jackie_a1

And can I add before I get flamed saw some better footage of the dog DOES look like a GR cross cause when they were dragging him into the car had more of a lab body then a gr as I previously thought.

Odin the point I'm trying to make is if it was anything but a g.r there would not have been an investigation or an assessment for medical condition. They would have just blamed the breed. When have you heard of a pitbull attacking someone being assessed for a medical condition or a brain tumour etc? They never do. But because it's a golden retriever it gets the opportunity. Unfair. Biased and ridiculous.

Kiera the dog MAY not have been mistreated. There may have been a number of factors. Unsocialised, the noise of the argument, the physical violence (when the people were arguing) untrained, dog etc. There may have been a purple fairy that waved it's wand and casted an attack spell but the fact is REGARDLESS it is never acceptable for a dog to EVER attack a human. This just wasn't a random person jumping into the yard unescorted it attacked its owner. Its owner does not want the dog put down but would you want to own a dog that has previously attacked you? And lets be realistic I highly doubt the owners will fork out the money to have him assessed, trained etc. Best thing for that dog and that family is to have the dog put to sleep.

Am I the only one here that doesn't see the bias towards the family breed? Just heard the news reporter say they are investigating the reason for the attack and deciding whether the dog should be destroyed or not. Had that been a pitbull, stafford, rottie etc would they have investigated? Or would they have just deemed the dog dangerous and to be PTS? It injured four people? It attacked a human. Regardless HUMAN aggression should not be tolerated in ANY dog and it should be put to sleep. Obviously if there are underlying conditions or reasons it is debatable. But if it was just the dog thought the two men were fighting and attacked NOT acceptable. I could scream in my brother's face and punch him and visa versa and I can guarantee my dogs would not attack. Let me repeat. Human aggression is not to be tolerated doberman or golden retriever.

Watch the news footage. Dog was barking and pacing frantically obviously anxious and in relative fear. Doesn't matter. Dog attacked a human and injured four. Dog needs to be put to sleep end of story.

Saw it just then on channel seven news looks like a golden retriever to me no cross. The reporter said quote, 'The dog being removed from it's backyard looked more like a scared pet than an attacking dog.' Or similar to that line. Funny how they say it looks like a scared pet simply because it's a G.R and not a pitbull. I have seen many pitbulls being dragged from their yards (after attacks) looking just as scared and timid but they are always labelled as savage. But no news bias there. The dog had blood on it's face and fur so it did some significant damage regardless.

To the O.P, I feel you were completely justified kicking the dog. COMPLETELY. You're precious baby may have been in danger as well as your precious dog and I will never hesitate to hurt an attacking dog. Regardless if he was attacking or not here are the facts, - There was no owner present - The dog was unrestrained, unidentified and uncontrolled - Your baby and dog were in immediate danger because the dog was unrestrained, unidentified and uncontrolled. You do not need to feel any guilt or etc you did the right thing. Carry an umbrella or stick or something long and hard (you could probably keep an umbrella comfortably in the compartment of a pram rather than a stick ) with you for future walks cause although this offending dog retreated if you are dealing with an eighty kilo mastiff or even a twenty kilo pitt you need to realise kicking or 'poking' is not appropriate just based on your own safety. Next time any dog approaches you unrestrained and in any way that may threaten your child and your dog you swing that stick and you hit that dog like it's a mexican piniata feeding diabetic children lollies. YOUR safety YOUR child's safety comes first period.

Sorry I forgot to add a girl in my tafe class last year had an 'accidental' breeding between her female american stafford (assuming it was a cross from photos) with her six and a half year old maltese terrier. From what I remember she said a couple puppies died it left them with a litter of three. The puppies had curly fluffy type coats? With a sort of fawn and white marking? She said the mating happened because the person whom she originally got the am staff off, had told her the dog had been desexed prior. Obviously not.

JJ awwwww I can see some corgi in there me thinks. You know AWL does dna testing for dogs? If you got the spare cashola and you're curious it's worth a try.

Aidan address my question. WHAT is the actual debate? Then if I know what the debate is perhaps I can participate like an adult. For an example are we debating that C.M's methods are cruel? Are we debating that C.M's methods are ineffective? Or are members just debating amongst themselves about whether or not they agree to his methods? Or are we debating that his methods are effective? I cannot see one singular topic of debate but instead a whole series of such so I am confused. What is it exactly that we are debating?

