Staff'n'Toller

It's ok- if the pup is trying to assert themselves, and to ascertain this, a qualified professional needs to assess the dog and come to that conclusion. Ninety percent of the time dogs show this normal behaviour is because they are scared, not because they are trying to be dominant. You also need to be very sure (when using punishment with a dog) that the dog *will* defer to the human. Dogs who feel confident enough may bite in this type of situation- goes back to fight or flight instincts. The program I was speaking about does not reinforce growling, as we establish the distance at which the dog begins those behaviours, and growling is not the first indication, it's not even the second. The method you describe is old school- yes your dog stopped, but did she understand why? Were her motivations for stopping her defensive behaviour because she understood it was the wrong thing to do? Or because you were scary enough and she deferred to you? Thats a very long bow to draw, does she learn it's not ok? Or does she learn that her suspicions were confirmed- humans around her food are dangerous as she might lose her very precious resource. I had a puppy recently, in one of my puppy pre-school groups, who was showing some pretty full on rescource guarding behaviour over her pigs ear. In four repetitions I changed her mind about having humans near her food, no aversives, or removal of food was needed, I didn't have to touch the pup, and she was happily giving up her pigs ear. If you look closely, when approaching your dog eating now, you will probably find the defensive body language is still there, just the behaviours you punished have been inhibited. With the training program Haven describes briefly, it changes the dogs whole perception about having humans around the food bowl, much less harmful to the dog-owner trust relationship, and it changes the whole ritual, not just parts of it that the humans find inappropriate. Cheers, Mel.

Yep I thought tracking straight away, he's certainly got the breeding for it. Croydon Obedience have a tracking club and maybe Berwick? I stand to be corrected on Berwick. Also some Agility clubs are running NADAC regulated trials with games like tunnelers, I am thinking that would be good for my Stafford who loooooves agility but can't jump due to elbow probs. Cheers, Mel.

Are you still in NSW Pewithers? Just that your avatar says that you are. You have SABS Sydney Animal Behaviour Service, I have attended lectures by both Dr Gaille Perry and Dr Linda Beer, they are both fantastic. www.sabs.com.au Mel. ETA: By coincidence I think I am having the same problems in the conformation ring with my boy, as you are having.

Yes and no Cassiepeia, most produced dog food has a large proportion of carbohydrate, and whilst I prefer rice or brown rice, corn is apparently a very digestible carbohydrate source. Mel.

Hiya, I'm in Melb and I buy mine from a do-it-yourself dog wash/pet supply. They have stocked it for many years as they train in Sledding and have always fed it to their dogs. I'm not sure if it's something the company is doing because they have stocked it for so long..?? Sorry I can't help any further, Cheers, Mel. ETA: Cassiepeia the reason why they are more expensive as well is that you are paying for better quality ingredients, and the same amounts of those in each bag. The quality control in many super premium foods is much more stringent. My dogs never ever have tummy upsets, as the food is always the same, bag after bag.

I have a frequent buyers card buy 10 bags get the 11th free and I'm not a breeder, but the place I buy it from have the VIP cards. Cheers, Mel.

From my POV- I have just started showing a male dog, when a girl has been in the ring, particularly if it's a pre-oestrus girl (and you'd never know) you can not get their noses off the ground! You can also say goodbye to nice gaiting. My breed is always a minority so good or bad gaiting/stacking we will probably always walk away with an award, but if you are in a group I can see how that would be annoying.

Kristie! Please be mindful of the advice you give regarding aggression issues, one dog growling over the dinner dish may not growl for the same reasons another does. Going into battle with the dog or removing food could prove more dangerous, punishing the warning signs dogs give is very dangerous, you really need to have a thorough understanding of the theory behind it all before you go giving advice on a whim. When you punish the warnings, dogs stop giving those all important precursors stiffened body, showing whites of the eyes, lifting lips, snarling etc is all saying "I am not comfortable/I feel threatened about this situation, if you take things further I might feel the need to bite you". Punish the warnings, and the dog stops giving warnings! They feel they need to escalate their behaviour because the human is not listening! Or worse still, attacking back at them for being scared!! Firstly Bret, your dog needs to feel that not only is it safe to have a human near her bowl, it's actually good! Taking the resource away will most likely escalate your situation, don't remove her food please. If she is anxious about her sibling going away, she may well be the lower one in the pack structure. The Alpha is generally cool, calm, collected, don't feel they need to defend much at all, as they are in control. The history and misconceptions of dominance theory would be a good article to start with, please read it right through, the gems are at the end of the article- for you particularly the comments about rewarding deferential behaviour always works well and is fairly safe. You don't specify which State you live in but the Delta Society Australia have Aus wide listings of instructors and behaviourists that can help you out. Feel free to pm me if you need further info. Mel.

