Shiloh Posted August 29, 2005 Author Share Posted August 29, 2005 Poodlefan, Thank you. When he gets mouthy I redirect him with a toy or say "Off" now. I pick him up for a variety of reasons, but he obviously has made a negative connection to me picking him up; from this afternoon I will not pick him up. I'll try to call him, but if that doesn't work (as he doesn't listen as well when he acts aggressive) I put a lead on him to get him to follow. Don't know if that's right, but I need him to move either into his crate for bed, into/out of the car. If calling him doesn't work, or trying to motivate him with rewards doesn't work, do I have any other options but putting a lead on? I am not pulling hard on the lead, he just starts doing "the right thing" after I put it on. I thought leaving him on the couch after he's gotten on it and it's against the rules indicates to him that he's in charge?? Can I say how confusing this all is?? I am desperate for the behaviourist to get back to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 (edited) Shiloh, Susan Clothier is the author of those articles. Her view (which I follow) on the couch issue is that its not important whether or not you allow your dog on the couch. What's important is whether the dog will move when you tell it to. You should get FHR to put up some of her "Vizslas on the couch shots" - Flynn does a wonderful pretzel impression. I think you could benefit from doing a bit of reading on the issue of dog training. Can I recommend a book called "the perfect puppy" by Gwen Bailey? The lead is a perfectly acceptable method of getting the behaviour you want.. .just remember to REWARD it when you get it. ;) Ask yourself what kind of relationship do you want with your dog? What do you want as the basis for it? Fear? Trust? Respect? From that foundation comes the training philosophy you will use. Edited August 29, 2005 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidoney Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 Have you actually had him to a good vet and ruled out anything physical? Whereabout in Sydney are you located? (approximately) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiloh Posted August 29, 2005 Author Share Posted August 29, 2005 Poodlefan, I must be stupid- I bought the perfect puppy over the weekend and devoured it. Twice. I have been using those techniques.... I really need someone to see what I am doing and tell me where I am going wrong, because I am trying everything that I can. The only thing I can think of is that my lack of confidence has shaken him as much as me. As for rewarding... can you reward too much, so that it loses it's appeal? He will sometimes do something good and refuse the reward, even if he hasn't eaten recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiloh Posted August 29, 2005 Author Share Posted August 29, 2005 Sidoney, I am in the inner west. I have taken him to Balmain Veterinary Hospital where the vet looked him over before his 2nd shot- he has an umbilical hernia but the vet said it should be fine until we give him the snip at 6 months and then he would fix it, but that if it enlarged to give him a call. It looks the same size and if we touch it, for example pop it gently back in, he has no sensitivity about it. His stools are good, he drinks a decent amount and eats pretty well, and is full of life and generally happy. He has never shown aggression to anyone but me, gets on well with other dogs, loves people, etc. So the problem is me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidoney Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 (edited) Did you mention to the vet the growling? Or was that after you took him to the vet? Does anyone else pick him up in the way that you do? I ask only as I want to absolutely rule out physical causes. As for rewarding... can you reward too much, so that it loses it's appeal? He will sometimes do something good and refuse the reward, even if he hasn't eaten recently. Sometimes they can get bored of a kind of treat (esp. if a low grade treat), but for a dog that usually loves its food, a very likely reason for refusing a reward may be stress. What kind of treat does he refuse? What is happening at the time? Vizslas can be prone to stress - I know!!! Edited August 29, 2005 by sidoney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy's mum Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 Is it perhaps in the breeding ie an aggressive strain? did you see both parents? was the mother with the pups? might be worth checking with the breeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiloh Posted August 29, 2005 Author Share Posted August 29, 2005 Sidoney, This is going to sound silly, but it's after he's been aggressive with me. It's like he is saying "I don't like you and don't want anything from you". The aggression hadn't started til after the vet visit. Just have to insert here that I just fed him and made him sit and stay- he stayed for the five seconds until I released him! He really is a clever boy. Ginger, I met the mum at a show, but not the dad. The breeder breeds for temperment and were recommened to us for that fact. I actually have not spoken to the breeder, I feel like I've goofed up raising the gorgeous pup they gave us and am too embarrassed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidoney Posted August 29, 2005 Share Posted August 29, 2005 This is going to sound silly, but it's after he's been aggressive with me. It's like he is saying "I don't like you and don't want anything from you". Doesn't sound silly. Sounds like stress. Vizslas are such gentle creatures and they don't do well with dominant handling such as you were recommended to do. Not your fault. I'd be doing relationship building stuff with him. Clicker training is good for this. Breeders would rather know if their babies and their families need help. His breeders are very experienced and I'm sure would be happy to help you. I sent you a PM. Did you get it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiloh Posted August 29, 2005 Author Share Posted August 29, 2005 Sidoney, Just got it and replied. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiloh Posted September 1, 2005 Author Share Posted September 1, 2005 A quick update- met with a fantastic dog trainer who reassured me that I had a happy, confident, ACTIVE boy- in other words, a typical male Vizsla puppy! She introduced me to a few ideas which have worked beautifully so far. For example, I am making him work for his food all day long- there is no food bowl down, I reward the behaviour I like and ignore what I don't like. He has quickly caught on - I am suddenly far more interesting, and he is showing lovely behaviour. We are also walking him early in the morning and then again late afternoon- he had daily exercise before, but not as routine... I think he is calmer during the day because of this exercise, but also because he is constantly "working" on some level all day for his food and is stimulated by that. Thanks for all advice and guidance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy's mum Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 I am inclined to think that 'problem' dogs are often the brightest - and need an outlet to channel their energy. You sound like you're on the right track now, best of luck. He'll be worth the investment of your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haven Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 I agree with that ginger's mum. Good to hear everything is going well Shiloh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 I'm delighted to hear that all is going well - you must be so relieved! Just a note of caution on the exercise - please don't over do the walking. Many people (including me) are of the opinion that onlead walking is too much for young pups with growing bones. It can lead to skeletal difficulties later in life. My rule of thumb is no onlead walking (as a form of exercise) until a pup is 6 months old. Remember that you can give him plenty of exercise with play as well as walking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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