVS For those of you who have been reading and researching information on natural diets for dogs and cats, it is time to set the record straight on the issue of grains. There is conflicting information being published on the use of grains, as part of a natural diet. Some vets advocate no grain at all but lots of vegetables, and some believe a diet based on just raw meaty bones is all a dog needs. Others recommend a small portion of grains in the diet. So what is the truth ? The basic controversy has arisen because of the very high cereal content used in processed pet foods. Many canned and dry dog foods contain up to 4 times as much cereal content as meat. This cereal is cleverly flavoured with meat render (boiled offal and carcass remains), and is often disguised as “meaty chunks” using food dyes and gums. The simple fact is that dogs and cats are not designed to eat such a high content of highly refined starch (cereals ground into flour). These cereal flours are used as cheap fillers, to bulk out the pet food, and increase profit (decrease manufacture costs) as meat proteins are very expensive. Cheap starch has little nutritional value, except for calories, and can result in a diet with too much refined sugar. It is this fact that has lead some vets and nutritionists to broaden the issue on cheap carbohydrates, to encompass grains in general. But this is not true. I agree that cheap carbohydrates used in commercial pet foods are not good for health, but this does not mean that dogs and cats do not actually eat some grains. We must remember that both dogs and cats often do ingest grains when they catch and eat live prey. The natural source of prey for dogs and cats is generally herbivores….plant eaters. When a dog catches its prey, it will first eat the organs and then the gut content of the prey animal, which is full of semi-digested plant and grain material. This can make up almost 30% of the weight of the prey animal. After this feast, they finally eat the meat and bones. The order in which they consume the prey is a simple and clear indication that the grain / vegetable content of the diet is vital to their health. Why else would they eat it first ? Dogs are considered omnivores, not obligate carnivores (unlike cats). This means that they are able to survive on a diet that does not contain meat. The most basic indication here being that they can survive on a diet of plant based material….grains, fruit, vegetable matter etc. It simply stands to reason that if an animal can survive like this, then their bodies must be fully equipped to digest and process these types of food groups. An important point to mention here is that dogs and cats cannot digest whole grains. They do not graze fields of barley and eat the grains. What they do is ingest the grain from the gut content of the prey animal. This grain has all ready been masticated (chewed), partially digested, and has been fermenting in the animals gut at 38.5’C. Presented like this, a dog or cat can now easily digest the grain material. The same goes for plant material. Dogs and cats have a poor ability to digest intact plant material (they lack the enzymes to digest the cellulose plant cell wall). When they eat plant material, it is either direct from the gut of the prey, predigested, or they scavenge old composting vegetable matter, which is auto-digesting (decaying). The same goes for fruit material. Dogs generally eat fruit off the ground, not off the tree, where it has all ready ripened, and started to decay. The only time cats and dogs can digest fresh plant material, is when they eat very young shoots. If you watch them eat grass, for nutrition, not as a means of making themselves sick, they are very selective, eating only the very fresh green shoots, not the bigger, greener leaves. This is because the new shoots have a thin cell wall that can be digested, whereas older plant cells develop a tough, indigestible, lignified cell wall. Cats are true carnivores, which means they must eat meat to survive. They are not scavengers like dogs, and will only eat fresh prey. They do eat the gut content of their prey (grains and all), like dogs, and do consume small amounts of fresh green plant material, but in general, their diet is much higher in fresh meat content. Grain material would make up only 10-15 % of their diet. When I developed my grain/vegetable mix (Complete Mix), I modelled it on the way dogs and cats would naturally eat grain. The grains are crushed / cracked, the vegetable matter finely chopped or powdered. The mix is soaked (fermented) just as it would be, in the gut of the prey. The carbohydrate in the grain is then readily digested by the dog or cat. The nutritional value of the whole grains are preserved, and not damaged by processing and bleaching, as is the case with cereal flours. The amount of grain/veg to meat has been carefully calculated to meet the energy and growth requirements of the animal, and its natural dietary intakes. The cat mix has only 10% grain/vegetable matter (dry weight), and the dog mixes vary from 15% (puppy) to 20-25% for adult and senior dogs. This is an accurate reflection of the normal carbohydrate intake of a wild dog, and is presented to the dog in a state that it would naturally digest it. So the final word on grains. They are ok, as long as they are unprocessed, cracked or crushed, pre-fermented, and make up a much smaller portion of the diet than the meat content. It may be true that some dogs and cats may fare better on a diet with little or no carbohydrate, but on the whole the are a valuable source of nutrition.