'She' is great, :rolleyes: I've been to a few of her seminars and read some very comprehensive referral reports, everything is common sense. Great that she also is a Vet so has the medical knowledge to back it all up. Mel.

Have you talked with your Vet about the possibility of full hip replacement in the future? Just wondered, Mel.

I'm happy to help out with the Clicker Training if you need someone to bounce off. I also have the blackdog infin8 halters which are a bit nicer than the originals, although I know you said previously that your boy shuts down in a halter....and you may also need the traditional one to stop eyeballing and return his focus to you. Feel free to PM me if you need. Cheers, Mel.

Could be some sort of auto-immune disease, renal failure is not normal in a dog so young. Auto-immune diseases are horrid things to try to get a hold on, they will need to see a specialist if there is a connection there. Mel.

Yep have worked with Ray too very briefly but he is fantastic too. I agree, I had always passed at least 4 clinics to travel to Stud Park before I was a nurse, and still use them from time to time (usually Sunday arvo with my dogs :D yep even Vet Nurses dogs do stupid things after hours!! ) It is important to know who offers after hours surgery the closest to your home in case of dire emergency though.

Rowville might be a bit of a trek but Stud Park Vet is awesome. :D ETA: No I don't work there...lol.

Essentially, you can keep disciplining him, but it is self rewarding behaviour, and the reward he gets (licking the dishes) far outweighs any punishment you are going to give after he has started. He is an adolescent dog, yes probably going through puberty, but mostly he is way too young to have run of the house. If he were my dog he would be crated or tethered to a spot, or I would use baby gates to keep the dogs out of the kitchen. Manage his behaviour by not letting him practice the bad behaviour over and over. 10mth old dogs are notourious for not listening, so I would manage him until he is older, more mature, more relaxed, will listen to your directions. Also, practice your obedience in the house in every room, in the yard, everywhere! You may need to separate the dogs for training sessions so you can focus individually on each dog. Ensure that you are rewarding (with the good stuff not just pats) for good, calm, settled behaviours inside. Tired dogs are generally good dogs, so look at your exercise regimen too. I recommend all dogs live by the NILIF program- you can read about it here: NILIF Hope that helps a bit, Mel.

That person sounds confused, delta is not 'purely positive', and from what I can remember most of us regulars on the training forum agreed that we couldn't find such a thing through our internet research, I can also remember that somebody asked Melissa Alexander's email discussion group 'Clicker Solutions', and received replies from at least 5 of the regular posters on there agreeing that there is really no such thing. This person needs to go and relearn the definitions of +P, -P, +R, -R. Delta's slogan is 'first do no harm' so their emphasis lies heavily on promoting the dog-human bond, using pets as therapy and to promote wellbeing, and to create good citizens- both dog and human. They are big fans of Operant Conditioning, they do cover the theory of the 'behaviour matrix' as you call it, and the texts that are recommended are general dog learning textbooks, so the theoretical knowledge is available to anyone who cares to read the suggested texts. Mel. thanks Mel for the info, it certanly has cleared up my understanding of Delta a bit for me. when i mentioned what i was tought it was from people who have been through the Delta course, and are now training people to be instrutors at their obediance club, their for they can choose what they teach and not teach. they are delta acreddited. i gess i relade what they where doing directly to Delta as an organisation. you have just made me more interested in doing the delta course to thanks. No probs! I should add that I would find it concerning if more than a few graduates of the delta course were getting their definitions mixed up...if it were only a few then you might conclude that it was the learner, not necessarily the lecturer or content of the lecture, but when more than a few people are getting it wrong and are in different clubs/delta groups/States...then that is concerning. :D I have said before and still sustain, if you don't have a lot of dog handling experience (other than your own dogs) then NDTF is great because you need to do a number of hours working dogs at the Boarding & Training Kennels. I'm in a different position with my prior course and dog handling experience. They are both great courses, you just need to find the one that's right for you. Would actually be a lot easier for me to do the NDTF course proximity wise, but I chose Delta for my own personal reasons and training goals. Mel.

