Growling Over Food And Son

[hazel]

We have a caviler x poodle puppy who is now 4 months old . She has recently started growling at my 6 year old son if he wakes her up when she is asleep and if he carries her around too much . He has been told not to do these things ... but ...... I have also told him that growing is her way of saying that she has had enough and that he should stop what he is doing immediatly or he might get bitten .

But she has now started growing at me if I touch her while she is eating . I initially tried her on various premium dried foods but she was not overly keen . I have now started to give her the BARF patties and raw bones which she loves and it is only since having the bones that the growling has started ( I try and move her to where I want her to eat the bones so that she does not drag them all over the deck ) .

I have been reading about the triangle of temptation . Do you think that this would solve the growling problem ?

[Poodle wrangler]

TOT can only improve the situation. It takes only 5 minutes extra time to do it, so why not?

Growling over food is not something I'd accept in my dogs. I should be able to take any food away from them at any time. My mini poodle is a dominant temperament, but would not dare growl at me. Your pup growls now because the bone is more valuable to her.

It really sounds like you need to improve your leadership. You need to take pup's mother's place and be a strong leader so she learns what's right and wrong. Growling over food is wrong! You have to teach her to be a nice dog to live with and a dog will listen to it's leader. Without a leader, she will take on this role herself causing her to be more stressed and she'll be the boss at your place. Might sound cute, but not if she starts to think it's OK to growl, then moves on to bite.

I like TOT because it takes nothing away from the dog while sending a strong message that you're the leader.

Don't let you son carry pup at all. I have kids and know it's hard to supervise 100%, but make it a strict rule with negative consequences if you catch him. e.g. You can only cuddle pup when you're sitting down. It's not good for pup and your son will probably get bitten eventually. OK for teaching child, but once a dog bites, they're much more likely to do it again which you DON'T want. Your son can do TOT once you've got the hang of it.

[Dogsfevr]

sadly child waking sleeping dogs up is one of the biggest reaasons they bite/react.

You need to either provide pup with a safe area to sleep or crate ,obviously also teaching son a tad more on why pup must sleep & not be woken suddenly.

If pup is in the house baby gates make great time out areas.You can select a room where pup can safely sleep without sone being able to annoy.

Carrying around i wouldnt let any 6 yr old carry our dogs,one drop & pup breaks.Most likley when he picks it up he is hurting the pup & add these 2 scenarios together & pup is reacting to a situation that its had enough off but is also slowly learning to not enjoy your son & dogs never forget early bad experiences but can be trained to reaccept

Feeding i agree you need to be patient & teach pup .If you have a crate feed her in there or buy a cheap wire puppy pen & feed in there.

The constant moving back to the spot can make a pup feel its losing something important & doesnt realize at present that all you want is for it to eat in one spot but growling still isnt acceptable & something you need to work with now before something unpleasant happens

[poodlefan]

Hazel:

We have a caviler x poodle puppy who is now 4 months old . She has recently started growling at my 6 year old son if he wakes her up when she is asleep and if he carries her around too much . He has been told not to do these things ... but ...... I have also told him that growing is her way of saying that she has had enough and that he should stop what he is doing immediatly or he might get bitten .

The first and the second issue are not necessarily related. My guess is the pup is growling at your son because she wants to be left alone when she's sleeping and because him carrying her is making her uncomfortable or causing her pain. Allowing either of those to happen is risking a bite.. the severity of which will grow as she does. You need to be more than firm.. you need to stop this now.

Step 1 - give your pup a time out area in either a crate or pen. Your son must learn that he does not touch the pup when she is in her area. No touching, period.

Step 2 - Puppy stays on the ground. He may sit to play with her when you supervise but he must not pick her up. Go to town on him but this is about keeping both him and her safe. Show him how to play games with her ... rolling a ball, tossing a toy.. again with you supervising.

If you cannot supervise, lock puppy in her own space. If you have an old play pen around that would be perfect. You son needs to learn that puppy is not a toy and needs to be treated a certain way. I know that you know this and it can be an uphill battle but restricting access to the pup when you can't supervise is the best way. You can also lock the pup outside if necessary. Your son needs to understand that he has a responsbility to act in a way that doesn't make puppy growl.. if he does he doesn't get to play with her.

But she has now started growing at me if I touch her while she is eating . I initially tried her on various premium dried foods but she was not overly keen . I have now started to give her the BARF patties and raw bones which she loves and it is only since having the bones that the growling has started ( I try and move her to where I want her to eat the bones so that she does not drag them all over the deck ) .

