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toy*dog

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Everything posted by toy*dog

  1. would be in the wellington shire area, gippsland is a big place. there is also some in the neighboring shire of latrobe valley not as many as in wellington shire though.
  2. ANKC registered Steve? Puppy farmers have always abused purebred dogs. theres several people down this way that are ANKC registered but unfortunately also breed designer dogs to make some money on the side and im hoping its one lady that had a huge farm and had about 500 breeding dogs and approval from the local council down there. the person was chucked out of VCA but managed to come back in somehow but this was several years ago. most of the farms are from Wellington shire area unfortunately. There is one that use to breed cavs. the terriers i don't know what breed that would be as i know they also have designer breeds with the pedigrees and have done for years and years. They have several breeds and all sorts and went into cats as well i heard. advertise regularly in the papers. 60 dogs would be a drop in the ocean for this person. I've seen their dogs as someone brought a dog around many years ago and the poor dog had that much wrong with it, it wasn't funny, long unclipped nails, very unsound, jaw protruding with rotten teeth, freshly bought from this place. I am hoping beyond hope it is this person and maybe this raid will make them shut up shop for good. there are alot of farms down in gippsland so it could be any one of those. gippsland is puppy farm central as the council supports them. the only council that does. they see it as a money making venture. spoken to many councillors over many years and know their views on all of this unfortunately.
  3. i'll put it in here too, word has gotten out that the agent who collects these dogs from farms and backyard breeders (always advertising in the paper for puppies down this way) has been fined and now the council is looking into their affairs. the locals know who it is eventhough no name has been put in the paper apparently. a relative just read it out to me. this is a possibility, the farm where the pups have been collected from might not have had parvo but then have been put in with other pups from other farms (there are about 30 farms down this way in gippsland they tell me) and then the rest of the pups have gotten the virus. i read in the sun the farm where most of the pups have been sourced from was KKK. hate that name sounds like Klu Klux Klan. think someone might have already said this just putting it out there. and yes, the governments perception of a puppy farm is quite different to the public's perception and everyone elses perception. if a "business" is registered to breed dogs and has all the bells and whistles then they are not technically regarded as a puppy farm. I got into a website a while ago where the government department was actually advising the public to buy from these registered breeding farms. it was all tied in with PIAA as well. so they are patting each others backs all for the almighty dollar. Im now resigned to the fact, you will never go against the almight dollar and the "industry" and the billions of dollars this generates for the councils, vets and government, all getting their cut out of puppy farms unfortunately. i hate to say it, but i think they are here to stay. not unless the public and our culture change their way of thinking......but its in peoples mind from years ago, if you want a puppy you go to a petshop fullstop. went past a pets paradise on my way to looking for a clothes store the other day, and there were two elderly couples around "toy pom" puppies. one said to the other, i got my pup from here and he is healthy and fine. so they are recommending for the other couple to get their pup from there too. no such thing as toy poms, poms come in one size, bred and showed these many years ago. one guy rang me and said to me, i was the treasurer of the state club at the time, there are 3 sizes, toy, miniature and standard. i said you are talking about poodles. no he said, thats the sizes of poms. lol you can't tell some people.
  4. um, may i add that in the local papers where the sick pups came from, i have gotten word that the agent that picks up the pups from the farms and transports them to melbourne or wherever to pets paradise stores has been fined and the council is now looking at his practices, i can't say a name although the locals know who I am speaking about, they advertise quite regularly in the local papers down there for pups or whole litters that he can buy. it was in the paper last week i think. no name was mentioned.