No, actually, it was a good example of a well known trainer getting it wrong. The prong collar was given to the Vet Behaviourist after the dog in question ended up at her Behavioural Counseling Clinic, after being fitted with one by the previous trainer who misdiagnosed the dogs issues! Where exactly did I suggest any evidence of violence exactly? Were you at this years intensive? You seem to be making alot of assumptions there. You don't seem to have any idea what training courses are actually for.... Also what are your qualifications? I see you pop up from time to time to have a rant, but when I look for an introduction on you I can't seem to find one?? Mel.

That person sounds confused, delta is not 'purely positive', and from what I can remember most of us regulars on the training forum agreed that we couldn't find such a thing through our internet research, I can also remember that somebody asked Melissa Alexander's email discussion group 'Clicker Solutions', and received replies from at least 5 of the regular posters on there agreeing that there is really no such thing. This person needs to go and relearn the definitions of +P, -P, +R, -R. Delta's slogan is 'first do no harm' so their emphasis lies heavily on promoting the dog-human bond, using pets as therapy and to promote wellbeing, and to create good citizens- both dog and human. They are big fans of Operant Conditioning, they do cover the theory of the 'behaviour matrix' as you call it, and the texts that are recommended are general dog learning textbooks, so the theoretical knowledge is available to anyone who cares to read the suggested texts. At the intensive we were shown a prong collar, and given the reasons why they are not a chosen piece of equipment, I certainly wasn't told straight out it was 'because they were cruel' I felt I was given an informed answer. A large part of the answer was that dogs who were displaying fear aggression or anxiety were often fitted with one when the 'trainer' didn't have the ability to read the dogs' body language. Regardless of my personal experience with them, it is a moot point because they are prohibited in Vic anyway. I think you and I would both agree, HR, that this is a worst possible scenario from a lack of information and instruction on a trainers behalf. Delta do not advocate starving, with holding meals or bribery with food. I feel that people are also misinformed or presumptuous about the conditions on using Operant Conditioning only when completing the Cert IV course. You need to demonstrate that you understand fully, and can apply Operant Conditioning techniques on dogs in training situations. You do need to use positive reinforcement during the course and show a preference for it when completing submissions, but regardless of your private views, you walk out with a Certificate IV in Dog Behavioural Training if you satisfy the requirements- just the same as the NDTF course I'd imagine. I think where people become confused is that you can complete the course, then walk away, or you can apply for Delta Society accreditation if you run a training organisation and you agree to foster Delta values and follow their code of ethics. Application is available to all Cert IV graduates on completion of the course if they satisfy the above- but it's not compulsory. ETA: The advice I would give to the OP is to gain a student prospectus for both courses, and make an informed decision from there. Cheers, Mel.

No probs I'm sure Mel774 will be able to help you and if she can't- she will refer you on to someone who can. Mel.

Try PM'ing Mel774 on the forum, she is currently completing the Cert IV in Behavioural Dog Training, and would have some great contacts re: Veterinary Behaviourists. I'm not sure where in Brisbane she is though. You GSD sounds like my Kelpie- very sensitive to touch and sounds as though she needs a positive desensitisation program as well as leadership, but I can tell you from experience that punishing the mouthing won't help her any. Cheers, Mel.

No sleeping on the beds until the behaviour is sorted...especially when your son is in the picture as well. He needs to go to training and it will benefit the both of you. All the previous posts have been good advice, get a few private lessons with a qualified trainer- not a franchise, then look into obedience classes and dog sports so you and he can do something together. Keep us posted with how you go.... Mel.

Yep get an adulticide for your dogs in the interim- Frontline or Advantage. Buy a few flea bombs - you should be able to order them from the Vet, make sure you read the back and buy enough for the size of your house, close the windows, set the bombs off and leave for the day. (Also turn off any indoor pilot lights or ingnition sources.) The bombs work a treat- they will kill every other bug and spider as well as all the fleas. Mel.

My current club is $55 per year plus the VCA Insurance Levy if you are not a VCA member. They don't charge any ground fees, but I think they should. Mel.

I've heard that there are three Tollers competing on the 2nd...just wondering who the third one is? Mel.

That wasn't my intention- sorry if it reads that way, just trying to educate.