Sounds good, I'll keep an eye out for them. Any idea on price? When released they will be at a cheaper price point than our Premium Choice fresh product on a dollar/weight comparison. The final RRP hasn't been set as yet, but will be competitive with the other rolls available.

For anyone interested in some of Dr Bruce's articles. Some of this information is what he has presented at Australian Veterinarian Association conferences. Perfect nutrition for the perfect puppy If we could go back in time to the very first day man befriended the dog, I'm sure we would find it all started with a puppy. Puppies are the picture of innocence, love and affection, and will warm the coldest of hearts with their instant adoring attention and playful antics. And it was these traits, that carry on into adulthood, along with many of the common hunting, protecting and scavenging skills that dogs possess, that ensured the dog's place as "man's best friend". But even though that happened over 10,000 years ago, man's actual impact on the dog, on an evolutionary level, is less than 0.01 %. The dog family (Canidae) have been evolving for over 40 million years, and for the first 39.99 million years, they had no human contact. So if we are to ask the question, what should a puppy eat to get the optimum in nutrition, healthy growth, strength and vitality; should we ask a scientist? a veterinarian? a pet food manufacturer? a zoo keeper? or mother nature herself ?? Common sense feeding practices are they key to good health ! In just about every situation where mankind has altered the natural feeding practices of domesticated animals, whether it be for reasons of increased growth and production, better condition or speed, convenience, profit, or simply by the nature of domestication and confinement, which prevents natural migration patterns, we see deterioration in health, and the emergence of new diseases. Mother nature, for want of a better name, or Darwin's theory of evolution, has been at work for millions of years evolving genetic traits and structuring every single organism to best survive and thrive in it's given environment.And the basic essentials are how to eat, how to survive, and how to reproduce. Dogs are no exception. They have been evolving for over 39.99 million years eating raw food (prey) and scavenging scraps. And that is exactly what they thrive on ! Nature has a counterpart for every domesticated animal, be it dogs and wolves, cats and lions, horses and zebra, cows and buffalo, pigs and boars........ and in every situation, you will find diseases and degenerative conditions that are not prevalent in the wild counterpart. Yes, domesticated animals often live longer due to their protected environment and help from mankind, but in almost every situation, the domesticated animal will suffer from diseases that are either not found or are very rare in the wild. And why ? Because in every situation man has changed their natural diet ! Do wolves suffer from allergies, flea hypersensitivity, gingivitis and gum disease, anal gland blockage, sensitive bowels and food allergy, hip or elbow dysplasia, diabetes, thyroid deficiency, early onset arthritis, autoimmune diseases or the vast array of cancers that are diagnosed in dogs today ? No ! Why not? Because they eat a natural raw diet, the same diet they have evolved to eat over 40 million years. Their whole body, from teeth, salivary glands, stomach, intestines, organs and enzymes, has all been finely tuned over 40 million years to process and digest raw food: meats and organs, bones, fur, feathers, insects, plants, fruits and nuts, grasses...fresh today or weeks old, they can handle it all. And they thrive on it. So how different are modern domestic dogs in 1999 ? ......... about 0.01 % So what should a puppy eat to achieve maximum optimal nutrition, health, growth and longevity........a natural, raw, uncooked, unprocessed, unadulterated diet. What is a natural diet for a growing puppy ? Natural nutrition starts in the uterus, and in the diet of the pregnant bitch. Although you can't always know the parentage of puppies, if you have a choice, try and find a breeder who feeds raw food. The health and vigor of new born pups is a direct reflection of both diet and genetics. The importance of the bitch's nutritional plane continues through lactation, where for the first few weeks the pups are completely reliant on mum for all their nutrition (growth), immunity (collostrum), and waste disposal. You can usually pick the strongest pup (often the pick of the litter) at about 2 weeks. At this age the pup is a direct reflection of his genetic make-up, and the bitches nutritional intake. From the time the pup cuts its first milk teeth ( approx. 2-4 weeks old) he or she is ready to tackle solid food. This coincides with increasing discomfort at feeding time for the bitch ( those nice sharp teeth we all know so well !), who is stimulated to start offering solid food. In the wild state, she does this by regurgitating food (voluntary vomiting) for the pups to eat. Food (or prey) she may have eaten minutes or hours earlier, is then regurgitated ; pre-masticated (chewed), warm (38.5 'C) and part digested, for the pups to devour back in the security of the den (or whelping box). Many bitches today will still start vomiting at this stage of lactation, even if you are offering solids already, which is the cause of many a panicky phone call from in-experienced breeders. And what do the pups then eat ? Exactly what mum has eaten. Pre-chewed, partly digested, raw meat, organs, gut contents, bones, fur, feathers, and any other plant or organic material the bitch has eaten. But remember, the bitch is often eating for herself and 6 or more pups, and as a result, her diet is often more varied and ravenous than usual. Infact, the concept of cravings for certain foods, which are experienced during pregnancy and lactation, may