  5. yes i saw that in a government website, they said something in effect to; if you are looking for a puppy go to a breeder who is registered and given approval by RSPCA. ie. a large commercial breeder. when i was communicating with the animal rights people, don't now because they started to look at my family as the bad guys as these animal rights ppl don't trust anyone who breeds a litter of pups or hobby breeders who breed in very small numbers. but when i was communicating with them, i was trying to tell them about the way the dogs were being bred not to concentrate solely on if they are a large commercial breeder they are mistreating their animals. i was then told to shut up and i didn't know what i was talking about, meanwhile i've done a bit of fostering and rescuing myself for many years. they were saying things about vets and about the breeding side that weren't ringing true so i'd say something about it that it wasn't right and then i got told again to shut up. so in essence the ppl that are running these groups are not experienced enough in my opinion to be giving advice about the breeding side and that is the most important thing because you can't really say now about large commercial breeders=puppy farmer=evil mistreater of animals particularly when they have rules and regs to comply to from RSPCA and the govt. what my angle was about was the breeding side, care on grooming long coated breeds, socialisation and choosing the best sires and dams when there are so many and not all get to spend time with a family so the breeder is familiar with the dogs temp and the whole canine family and health in bloodlines which is non-existant in many large commercial breeding premises particularly hard when you have so many animals to sit down and study each and everyone right back to fifth generation etc. etc. to make sure the pups don't inherit any genetic problems. all this I was quoting on rather than the line of oh they are a large scale commercial breeder=puppy farmer and oh that automatically means they are mistreating their dogs. mob mentality which is a bit dangerous sort of almost like brain washing in my mind.
  6. yeah i know what they care about.
  7. and im sure that they check each and every new owner thoroughly before they sell to the person. including the ones over in singapore, Hong Kong, Hawaii and japan, they must fly over with the pup to make sure that the owner takes good care of the pup. then if the pup doesn't fit in im sure that they will fly back over to the mentioned country to get the pup back NOT!!!!!!!!!! how can they sleep at night when they don't know what kind of home the pups are going to esp. in another country. its impossible to check. poor poor pups. this is what really gets my dander up. and yes, this is the big problem isn't it, farmers aren't taking the time to match clearly if they are meeting people with pups, send pups which leads to all sorts of problems not matching owner and lifestyle to pup or breed. can you tell the govt this? no, all they see is $$$$ along with the vets, councils and im sure its all fine just as long as they are all registered and comply to the law which states they must be clean and have percentage of staff to cater to the dogs. grrrrrrrrr
  8. hmmm interesting, just went to have another look and they are saying that using imports and having a large unrelated gene pool ensures healthier pups. now knowing what i do and what i've experienced that is not true that statement. now you wouldn't be making that statement if you had experience with breeding dogs or any animal. thats just not true. so all my dogs are supposedly unhealthy because i line breed are they. :laugh: i've also outcrossed on occassion and i've done that by not importing but using dogs in Australia. we all know it depends on the bloodlines themselves and the way the genes interact with each other and how a dog passes on those genes and genetic problems. Outcrossing means you have a greater chance of breeding in genetic problems as with linebreeding where the genes are more known to be able to weed the problems out. outcrossing means more random genes to contend with. :laugh: this is what i mean. it just sounds like to to me they are very green. what happens if those dogs they've imported turn out to keep throwing a serious genetic problem? plus they have on the website that after handover they have no responsiblity for the health after the pup gets sold up until it gets sold they have made every effort to ensure its health. so what does that mean? if the dog develops a genetic problem inherited they will wipe their hands it sure sounds like that to me with that wording??????????? also there are 2 drop off points for pups in melbourne somewhere. from a car boot? just stating for myself i'd never just meet someone and hand over a dog just like that, i'd want the people to come and visit and meet them before handing over any animal. the people have to jump through hoops to ensure they are going to look after any dog i sell. not that i have many to sell in the first place. as we know alot of breeders do this exact same thing. just saying......
  9. you know what i've got a problem with i've spelt it out enough times on here not going to go over it again then i'll be accused of preaching to the already converted. :laugh:
  10. well i believe mita said it and i agree, registered ANKC breeder but i always tack on screen your breeder. im not trying to stop them calling themselves registered?