Spikey is actually kinda cute but I heard you have to continually moisturize hairless breeds? Correct me if I'm wrong. A poodle kelpie!?

Who is not discussing it like an adult? I haven't insulted anyone personally or quoted anyone in particular but as a general rule many many people on this forum are quick to dismiss or criticise without accepting the good in the argument as well. It seems you either have to agree with Ceaser or not. You cannot just agree with some methods etc. What is the actual debate?? That C.M's methods don't work? Or that they do? It's not really clear what the argument is?

A PUGADOR WTF???!!

Yes they do Kavik hehe I'm not voiding anyone elses opinions I know there are some very good trainers on here. But I was just trying to get my point across he isn't where he is by simply guessing

Perrin +1 then maybe the general public will have a better understanding. If oodles is the only thing being marketed to them then you cannot blame them for simply heading towards an oodle however I think if more pure breds were recognised for their non shedding ability the majority would still go for cross breeds simply because going through a registered breeder requires alot more effort than buying from a window

Keira I met a similar dog at the Hyde park doggy thing last year (or the year before can't remember) it was a sharpei cross staffy he had a black mask with a fawn coat and american stafford erect type ears with a wrinkly face. He also looked tough but was only about fifteen kilos and was more the size of a stafford then sharpei sweet boy though, of course owner had him all (harnessed studded collar etc) up

Just a general enquiry as to the strangest cross breed you have actually met. As in not heard of on the internet or been told about but have witnessed with your every own eyes. I'll have to say I met a mini foxie cross koolie, who's name was Roarie. And he was gorgeous wall eye and merle markings but the size of a foxie? And probably the other strangest cross breed I've met was a sharpei cross border collie? His fur texture resembled a dog with mild mange, quite a strange dog long face but wide head. So anyway let me know the strangest cross breed dog you have met. And please if you have pictures feel free to post. Quick edit to add: What did the dog look like? Coat type? Size etc?

I think some breeds of dogs are more suitable to a dog park than others. Regardless of what others think I do not think bull breeds (or similar breeds) should visit dog parks. It's not about whether your dog is socialised or not it is about whether you are responsible enough to not place your dog or other dogs in that situation. Because animals are unpredictable creatures you CANNOT predict if a fight will occur and owning (genetic) fighting dogs it is YOUR responsibility to keep other dogs and pet owners safe. So basically don't put yourself or your dog in any situation that may leave room for error or injury. My dogs love the park and meet many dogs just on their daily walk and it is much easier to control one dog then it is six. It is your responsibility to know YOUR breed and advocate for them

At the video posted. Too many people on this forum think that they have all the answers, or that they know it all or you dismiss others training ability because it's not what YOU agree with or what YOU have been taught or learnt. Listen what people need to understand is that there a thousand and one methods of training your dog out there. Some may be bad some may be good but what they all have in common is that regardless of what method you use there are going to be people that don't agree with it. Just like some people do not agree with positive some people do not agree with negative. For me based on Ceaser's methods it does not render his training void, nor cruel there is a HUGE difference between a tap, or kick (as it's been called here)to beating your dog. What I see is C.M making physical contact to snap the dog out of the mind state that it is in. Like I said he has gotten results and there are many people out there who follow his methods (sensibly) and have gotten great results. I am one of them. Let me know when anyone here ever gets their own show and becomes a world renown trainer then I'll be sure to take your criticism into account

:p You all obviously do not know. If it has a red nose. It's a pitbull.

There is usually no etiquette at a dog park hence why I don't go to them. But seeing as you posted for advice most owners go there and let their dogs off and give them no supervision or discipline they use it as a let the dogs wear themselves out before they get home, so most owners aren't even paying attention to their dogs. If there are several sections i.e a small dog area and a big dog, put your dog with the small dogs if it's his first time. An aggressive maltese bite is less to a puppy then a staffords and that's the truth. Try to talk to the owners suss them out. You might be lucky and find some well informed educated responsible owners who may be regulars who you feel comfortable letting your dogs play with. Don't go peak hour it might over whelm your little one and in an unrestrained park situation may escalate. I like the idea of dog parks I just refuse to attend :p

Put your flame suits on :p LABRADOODLES. Designer breeds? They are all unchecked mutations and I hate the very idea of them. No they are not a purebreed. No they should NEVER be recognised as a pure breed. NO they will never be. And if they are I'll shave my head in protest. They're not bred to any standard they don't fit most standards they were supposed to be bred for and it seems morons tend to be attracted to such breeds. No not all labradoodle owners are morons. But the ones I've met are. And I've met over twenty labradoodles in the past six months (work at a doggy day care) their owners have no idea.

