Jed

Of course you did, but you didn't learn how to treat stress in farrowing pigs, how to pull twin calves from a too small heifer, how to operate on a horse with a pendulated lipoma, and after-surgery management, the best treatment for a ruptured diaphragm in a dog, what to do about a compound fracture of the tibia in a cat, including anaesthetic, operating technique, and post op care, what feather disease looks like in a budgie, and the best treatment for a fish with swim bladder problems ... not to mention the myriad of problems which can occur in sheep, goats, llamas and alpacas, rats, guinea pigs, mice, tortoises and snakes!! Being a vet is a big ask - and new graduates continue to learn from older more experienced colleagues when they begin working. Some vets' exprience is in one direction, some in another - I know a great horse vet, but I wouldn't let him within 100 metres of a dog with a sore!! And - sad but true, there are some terrible vets, as there are terrible doctors, terrible dentists etc. My vet is terrific - he gives great bottles of wine at Christmas (remember that, Rappie!! - most important) Nutrition was obviously not a high priority of the vet you visited. So, we have fixed that!!

Sorry, Rappie, no offence intended. And - vets care for the physical welfare of our animals, but cannot always be expected to be nutritionists as well!! Seeing as they are already expected to be physicians, psychologists, surgeons, pathologists, microbiologists, grief counsellors and organisers of cranes to remove horses from swimming pools on Christmas day. Vets who graduate from Lalaland's university do about 100 hours of ANIMAL nutrition, not CANINE nutrition. However, I do think a vet who recommends a diet of Pal probably needs a bit of a bash upside of the chops - unless he was recommending it specifically for constipation. I have only admiration for vets per se, but some ---- well, you do have to wonder .. present company expected!! Edited to say - Have you ever SEEN the size and scope of the excreta of a Maremma fed on Pal?? :D

DA - a lot of vets don't like BARF. Some see it as not balanced, and too difficult for the average pet owner to feed a balanced diet, and consequently f feel that at leas commercial food is balanced. It is possible to have an imbalance in home made diets, which is not good for the dog. However, if you check out the information on BARF, and remember to keep the diet varied, you should have no problem. pewithers With such an opinion, pew, I wonder why you continue to visit this site.

Hi, DA - I hope the constipation problem has abated - consider, as others have suggested, adding oil to her food a couple of times a week. Also - fruit and veges - put through the processor and added to the meat NO TOMATOES NO ONIONS NO GRAPES NO RAW POTATOES NO CABBAGE Mine get whatever is not expensive - pears, apples, bananas, stone fruits, broccoli, carrots, pumpkin (though I do soften the pumpkin in the microwave - more for the processor's motor than the dogs!!)etc. And also, consider giving her a small tin of sardines in oil - 1/2 a tin per meal - this not only helps with constipation, but provides a change, and fish oils. The secret to any diet is variety. Heart, kidney, liver - but not as a major proponent of the diet - are good too I would question (and probably argue) with a vet who suggested Pal. Canine nutrition is not a big subject in vet school. Some vets learn as they go along - mostly from other vets, or breeders (my own phoned me a couple of times to see what my puppies ate), but some don't, they simply follow the dog food company line. Pal does help with constipation, but so do the things listed above. The Pal rep will tell you that Advance, which they also make, is the quality food in the range - and that ought to tell you something about Pal!! Everyone has their own feeding regime, and, of couse, we all think ours is the best!! There are many good diets for dogs - including solely feedng one of the QUALITY dry foods - but Pal is not one of them!! I've never fed puppy milk, only cows milk, and I've never had a lactose intolerant dog, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, and I don't think too much milk is particularly good for an adult dog.