  11. im sorry - im not having a shot at you please don't think i am! just sometimes what you write about dog shows and people showing seems to be a bit negative thats all. might be wrong might have interpretted it wrong though. as you know i am passionate about this subject. i know i am preaching to the already converted but discussing in here makes me feel better as im talking to people who sometimes feel the same way i do. And there is that element of the beginner dog owners who come in here to read and learn. this is really for their benefit too, the more we discuss the more people we educate - it is all about education. We might not be talking about the same people though that is a possibility?? there is alot of breeders who come from that area and i know you know which area i talk off. don't want to spell it out here for privacy reasons. i feel like having a talk to these people having a pleasant conversation to find out why they feel the way they do, because its a darn shame we have lost more people out of the ANKC system really is my way of thinking. I've had to support many breeders before in this area as some have been treated very badly. i know if i attempt to contact i might get met with indifference. there is a breeder who is new who has been treated awfully in the showring and still they go to shows and still show. made sure i've supported them and offered to have them call me anytime if they need assistance. it makes a big difference. that particular breed is nearly non-existant all because of no support from older breeders and the breed club closed down because there couldn't be any agreement. there's been no new people for many years. and i got all excited when i saw this new person. she's been pushed out of the showring because she won with her lovely dogs and been treated to badly! its very shameful that there are people in the showring going on like this. bad news for the sport and for pedigree dogs!
  12. im not saying they wouldn't care about their dogs and what they are breeding, ofcourse they'd care given that they are going to charge 4 times the price for the pups, ofcourse they'd care. lol its not cheap to import dogs but whose to say what lines these dogs are from and how healthy they are, but the interpretation is, our dogs are imports so there fore better able to produce pups that are not related to each other there fore better. and if you know anything about breeding thats not always the case. i mean a dog could be a grand champion or be imported doesn't mean it is any better than any other dog just because of the fancy title.
  13. why shouldn't we compare? they are sure doing this in their statements on their websites and in their facebook pages bagging us all. telling the public purebred pedigrees are inbred, unhealthy and especially if the breeders shows because its all rigged so why can't we defend ourselves? and say its not true but not bag them. but it is true, why some breed and they may hide it no one ever says they breed for money, and i don't know why its always been a big secret. even in pedigree circles its always been a big secret, i've known some breeders who show, only show to the public the ones in the house meanwhile out the back had a big shed full of dogs selling to petshops and that was their secret business. so you are right its very hard to distinguish between a breeder who breeds solely for profit as motivation and a hobby breeder out for the breed only.
  14. i know of a heck of a lot of breeders that don't only breed for a ribbon steve, thats only part of the equation as i mentioned before. i know from past threads that you don't show yourself either. there is alot of misconceptions about the showring going around. “A dog show is not a beauty contest. A dog needs to be able to move well and have the right sort of temperament. Most importantly, the structure, or conformation, of the dog must be sound and show no signs of ill health or other problems. I am glad to see strict rules are in place to ensure responsible breeding and showing is practised by breeders throughout Australia.”, states Dr Higgins. i'd invite judgement on ourselves because most of what's been said to me by some of these breeders is based on heresay and inuendo. and praying on the very ignorant which really gets me upset i hate seeing people being duped. and sweeping statements that has no possibility in being true all because of clever "marketing" as you say. i don't know this breeder we are speaking off, if i was a new owner i'd be very impressed but some of what they say because of my experience has no possibility in being able to be accomplished. Have they tried to get into MDBA? i know for privacy reasons you prolly cannot say. how do you know them?