play an important role in ensuring balanced early nutrition of pups and people in the same way. By 6-8 weeks, the pups will tackle whole carcass and food brought back by the bitch intact. And by the age of 6-8 months old, the pup has grown and learnt to hunt and scavenge for itself.. So how does this translate to the modern domestic puppy of 1999 ? Very simply : We try to recreate the core elements of the natural diet, with easily accessible ingredients currently available, that will supply the equivalent constituents of a natural diet. It is not that complicated or time consuming, and there is only one golden rule : Do Not cook Anything for your puppy! The cooking and artificial processing of dog (and cat) foods, that began back in the 1950's with the post-war popularity surge in canned foods, is the single most significant impact that man has had on the domestic dog. It represents the most dramatic deviation from nature that we have imposed on any domesticated animal, and is integrally linked to the rapid decline in health, fertility and longevity that our "best friends" suffer from today. The nutritional damage caused by cooking is insidious and far reaching, and too involved to go into in great detail here. As a bare minimum, it damages/destroys essential vitamins, minerals, fatty acids and trace elements in the diet.It denatures (mutates) proteins, inactivates natural enzymes, and kills all natural bacterial flora (sterilises food). It results in decreased nutritional content, increased digestive effort and enzyme output, poorer absorption and intestinal vitamin production, and greater waste production. This all adds up to a diet that is nutritionally deficient, has lowered bioavailability (harder to digest and absorb), and contains mutated protein fragments that may be absorbed across the bowel. Cooking is a completely unnatural, man-made process, and should not be involved in the preparation of a dog's natural diet. What are the ingredients for a modern 'natural puppy' diet ? The ingredients in a natural diet vary only slightly from puppy to adulthood. They comprise the four basic food groups : Proteins, fats, carbohydrates and vegetables. The ratios of these in the diet will vary with the different nutritional requirements of age (stage of growth), metabolism, energy expenditure or exercise levels and reproductive status. A diet based on raw meats (both muscle meats and some organ/offal), bones, mixed cereal grains, vegetables and fruits, and a few basic natural supplements to ensure vitamin/mineral balance, can be adjusted to suit all stages of a dog's nutritional needs. Our aim is to mimic the omnivorous diet (both animal and vegetable) that wild dogs consume. The basic constituents of a weaning diet are no different to that of a growing diet, except that the very act of pre-digestion and regurgitation introduces several key points. The meat portion must be finely chopped or ground to match the pre-chewed state. This increases the actual contact surface area for easier digestion and absorption. The time spent in the gut of the bitch also introduces both a mix of digestive enzymes, and a mix of pro-biotic bacteria (normal bowel bacteria or flora), which are both underdeveloped in the weaning pup. This can be re-created by the addition of enzyme supplements (e.g. viokase, pancrease, Thrive-D), and pro-biotic supplements (live culture, non-harmful, bacterial additives e.g. Protexin powder, live culture yogurt). These two additives will greatly enhance the digestive and absorptive capabilities of the pup, which results in vigorous healthy growth.The mix should also be highly moist, and served at body temperature (38.5"C) . The weaning mix should be made available to the pups as soon as you see or feel the milk teeth erupting (2 weeks plus). Spend some time introducing the food to the pups; let them suckle your finger and then dip it in the mix and repeat the suckle, show them where the bowl is etc. Make sure your bitch is well fed if she is in with the pups during this process, as it will lessen the chance that she will eat the lot herself. The mix should be available as often as possible (ad lib), but the pups should still have full access to mum's milk at least until 5-6 weeks old, or ideally, when the bitch naturally dries up and weans the pups herself. The practice of making weaning diets that are high in dairy products, and often high in cereals, is unnecessary while the bitch is lactating. There is no substitute for the bitch's milk, and certainly not pasteurised milk from a cow. If you must use a milk substitute for any reason, raw (un-pasteurised) goats milk is the best alternative. High cereal diets (farax, porridge etc.) are not ideally suited to the pup's needs. They provide a rich source of energy and easily processed starch and sugars, but the pup has not developed a normal glucose metabolism at this age, and will experience sugar highs and sugar lows (bursts of high energy followed by collapse and sleep). Cereals are also too low in protein for the rapidly growing pup (proteins are the building blocks for body tissues), who is doubling his/her bodyweight every 3 weeks at this stage. The basic nutritional ratio for the growing pup is 70% protein (raw meat), 20% carbohydrate (cereals), 10% vegetable/fibre. The final ingredient is access to raw bones. Bones are a vital ingredient in any dog's diet ; they provide for good abrasive dental action, which maintains healthy teeth and gums, they are the best natural source of calcium in a dog's diet, and they provide solid matter for proper stool formation which aids bowel cleansing and appropriate anal gland function. Bones should be raw, soft enough to be chewed completely, and therefore digested completely, and of a size large enough to prevent swallowing whole. The ideal puppy bones are raw chicken carcasses or frames. They can be made available as soon as the pups