This is resource guarding and may not be directly related to the first issue. My personal view is that you won't "cure" this.. but you can manage it. Simplist solution is feed the pup in her own area.. crate or pen on the deck or whereever. She can't move the bones where you don't want them and most importantly, you son cannot accidently trigger a biting incident. Mucking about with her food while she's eating only increases her anxiety about it.

If you haven't thought about taking your pup to obedience training, I highly recommend you do so. Reinforcing your leadership role may not cure this behaviours but it will help in many other ways.

ETA: IMO you don't want to be disciplining the puppy for growling at your son. It's your son that needs to be disciplined for triggering it. Growling is a warning as you have explained to him. Discplining a dog for growling when it has been provoked to do so may extinguish the warning.. and you end up with a dog that bites without warning.

I'd expect that if you don't stop your son from provoking these warnings your pup's fear of him or dislike of him may escalate. Best to nip it in the bud with a safe area for puppy that she can be in when you can't supervise.

Edited September 12, 2007 by poodlefan

[hazel]

"you don't want to be disciplining the puppy for growling at your son. It's your son that needs to be disciplined for triggering it."

Yes .. I do agree Poodle fan ..... . Our pup does have a crate inside that she sleeps in . And whilst my son has been told time and time again not to disturb her and not to pick her up he continues to do so . I need to be much firmer with him and think I will have to start giving HIM time out for breaking the rules !!

I have every intention of enrolling in our local dog obedience school . Beginners enrollments are on the first Sunday of the month so October will see us there !

And I think I might go down to the local hardware store and buy some star pickets today and make a little fenced off area for my pup to eat in , although I do think that I should be able to take her food if I want to .... Maybe as my role as leader becomes firmer I will be able to do so .

Thank you all so much for your replies . I think that so much of what the pup learns as it is growing will shape the dog that it is to become , and I really would like to get it right !!!

[poodlefan]

Hazel:

Our pup does have a crate inside that she sleeps in . And whilst my son has been told time and time again not to disturb her and not to pick her up he continues to do so .

Is is possible to secure the door of the crate with a child proof lock (like a pantry/fridge one)? Another option is to buy a higher puppy pen or put the crate in a play pen??

It's great that you are doing all the right things.. good practice for when that adorable pup becomes a naughty adolescent!!! Your son will probably be trying to get away from the puppy soon enough.

[Poodle wrangler]

I had a problem with one of my children poking fingers through the crate wire, but you can buy canvas covers for crates e.g. on ebay, or tie a blanket on with occy straps if you prefer DIY .

You can get some cool wobbly, noisy balls etc. for your son to play games with puppy. My son loves "training" the dogs- making them sit for food etc.

[poodlefan]

Hazel:

And I think I might go down to the local hardware store and buy some star pickets today and make a little fenced off area for my pup to eat in , although I do think that I should be able to take her food if I want to .... Maybe as my role as leader becomes firmer I will be able to do so .

I agree that this is something you should be able to do.. and you can train it. Give puppy something fairly low on her value list and then show her you have something better.. swap it. Teach a "give" cue... don't snatch it. Reward her for giving it up and return it. She'll learn that surrendering valued items results in good things. I'd suggest you do this away from 'normal' meal time initially and then work up from there.

I've never met a dog who didn't respond well to the WIIFM ["what's in it for me] principle.

Edited September 13, 2007 by poodlefan

[hazel]

an update on Poppy

My son has had his first taste of time out for disobeying the " do not touch sleeping puppy " rule and has not been so keen to disobey since !

I have been feeding her in her fenced off area outside ( no more chicken stains on deck ...) and have found that by chopping up her chicken wings into smaller pieces she has stopped growing and does not mind me touching her when she is eating .

Thank you alll for your advice ... I seem to be on a winning formula ! ( until the next crisis that is ...... )

[Kadbury]

Sounding good, training a 6 year old is sooooo hard.....so the first part of the puzzle is working out...LOL you have received some great advice here and congrats. for taking it all into account......Just another little trick with your son......wait till he is asleep....(Not in the middle of the night).....pick him up....carry him around, put him on the couch walk away - and then ask him if he liked it ????? ;)

I actually think you are doing a great job seeking advice before things get a pattern going which will be harder to break.

Having your son take part in training is a good idea - he will feel really special and proud when the pup sits to his command.