  15. in this state they are following through with this, to be able to be registered you have to jump through hoops its not just a matter of signing up anymore like it used to be, they make the new members complete an exam now. and make them sign a declaration i see, got some papers for some pups the other day, they also say they work behind the scenes and most are not aware of what they do, just take it for granted. So they do do a lot in our state. i don't know about your state. they've also introduced a system to weed out the ones who have multiple registrations under different names so an ID system has been brought in they say. i have no problem with this if it does what they promise it will do, so you see they are trying to do something about puppy farmers. can't please all of the people all of the time. its very hard with thousands of members to police it all you have to remember that. They also have a name and shame in their magazine if breeders contravene the code of ethics we are all made to sign. In the last statement by the president he states that a few members have the potential to give us all a bad name. and i think that is true for the most part. this is where i've always had a problem, why should people who choose to mate their little cross breed pets be given the same rights and have equality? this is where everything is going wrong these days. in days gone by these dogs were known as mongrel dogs today it is mostly the same, they don't go to the trouble we do you all know this what we go through if breeding dogs are done right won't go into that, now they are bred deliberately and bred for money and now these people who mate their dogs want the same rights as us. the world has gone mad in my eyes. and again blind freddy can see why they want to do that that organisation so they can say their members are registered and then they have a right to charge the big bucks for designer dogs cross breeds because they've always wanted to be on an equal par this is their chance now. of course they will when they can see that they can get more $$$ for their pups than being ANKC registered which nowadays is a second class citizen. because all of our dogs are unhealthy inbred beasts according to the media and society. well i rest my case thought that was why. more money eh. huh. 4 times the price and who is going to pay that, they must have rocks in their head the buyers. ofcourse these breeders are claiming they are going to breed healthy pups that are tested but an ANKC reg hobby breeder can do the same thing for quarter of the price. the ANKC don't do anything they just advise the state bodies, its up to the state bodies in each state. and i believe that VCA might be leading the way it seems like it. but still there is alot of work to be done.
  16. the difference is the sole purpose they exist is entirely for money to corner the market on puppies. and its working having a negative campaign coupled with the media these days. yes there are large volume ANKC breeders who also do the same thing in some instances thats why i always say, to screen your breeder as there are farmers in our group too solely out to make a profit.
  17. Very long - they were the first in with the AAPDB but used to be ANKC - they dont believe that is the motivation for their organisation and nor do many others. Just because you think it doesn't make it so. Just work out what you need to say so you are sending people to breeders you are trying to get them to avoid. i think its obvious why this organisation exists. blind freddy can see it, well at least people with a bit of experience up their sleeves. their statements in their website all points to money. and i knew they'd have a beef with ANKC or shows or show people or something in the pedigree world. somehow they've gotten a very bad experience as do some people but why take it out on the dogs and on the sport itself. just because you get treated bad or have a few words alienate a whole group? i've heard this over and over again over many years.
  18. what i thought too, reading about this new breeder we are talking about, they say they are going to be the best in Australia yadda yadda yadda, and mention other breeders doign the same thing reg with the same organisation, how many others are there in that particular breed reg with AAPDB so they can say they are bettering the bloodlines through research of pedigrees and i wonder if the dogs they imported are AKC and they've just transferred them over. did they tell the breeders they will be breeding AKC or ANKC registered dogs meanwhile they had no intention? i'd be pretty mad if i sold a dog for breeding only to find out it was going to be reg with AAPDB.
  19. bingo. they have alot of well known farmers in that organisation. They are all trying to legitimise themselves yes. in the area they are in most of them, as i've been saying for years, they have the support of the vets down there as well as the council. the vets welcome farmers as it is more business for them and the council get their cut out of the money too. pay a permit and then pay to register how many dogs they have as well, its big money. trying to go against big money and big industry is a losing battle.
  20. how long? how long has AAPDB been around not that long really. started up on the internet to support and to legitimise people who want to breed dogs solely for profit. these days thats exactly what i do, i explain the difference, mentioning a "registered breeder" doesn't cut it anymore in today's society. So its best to mention a registered ANKC pedigree purebred breeder and i add that people need to screen their breeder to make sure they are not out to breed dogs solely for profit hence the term in my books "Puppy farmers" and give tips on what questions to ask to find that out. its a detailed operation these days. but the hobby breeder as i said in my first post is getting mixed up in with farmers and this ticks me off because no education is out there to tell the difference and it really needs to be promoted more strongly through the media. our state body says that we all need to be promoting it starts with us as breeders when we sell our puppies but in my opinion its not really enough. its like a strong tide and we are all fruitlessly trying to paddle against it!! I have no problem with registries that are there for a purpose like working dog registries or registries to work towards ANKC recognition to work towards defining a new breed but i have got a problem with registries that can welcome people who breed dogs not to a standard like the one i mention therefore deviating from the original breed and making up a new standard themselves, they mention traditional colours in the breed of dog they are going to add colours not acceptable, when we start accepting different colours and different features we can no longer call that dog the breed that its supposed to be thats why we have ANKC and state bodies in the first place. and bagging breeders who want to improve their selected breed and breed to a standard as set by the authority or custodian of all pedigree breeds namely ANKC and their state bodies and they do that by showing dogs is outrageous to suggest that. but thats what the media has portrayed now and now it is fueled by people who want to manipulate the market purely for profit. i see this as working against not only us as an organistion but against what it means to have a breed of dog, in years to come i can see that if these sorts of groups are allowed to get stronger we will see the end of pedigree purebred breeds altogether. i've sort of put it in here in general to let the public see it too what we are talking about, as this site is very well known now so its better than nothing, and i am talking in here as sort of support as i am very upset about the whole thing as others in here have indicated they are. Any suggestions on how we alter our language? what do we now say? other than what i offered above. how do you get around people who are just out to promote their bank account and not really interested in being custodians of a particular pedigree purebred breed that has taken hundreds and in some cases thousands of years by man to develop? i see these type of people a threat for our dogs and a threat to ourselves im sorry to say. and its all got to do with ignorance, media portraying us the way they want society to portray us in a negative untrue light. it really gets my dander up.