are starting to chew solids (or chew on soft toys), and can be continued for life. The pups we raise can easily devour a chicken frame at 4 weeks old. The growth diet (from weaning as a pup to mature adult size) is designed to provide the pup with all the raw materials required for rapid growth. The pup needs higher levels of protein and fats, and more concentrated vitamin/mineral content to keep pace with the rapid growth of body tissues, organs and bones. Correct ratios of key elements like calcium and essential fatty acids, and micronutrients like iodine, chromium and zinc, are all vastly more important when designing a diet for a growing puppy, than that of a fully grown adult dog. The diet outlined below is the result of years of research and trial. We have fifth generation pups due shortly, that will be weaned and grown on this diet, just as their parents, grand parents and great grand parents were. Every generation raised on raw food benefits both nutritionally, and genetically, as they grow to reproductive age. A natural raw diet is the key to better health, vitality, reproductive vigor and long life. The puppy diet for all breeds There has always been a lot of discussion about the different needs of large and small breed puppies, but with a properly balanced puppy diet, the only difference is in the amount you feed, and the length of time you feed it for. All pups need small regular meals during the early stages (the amount is relative to the size of the pups) ; 4 feeds a day up to 6 weeks old, 3 feeds per day up to 12 weeks, 2 feed per day up to 6 months old. Small breed dogs will reach mature size between 6-12 months old, and can be fed once a day. Large breed dogs continue to grow for up to 18 months to 2 years, and should be maintained on 2 feeds per day until then. As long as the diet ratios are correct, this is the main significant difference. The following recipe is designed to make up 1kg of "ready to eat" puppy mix. 700g raw meat 180g of soaked cereal mix 80g vegetable mix 40g nutritional powder mix One teaspoon of flax seed oil (optional.See below) The meat should always be raw, preservative free, and meat inspected. I prefer kangaroo and rabbit, as they are both free range and organic, they are a likely natural source of prey, they are lean meats (approx. 4% fat), and they are cost effective to boot. It is a good idea to add some organ meats on occasion (once or twice a week). A mix of 100g organ to 600g meat is rich enough. Use liver, kidney and heart primarily, and only buy from a butcher or supermarket. Try and always have a bone offering (chicken carcass or equivalent) at least once daily or every second day. The cereal mix is a combination of 5 parts rolled oats, 2 parts cracked barley, and one part each of soybean meal, linseed meal and whole grain oats (although only add the whole oats when the pups are about 8-10 weeks old). This mix is then soaked in an equal volume of water ( i.e. one cup mix to one cup water), and left for 12 hrs (summer) to 24 hrs (winter) at room temperature. This allows for seed germination, and the un-locking of starch and other carbohydrates in the grain, which improves digestion and absorption greatly. The vegetable mix can be very varied. The more soft and rotten the veggies, the better. We use primarily carrot, pumpkin and parsley, with green beans, peas, and any other greens available.Soft mushy fruits are also great..just avoid fruit stones (seeds) and hard cores. Peelings and fruit juice pulp are also great.... basically the contents of your compost bin. The whole lot is then vitamised or put through the food blender until it is a pulp. I also add about one clove of garlic for every cup of veggie mix and pulp it in. The pulping process is essential to allow the dog to be able to digest and process the veggie mix (dogs have a poor ability to digest plant material in tact), and it also prevents fussy dogs from selectively sifting out and leaving the vegetables. The mix can be refrigerated for about 4-5 days, or frozen. The nutritional powder mix supplies the vitamin and mineral supplements that balance off the diet in regard to content and ratios. It contains 12 parts calcium carbonate powder, 9 parts brewers yeast, 3 parts kelp powder, 3 parts lecithin granules, 1 part barley green or wheat grass powder, and 1 part vitamin C powder as sodium ascorbate. Flax seed oil is used as an Omega 3 fatty acid supplement, which are vital for the development of the brain and nervous system. The diet above will provide adequate Omega 3 levels as it is, but given that many people may not choose to feed this every day, a flax oil supplement will make up for any deficiencies in other diets used (especially if dry food is fed). When making a weaning mix (up to 6 weeks old), chop meat finely (minced), add the equivalent of 2 viokase tablets (or Thrive-D as directed), and one sachet of protexin powder per 1kg of mix. Add extra water to reach a thick soup consistency, and serve warm (not refrigerated). Do not use whole oats in the cereal mix. All of the ingredients listed can be easily purchased from your local produce store, health food shop and pet supply outlets / butcher. Most parts of the mix can be made up and stored in bulk (cereal mix, frozen vegetable mix, powder mix). The fully prepared mix will keep in the refrigerator for 4-5 days, and can also be frozen, however fresh is always best. This simple diet plan will help you to rear strong, healthy , show winning pups every litter. Continuing this dietary advice throughout the lifetime of your dogs will guarantee them optimal health and longevity, and will save you money on both feed bills and vet bills. The ultimate result will be to maximise the genetic potential of your chosen breed(s) by eliminating the damaging nutritional trends of the past 40 years. Dr Bruce Syme B.V.Sc. (Hons), M.R.C.V.S. Vets All Natural Animal Health Centre,