I agree with Night I think we all have been targeted and attacked on this forum on some thread. I've actually stopped posting a few times because certain members are rude and very opinionated so I think everyone needs to relax. Now in saying that everyone back off Chewy. I can see what she (or he sorry :p) is saying. I would have done similar to Chewy. IF there was another adult with me I would have told them to take my dogs and I would have proceeded to help the older man. My culture has taught me a high respect for elders, and human life. IF I had have been alone I would have just chained my dogs up at the nearest pole and ran over (I've had to do this before) and if that staffie went my dogs unfortunately it would be something I would deal with if it meant I could have saved two people. To me. REGARDLESS. Human life is OVER animal life. It's why they tell you in an emergency that DO NOT GO BACK INTO THE BUILDING TO SAVE ANIMALS. Because animal life regardless if you agree or not is not equal to human life. Now I'm not criticising the O.P's actions at all that was his or her (sorry again) choice to react and it may have been a different reaction to what others would do me as well but it does not mean it was wrong it just means he or she saw their dogs as first priority and that's ok but it's not how some others would have reacted I think is what Chewy is trying to say. I hate humans as a race (it's why I study, work and live with animals haha) but nothing for me is more important then preservation of a human.

Ok my two cents. Firstly Caeser Milan follower he is one of my idols. Taint him all you like you cannot mess with results. NOW in saying this. Do I think all dogs should be trained with CM's method? No. As an aspiring dog trainer myself I think depending on the dog depends on the method used. A whimpering eight hundred gram chi pup would not benefit from a Ceaser tap merely based on size. However having owner a highly dog aggressive dog prior, I will tell you a piece of chicken or ANY positive enforcement would not be beneficial. The problem is we need to assess a dog as an individual not as a whole species or genome. I think the assumption is CM'S method worked for a pitbull it must be a vast method that can be applied to all dogs. WRONG. What worked for one pitbull may vary from another. As a trainer, owner, animal lover what ever you classify yourself as you should assess the dog individually and not just assume because of it's breed or what you have seen on t.v etc, it can or should be applied to your dog. If C.Ms method worked for your dog (has wonderfully for mine) it doesn't necessarily mean it needs to be applied on your neighbours pit or chi or what ever the breed be. It just means that particular method of training worked for THAT PARTICULAR DOG. I use both C.M's training method and have started to familiarize myself with clicker training. I have trained Boss to die on cue with clicking, bridging etc. But I prefer to use click training as a secondary method to train party tricks etc but I also use C.M's method with Raze and Boss to enforce rules and discipline and stability. For MY own dogs its worked wonders but for your dog it might vary and all that means is it's your responsibility as a trainer, owner etc to find the training method that best suits YOUR dog (or which ever dog it is your training). I am a huge advocate for a variety of training methods. No one says you only have to use C.ms methods and that his is the only and right way. If a dog is thriving with positive then by all means treat it. But if you know your dog (like mine) will not respond to that method then by all means give him a love tap. I think C.M is a genius and I can only strive to have one eighth of his potential.

Hey guys thanks! Also Catherine I have done alot of research into Ceaser's methods I did an assignment on him I know some people don't support his methods but I think he is good and do. Razor on walks is great. He is walked with a check chain but does not pull. Always is allowed free run off leash and UNLESS there is a dog off leash his recall is great. With me and my family he is always obedient. I think you're right shadow that he is anxious. Though I wish I had a video of him to explain his behaviour when greeting dogs. I bring him to tafe social days all the time and he is relaxed let me explain. Razor with undesexed male dogs will raise his hackles etc. Razor with undesexed females (he has never been allowed free run with any entire female obviously). With the desexed dogs he meets. He raises his hackles high tail flag sniffs the dog then goes about his business. I do not feel the need to avert his gaze at at all. There is no aggression he meets every dog the same. However when it is a male (undesexed) he does show the POTENTIAL for aggression. He meets EVERY dog with the high tail flag, confidence and hackles. His hackles do not mean he is being aggressive necessarily it means he is excited or stimulated. I'll see if I have a picture of him meeting another dog as an example of his posture. Appreciate the constructive advice.