  21. yeah i know not really guiding him at all, the only thing that works with my brother is threaten him into submission. lol after all the info over the years why not to go to petshops and puppy farms he announces he was going to look at petshop puppies. NOT!! lol lol over my dead body he was.....
  22. I was disturbed to find an advertisement in the local paper about a purebred breed of dog kennels after a kennel attendant and giving website details. i was skeptical as to me it sounded like a large scale commercial venture but I was hoping it might be a new ANKC reg breeder. looking at the website i found that this new breeder is reg with APDBA and breeding purebreeds claiming that they are breeding for health and they are not inbred as they have imported their sires from America. So they also had a go at "show breeders" not breeding for health in a roundabout way and referring several times to the show standard not allowing white (for a reason!) but they are going to be the first to allow it. so importing gives them an edge to charge big bucks, no wonder the public is all confused. all the rubbish they had on the website in my opinion was just code for "making money". spinining BS. if i was looking for a puppy today not 26 years ago, i would be so confused about ANKC reg and just the word registered when i see that everything is challenged today, tradition and history. im hopping mad that this kennel is starting up in an area that welcomes large scale commercial breeders. I mean i see that some of the public are listening too much to that program pedigree dogs exposed and the negative media attention about purebreeds in general. but usually it is from people that have no idea, i've been in this world for most of my life and i can say absolutely that in any group there is always some individual who is out for their own cause, but ther is also ethical caring individuals who do the right thing. you can't label everyone in that group the same way! i take offence to the things that has been said about us in the past. im certainly not one of those people who would show a sick dog and i know alot of others who feel the same way, or who would breed on sick dogs or have a line of sick dogs. some people who don't know anything about our world are saying that we are cruel to even contemplate showing dogs! or to force the dogs to mate! lol lol dogs being dogs you don't force them to mate, lol and if the dog is a healthy specimen being shown and winning based on their nice type and a nice example why not, what is wrong with it. its not just a beauty pageant showing also encompases soundness in a dog, body and mind. not just type or looks. explain this very thing every chance i get to most people and most understand by the time i finish with them, although one guy who had the opinion he knows it all, would not listen. you get people like that i suppose, no matter how much of the correct information they receive they still don't want to listen and learn. just wanted to get this off my chest, my family is getting sick of me getting on the Ol' soap box as is my workmates, they even threatened to bring in a soap box so everytime i started up they'd get me to stand on it.....
  23. so that means if you are hobby based breeder just wanting to breed a few dogs to show and kennel club registered you also have to get approval and be in with the large scale commercial breeders. so one day you will see that the breeding of dogs will be banned altogether there is no defination between a hobby breeder and a commercial farmer, still. even in other countries. what hope do we have.
  24. hmm yeah i know of alot of people who just give up finding somewhere for their pet and just hide the dog in the new property. so really they are causing people to be dishonest anyway, much better to have a bond of some sort you have to pay incase the dog does some damage. but sometimes kids can be more destructive than a dog! some landlords won't rent to people with kids!
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