huski

I think as I said above it's largely whether you have a good supplier of raw to get it from who is affordable. My three also don't eat huge quantities, well the pup eats more than the two older dogs, but it's still not a huge amount.

A good working line dog is extremely active, but exercise wouldn't tire them out like training does. Realistically if you tried to use exercise to tire out a WL dog you will be exercising them forever! so tiring them out isnt the goal so much as giving them drive satisfaction, an outlet for their drive to work. I also think a good working line dog should have a solid temperament, they definitely shouldn't be anxious and they should be able to learn easily how to turn off. Managing a dog is a big part of owning one, IMO.

I know it's ridiculous. Chicken necks and frames are the same! I've seen them in the supermarket for between $3-$5 p/kg. What a rip off! I buy mine from my butcher at $1.50 and $1 respectively We can get frames out here for .50c a kg, which is awesome! And makes the supermarket prices even more shocking!

I know it's ridiculous. Chicken necks and frames are the same! I've seen them in the supermarket for between $3-$5 p/kg. What a rip off!

I find it a lot more expensive. Granted, I have no wholesaler and have to buy everything from the butcher or Woolies. But my dogs need an awful lot of food to maintain weight on raw and my costs have skyrocketed. I think having somewhere to buy it in bulk or that sells raw cheaply obviously helps. Woolies and Coles are super expensive! Though I do buy turkey from Woolies sometimes as I can only get turkey necks not wings or legs from the place I buy my raw from. It costs me approx $20 a week to feed three dogs and a cat on raw (well, the cat gets a mixture of raw and dried food).

Does it have to be felt lined? If the leather is good quality it will be super soft anyway?

Agree :) Totally agree! A few weeks ago just after I moved our old dog Micha got out. He was gone before I woke up so would have been out for hours. I spent hours driving around looking for him and was walking down a street calling for him when a lady came out of her house asking if I'd lost my dog. She had seen him early that morning almost getting hit by a heap of cars so took him home waiting for the pound to open. We walked over to her back gate and sure enough there he was. I bawled my eyes out! She was so lovely. I took her and her kids a bunch of flowers and a box of chocolates after work, but nothing could express my gratitude for what she did to save my dog.

I noticed a positive change in my dogs when I switched from premium dried to raw about 4-5 years ago, I also find it's much more economical to feed raw than premium kibble. I'm not hard core about feeding raw (it's my choice and what I find my dogs do best on, end of story) but I do think that the way dried food is advertised leads people to feel like you have to be a scientist to feed your dog a balanced diet. I think it scares people out of feeding raw because they feel like it's complicated or difficult to get the 'balance' right. My personal experience is that feeding raw is simple and I can't imagine feeding any other way. I talk to soooooooo many people who say the reason they won't feed raw is because they are scared of getting it wrong, and it doesn't have to be that way.

Thanks Megan, that was my blog post from earlier this week, how you deliver a reward can make a huge difference to how rewarding the dog sees you. There's a big difference between rewarding a dog and sharing in a reward experience with the dog. There are so many little things we can do to learn how to be more exciting and valuable to our dogs, that when added together make a big difference. efs

No worries, it can differ from dog to dog I imagine and feeding supplements is not something I've ever really put much stock into but the AN stuff really impresses me. I have a 10 year old dog here with arthritis and as anyone with an old dog would understand, I would do anything to increase his quality of life. it is heart breaking to see them getting older and struggling with stuff they used to be able to do with ease.

Hi Kayla1 Just saw this and I wanted to share our experience, one of the dogs at work who is 14 years old went down hill after having a stroke. A few months later she was put on Young at Heart and the results have been amazing. She went from barely being able to leave the office to go to the toilet to running around, playing fetch, barking at the gate again (LOL) and when she sees me training the Mal pup I handle she runs down to the training field and tries to join in. It was truly amazing - I actually thought she was very close to passing away and YAH has really given her a new lease on life.

The people who would buy prongs (not that they are particularly easy to purchase as they aren't widely available like other tools) and use them as a quick fix like that would be just as likely to go through a range of other tools to find a quick fix too - realistically dogs can learn to pull on any tool. Owners who look for tools as quick fixes would most likely end up buying check chains, head collars, anti pull harnesses etc before prongs anyway as they are more widely available than prongs and more people know about them.