Years ago, I read an article by a leading poodle breeder in the US regarding the vaccination regime introuced in the 80's which included the parvo vaccine. She was having a lot of problems with the poodles, including stained teeth, fits and bloating. She had been line breeding for years without any problems. Bloat in the standards was a huge problem, with huge losses over the years. Both the ones she retained, and those she had sold. In consultation with Dr. Jean Dodds, a vaccination regime was instigated which involved single doses of live vaccine, instead of one dose of multiple vaccines. ie, the pup would be vaccinated against distemper, then a few days later, against parvo and so on (and I believe they were also having rabies shots). From memory, she didn't connect the bloat with the vaccines, but once the dogs were on single shots, there was no more bloat. I found this very interesting, and although I find it difficult to tie vaccines in with bloat, there was so little bloat about 20 - 30 years ago, that hardly anyone had ever heard of it. Since reading that article, I have been ultra careful with vaccines - just in case. I posted it to this forum a year or so ago, and I think it is worth reading. Not much use to anyone with an adult dog, but worth keeping in mind for the future.

If the vet has found no problems with your Maltese apart from the arthritis, he may be depressed because he is in pain. Sasha's Blend is a proprietary arthritis treatment, available from vets. I believe there is a simiilar product available from pet stores, which is cheaper, but I am not sure what it is called. Our old dog was taking Metacam for arthritis for 3 years, and this gave a great deal of relief ..... and there seemed to be no side effecs. Liquid, administered orally daily.

Hi, Maiko - I don't know about the Coat King - it works well, but was designed for use on unknotted coats. However, perhaps a coarse one (fewer teeth) would help, but it would thin the hair too, which may not be a good idea. A dematting tool may help - like a Coat king, but designed to cut through knots. Incidentally. Coat King has now released a new model - specially for pet owners, which retails for around $30. I think this is a great idea. Pleased you liked the quote porterpup! :D Have you tried Aloveen shampoo on him? It is supposed to be very good (never tried it), and lots here recommend it. give the Alpha Keri a go - it is only about $6 a bottle, and that makes up quite a few spray bottles, and it might just help.

porterpup2, is he shedding? You will probably do better to groom him with a slicker, or a pin brush, which will reach right to the skin. If you have him shaved, you might have a bigger problem. Try washing him in Fidos Everyday Shampoo, and condition him with a good quality conditioner for dogs. Buy some Alpha Keri oil from the chemist, mix up 1/4 Alpha Keri to 3/4 warm water in a 500 ml spray bottle, and spray him a couple of times a week. Shake the bottle before spraying. Plush Puppy also make a foam product in an aerosol can (sorry, not sure of the name) which comes out as foam. If you spray this on the knots, it helps loosen them - you can tease them out from the edges with a steel comb. Edited to say - It is not politically incorrect to own the dog you want. However, it is politically incorrect for others to bag you for doing so! :D

Onr would presume it would be done by someone competent, and if so, there is no question of another shot. This method is a little violent for some people - and I understand that - however, it is harder on the owner than the animal, who knows nothing. Deliverance at the hands of a friend. There was a lot of learned discussion some time ago about the best method of euthanasing horses, and on balance, it was decided that shooting was better. I have seen both - and maybe shooting is bettr, but like you, Anne, I like the option which is softer on ME, selfish thing that I am!! Interesting about burials or cremations. I believe the dog goes to RB, but I still cannot bear to leave the body at the vet for "disposal". I like to bring them home and have a burial - on the property, in winter, when it hadn't rained for a long time, cremations were easier, but at least I knew where they were, which is totally irrational, and I know that. I don't mind leaving them when I leave a property, because I figure by the time I go, there is nothing left anyhow. The previous owners of my current property pointed out where the graves were, and they wont be disturbed whilst I live here.

This seems an awful lot to charge for one injection of a cheap drug. Maybe they are charging for taking care of the body? I always do my own - burials, or cremations - and the last one was $40 to $45 depending on the weight, which I thought fair. Re the digging up - we had a ghastly scenario with the pet white rabbit, and a few naughty dogs, but if you put a sheet of tin, or something heavy on the grave, that stops any digging.

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That's excellent Jim - thank you for that. I feel this should concern all breeders, as there are no specifics. Chrisf - my vet also though hypoglycaemia - but Steve has disproved that one. Incidentally, my 3 cavvies are fine. The little one is still little (a petite little girl) and they are all little porkers. Their menopausal mum loves them dearly. I have never seen a bitch shed so much - it's like an indian massacre, with clumps everywhere - not just a few hairs. The odd thing is that her coat is still excellent. That wasn't a question, that's just her - there's hair everywhere - in the sink, the vac is full, on my clothes, wafting through the air - there's enough to stuff cushions. Never mind, she's happy, and hell, I spend enough time riding the broom, it's a change to use it on the floor! :D [ 30-11-2002, 03:21 AM: Message edited by: Jed ]

Thanks for looking, Ange, but torsion would have shown up at p.m.

