Tonymc

Happy Birthday Rom!!!! Hope the Day is fantastic for you!!!!!! Tony

Dogdude,we cannot jump to conclusions or make assumptions here.Could well be a Lady living by herself wanting to feel more secure. Tony

Louie,way too far for this pup at this stage!!!I would ease right off and its better to go for a little walk and leave the rest of the exercise to self exercise.

Louie,whats your demeanor and attitude towards this pup when walking?Big big chance this pup is stressed and many Dogs when stressed will shut down,hence not relieving himself on the walk. Tony

Gayle,Erny is usually booked out for months in advance so it would be a great opportunity to take her up on her offer.Great chance to learn something.You admit above that your unfamiliar with how to teach a dog to walk without a Halti or so.

Money spent on education is always money well spent!!!! Tony

Gayle nobody here is being sanctimonius at all.your reading things into the thread that are not there.

This is a training section so consequently you will get Trainers and people interested in training frequenting this section.People will correct or steer people onto the right track if information is not right,misleading,not applicable or confusing.

Everybody here wants a newbie to have the best applicable knowledge for them,their dog and want they want to.No matter what somebody wants to do with their dog,a common foundation has to be laid down properly.Once that foundation is inplace then later on the dog can be directed to his intended area,such as Herding,agility,retrieving or whatever.

The foundation requires the person to have a sound knowledge of Dog psychology.

Why are Prong Collars different to Halti"s and so on?

Historically Mankind have over a long long time evolved systems for directing animals,inorder to work with them.for example the use of collars on dogs,rings in bulls noses,peg in a camels nose,head collars on Horses and so on.

Each system that was implemented did so after the Animal"s species specific anatomy was taken into account.Mankind wanted a way of control and direction that was humane but effective.For example it would be ineffective,potentially dangerous and stupid to direct and walk your Dog around by tying a lead to his front leg.The dogs movement would be serverely hindered and the chance of breaking a leg high.

Head collars were devised for Horses as it suited the Anatomy of the Horse and gave humane but effective control.The Headcollar on a Horse only applies pressure when the human handler takes slack out of the lead.

Halti"s and similar units on dogs do not just apply pressure when the handler does.Due to a Dogs anatomy the Halti is a continual source of irritation.

Whoever came up with Halti"s I am sure derived the idea from a Headcollar on a horse.Pity they could not recognise

that the Anatomy of a horse and dog are totally different.

sadly today many are further and further out of touch with the psychology of a Dog and due to lack of knowledge resort to things like Haltis as quick fixes.The truth is though they are not even quick fixes but just a mask of discomfort.

Haltis are like a Person who has a wound on their left arm.The Person has a painful wound on their left Arm and rather then treat the wound they go and cut their right arm.The cut on their right arm certainly takes their mind off the wound on the left arm.But has it really done anything?all it has done is create discomfort which takes their mind off the original wound.

Give a dog enough discomfort or pain and it sure will take his mind off pulling on the leash!!!!!he is so focused on the annoyance that he is not thinking about pulling.But did any real training take place?Nope!!!!Not one little bit!!!! Tony

Eza,yes attack training is the wrong terminology and has all sorts of incorrect connotations.I do understand what you mean though.If the Person you know is looking for somebody in S.A., send Mark S a pm.he is in Adelaide and a member of this site as well. Tony

I agree wholeheartedly with Sas.A Camera is an inert object devoid of instinct and emotion,not in any way comparable to training a Dog. Tony

thank you Jules and Lablover,I hope your both enjoying the time as well.

Erny,if you raced off and spent time with Santa, I guess you came back a changed Woman as I heard Santa runs "elf improvement classes!!!LOL Tony

Mystiq, good post. Tony

Gayle,on the context of a dog pulling on leash.If I had a dog pulling on leash and it took me months to change this,then there would be flaws with the way I am going about it and the Dog would not be getting a clear message. Tony

Dogdude,you said it very well. Tony

the best thing to stop pulling I have found to be leadership and consistent training. Tony

Thank you Wolfgirl for the kind words.May your Xmas be terrific and the new year bring health,wealth and happiness to you and your Family. Tony

No problem Mark. Squeak, does this dog show any sign of herding type behaviour? tony

Mark,thank you for the best wishes.All the best to you and Family for the season. Tony

ps. sent you a pm.

Quote from Mark.