I'm not going along with the argument that just because they aren't that interested it's cool to let them do whatever. 100% agree with Cosmolo, these are the people who can least afford to use serious equipment on their dogs since by nature something that does all people claim is going to be a high-risk-high-reward strategy, with highest risk at lower levels of knowledge and skills. Firstly, I didn't say were not interested. Clearly if someone engages the service of a professional they have some level of interest in their dog. I was drawing a comparison to someone who is like many people on DOL, very passionate about dogs and learning about training and do it as a hobby or more; and people who have a general interest in dogs, love their pet but don't want to spend hours and hours training their dogs. I also didn't say "let them do whatever". I said that there are dog owners who love their dogs but don't want to learn in depth behaviour science or spend hours training their dog as a hobby. They just want a well behaved pet and aren't interested in spending weeks or months or longer teaching their dog not to pull excessively on the leash (for example). In fact, I'm not interested in spending weeks or months training my own dogs to LLW either, far more interesting and fun things to train :laugh: Personally from my own experience and others, I don't feel prong collars are hard to learn how to use correctly. I also don't think they are high risk especially once the owner has been shown how to use one correctly. Furthermore, when I say used correctly you'd assume it would only be being used in the first place because (in the context I am talking in) the owner is working with a trainer who made the assessment that a prong collar would be suitable. IMO that's all part of 'correct use'.

Oh KTB I totally understand what you are saying and I agree! I would happily use a prong collar on my dog if I felt it would work the best. I was addressing a separate point which is the reality is that some people don't have the inclination to put lots of hours of training into their dogs and that doesn't mean the dog is neglected or unloved or that the owners are bad dog owners.

Lack of interest is not a reason that is going to get any sympathy from me. But it's the reality. I love training dogs, it's my passion. I put hours and hours of my time into learning more about training and working with my dogs. Average Joe who just wants a well behaved family pet is never going to make the same commitment to training their dog that I make to training mine. That's not a bad thing, if the dog is well looked after and cared for etc. plenty of people will never want to put the same time into their dogs as I do, it's unrealistic to expect otherwise.

Lots of people do commit heaps of time to learning how to train their dogs but many also don't due to lack of interest, time etc. sometimes making the commitment just to seek help from a professional is a huge step. Everyone is so different and varied in their skill level and desire and what they want from having a dog that you need to be open to a range of different approaches working with owners, before you even get to working with the dog.

Add to the pile of one million and three dog training topics that can be controversial :laugh:

I am sure many experienced trainers could train the majority of dogs without tools like prong collars, but what an experienced trainer can do is not necessarily what the dog's owner is capable of doing. It's not always just about what the dog needs but what the owner is capable of doing and within what time frame they need to see results.

Why "thank goodness"? Prong collars are just a training aid or tool. The prongs are spaced evenly around the dog’s neck, which means are more effective than tools like check chains because they apply pressure points to the skin, not muscle. This means that it takes far less force or pressure to apply an effective correction than it does with any other corrective tool. As with any tool the level of effectiveness depends on the person holding the leash. The more dogs and people you train the more you realise that there is no one fits all approach to training or set methods that can be applied successfully with every handler and dog. Prong collars are tool that work extremely effectively with little pressure required from the handler, this gives the handler leverage so that further learning or behaviour modification if required can take place. ETA: What circumstances would they be used? That depends on the dog and owner you have in front of you and whether it is the best tool to help deliver the results they are after.

Oh - those States that have banned them are just uneducated? I wondered under what circumstances they were used?? They haven't been banned in multiple states, just Victoria. And yes, the ban was uneducated, based on no science or facts that prong collars cause injury. How much experience have you had with prong collars?

I can almost guarantee (and I say almost purely because I don't know exactly which pics you've looked at) the pics you're looking at would have been caused by pressure necrosis which happens when the collar is left on a dog for too long (read: weeks or months). The same injuries can occur any type of collar, including flat collars, check chains etc.

Whoops double post

I've seen the Ruffwear webmasters on heaps of Whippets and they fit really nicely.

Prong collars are only banned in VIC. You need a permit to import them but it is not illegal.

The thing is that every dog is different and there is no one size fits all approach to training, raising and living with a dog that will work successfully for every dog. I have three completely different dogs here and if I trained them and interacted with them in exactly the same way it would be a disaster. Definitely get professional help in ASAP from a reputable behaviourist - they will be able to show you how to handle him and how to interact with him so his behaviour is more easily manageable.