Maybe we all have to believe in re-incarnation. these pups have not quite lived out their previous life on earth - obviously pts a day or two before they were due, by caring owners. So, they have come back for a few days to fulfill their khama! They go stiff when they hear the call from the rainbow bridge, because they are listening - and they depart soon after! (Sorry, but it's about as much use as everything else we have come up with.) Perhaps it is some sort of brain thing, or something to do with brain stimulation .... ????????????????????????????????????

Uh - no! I have used Oxytocin on 2 bitches (after vet. advice). Neither had stiff pups - the stiff pups were all from bitches with no intervention/chemical assistance nothing. Oxytocin or an oxtocin like substance is produced by the body though at whelping time. Incidentally, the 3 little survivors in the Cavvy litter are all well and thriving - as is their old mum - she's having a great time! She's missing her daily bones though, and keeps trying to sneak old ones inside!!

My cavvie stiffie was a little smaller than the others at birth, but, to my eyes, within normal parameters. On the day he died, I thought he had fallen a little behind, which I why I put him on the teat (I avoid hand feeding them as much as possible). However, the white boxer was in the middle range of size. I don't weigh my puppies until I worm them - they are either doing ok or not, and I find it a drag to be weighing them all and recording information, when I can see whether they are ok or not. I am also a bit of a worrier, and when I begin weighing them, I worry if one is down a little today. Some puppies grow quickly, and some slowly, but they seem to work out in the end. Sometimes the biggest pup born ends up as the biggest adult, sometimes not. And, in case you think I am slack, I didn't weigh my (human) babies regularly either. I could see they were growing, and as someone once told me, the best way to see if a kid has had enough is to check out their tummies! It works with pups too! I wondered about vac. Poppy was vac. as a pup, and in 1996, and 2000. C4. I don't vac. my dogs every year, I don't think they need it, and parvo is more a puppy disease than an adult disease, and being out and about should confer immunity anyhow. I think a questionaire is an excellent idea - if we had the info in some sort of order, perhaps we could make some sense of it. Yes, Steve, you are right - this is something which first occurred with my boxer litter from this bitch. I began breeding in about 1962, for a few years, stopped till 74, bred again until about 81, stopped until about 90, and have been doing it ever since. I am so pleased I brought this up - I don't know whether there is an answer/cure, but at least we dont all feel so isolated. I wondered if perhaps these stiff pups have some brain problem, and went stiff quite often, without us seeing it, and every time they went stiff, there was a little more damage to the brain (Wundahoo suggested seizures, and they are that, but why?) and so on until the pup died. I can see lots of holes in this argument, but I can see lots of holes in EVERY argument. Now, why did this bitch, in her latter years, produce 1 stiffy! I checked her records - she has had 4 litters, at 2, 3, 4, and 5, and it is over 2 years since she had her last litter. No stiffies. We lost 2 pups altogether from previous litters - both because she chewed the cord too enthusiastically. Her daughter has had 3 litters - no stiffies - but she has had 2 pups in 1 litter born without bladders, and 1 in another which obviously had a huge heart defect, and died of heart failure at 6 days. Vet says genetic. All her other pups have been ok, and none of them - even the ones which died, did the stiff thing - unless I missed it, but I tend to hover more over sick puppies. Incidentally, the daughter's son has sired litters - no stiffies - as far as anyone knows. I asked around, but no one had seen any. The other sister has only had 1 litter. No problems at all. The more we investigate this, the more confusing it becomes. We need a vet doing a PhD to research it for us!

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Got me fingers, toes and eyes crossed for the little'uns. What did they get jabbed with? They sound good so far - bet it all goes well. Cowanbree - hypoglycaemia - how about sharing with us what you know? [ 31-10-2002, 09:08 PM: Message edited by: Jed ]

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