Just a little point, usually turning your back is not being assertive toward your dog. When a dog asserts him/herself over another dog they don't turn their back on them, they move forwards, with assertive body language (claiming the space).

Exactly Mark. Tony

Jeff,thank you kindly my Friend for the best wishes!!!!I hope you and your Family have a great time over the festive season.

Erny,let us know how you get on with Santa!!!LOL Tony

Squeak,whats the relationship between the two Dogs like?Who do you see as top Dog? Tony

One assumption I have seen the purely positive crowd make is that all Animals whether it be a Horse or Dog are as quite as their own.Some of these people due to limited exposure or experience assume,all dogs are like their own.Big mistake and a fairly narrow view of the bigger world.

We had a situation with a Bloke at home that had adopted a purely positive approach with Horses.This Fellow had come out to look at a Horse.Whilst he was there another fellow dropped some Horses off to be broken in.These Horses had been ran in off a Station and were 9 year olds and had been caught once as two year olds.These horses came flying off the truck and they were looking to go somewhere fast!!!They ran into a smaller yard and of course were milling around.

I said to this Fellow that had come to look at the Horse,that the three just dropped off would be a bit toey and not to go near them.I went off to catch the Horse that this fellow wanted to see.I was leading this Horse back,when I heard yelling and a commotion!!!!

I get back there and there is this Fool in the Yard with these three horses and he is flat on his back in the Dirt.He had skin off and was shaken up.

Turns out he had heard the silly belief that the Indians broke their Horses in by blowing in their nostrils.This Bloke has slipped through the rails,got in with these Horses and tried to corner one to blow into its nostrils!!!This big Horse struck him,then knocked him down and ran over him.

Lucky no bones were broken but a lot of skin missing and a bit shock!!!!!I was talking to this Guy later and he had to do some thinking about how things really were!!!He had assumed that this silly idea worked on all Horses and that all Horses were the same as the few he had been around.

It was a hard lesson for this guy,but he learnt Horses are not all the same and one method does not accommadate all horses and where their coming from!!!!

I have seen People do exatly the same with Dogs and end up wearing it also!!!!!! Tony

Thank you kindly folks for the best wishes.

Well its nearly here and may it be a great time for you all and your Family"s. Tony

Rusky,your taking a little bit of Monty"s picture out to support your view and not the whole picture.I had the pleasure of meeting Monty.

Shy Boy was caught and ridden in a three day process and not released.He was taken back to the ranch and given twelve months work then let go.

I agree totally with Cosmolo here.Horse training is not purely positive as yes pressure is applied and then behaviour rewarded by release of that pressure.

Rusky seeing monty working with a young unbroken Horse is only a part of the picture.A young unbroken horse with relatively small amount of baggage is one thing but a big tough old buckjumping Ranch or station horse is a totally different kettle of fish and requires a totally different approach.

The purely positive crowd really need to take a lesson from the very animals they claim to train.These Animals would show that their own species specific behaviour is not purely positive. Tony

Great post Erny!!!! I have to laugh at some of the purely positive crowd.I see it this way.Who is best at training or getting the message through to a Dog?Another Dog!!!! Even Dogs living in packs in the wild do not run their pack on a purely positive approach!!!!!

Lablover,I have to strongly disagree with your idea that the inexperienced are better with the purely positive approach.I have seen those type of situations and it ended up with confused people,confused Dogs,no limits,no guidelines,no boundarys and no leadership.All in all a great recipe for a big wreck!!!! Tony

Mark,great to see you post!!!!!!

Mark,firstly as you said the fact that so called"Bugs" only attacked your replies to the rspca tells a big story and the real agenda the rscpa are running.

Mark,I agree totally with the reply to the Newspaper article.

I come from a rural background and Dogs, are always a part of that enviroment.I do have a bad habit at times of just assuming that everybody knows or has a basic knowledge of how Dogs function and operate.Due to dealings away from rural enviroments I have been really surprised how some are just so out of touch with dogs,yet have dogs.

I agree 1000%, its time for people to get back to treating dogs as dogs!!!!!!

The more out of touch with Dogs people get,the higher number of attacks or bites. Tony

Merry Xmas to all and a happy new year.

I wish to thank you all for the stimulation,discussion and sharing of views,opinions and perspectives.I really enjoy this section of the site.

Again,all the best to everybody for the festive season.May all your dreams,hopes,goals and desires all become reality for you in 2008. Thank you everybody. Tony

Tug of War is a great training tool. Tony