If your interested in trying different rolls, we are releasing a Vets All Natural roll in a months time. To cater for people who have told us they don't like handling raw meat, we are pasteurizing the Premium Choice to hold a shape that can be cut/diced up. No preservatives and the same ingredients as the Premium Choice range. At the Sydney Pet Industry Association Expo the rolls generated much interest, from breeders, groomers and store owners. The texture and 'look' of the product impressed many.

Starting a raw diet for a pup is fantastic We produce a puppy raw formula, with all the needs of a growing dog catered for. Either as a pre-made meal (Premium Choice) or a dry mix (Complete Mix) which you add to the meat/bones you are already feeding Bear. Or for a home made diet here is an article written by Dr Bruce Syme. As you read through Bruce gives his ideal homemade puppy raw diet. Hopefully it can give you some ideas. http://www.vetsallnatural.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=64&Itemid=80

If you were interested Mason Gibbs we can easily arrange it, and it's no where near $300. Bruce is aware that some dogs do genuinely have grain allergies, he just feels far too many are misdiagnosed. He would have to be one of the nicest people to talk to as well. Many clients from here who visit his Castlemaine practice can attest to that.

Glad to hear Sue in our office is able to help. Hopefully your delighted with the Puppy Packs. Keep in contact with Sue and she can make sure you have them for every litter.

Alibi, you are correct. PetCafe funded some early development in return for their own brand of Premium Choice. Their product was manufactured seperately from Dr Bruce Syme's Vets All Natural Premium Choice. Our products do not have preservatives added, but the PetCafe did. We were going to cut ties with them, but we believe that they have now removed the preservative. The PetCafe is not considered part of the VAN range. VAN Premium Choice certainly requires refrigeration. Scarlett Dog, we are really proud of our Skin & Coat Formula and Health Booster. For anyone making their own raw formula at home, they are great additives. The Skin & Coat Formula contains Protexin and colostrum, which is really unique, and a calm gut can often result in calm skin. Megan, with the Complete Mix you do only need to add preservative free meat. The range of Complete Mix includes Puppy, Adult, Weight Loss and Sensitive Skin. Each one has the required nutrients for each need. For example, the Adult has chondroitin for joint heath, the Sensitive Skin has calming herbs, Protexin and colostrum, and the Puppy is balanced for growing dogs. We still do recommend raw bones often for dental health.

We are currently discussing with Troy advertising opportunities. Sorry if we have trod on anyone's toes as we have tried to just be reactive when people discuss our products, company or beliefs.

Hi Luckypup If you do try a Vets All Natural diet,just remember how important it is to switch over slowly if you are already feeding a processed diet (tin or dry). Up to 2 weeks Dr Syme recommends. Dogs digestive systems operate differently when on either a natural diet or a processed diet. The stomach needs time to re establish a correct pH and build up the good bacteria required for raw food digestion (not heat treated processed food). Undigested food in the large colon can cause all sorts of issues. This advice is applicable for anyone switching from processed to any raw diet. Luckypup please feel free to PM us and we can email you the 6 week Skin Protocol, which has instructions for introducing the diet, and then how to wean your dog off the diet, and remain itch free, once the immune system is settled. The diet has a 70% success rate in curing allergies with diet alone.