Murray The Wonder Dog

[Erny]

Wow! Wyvernblade! With all that involvement, I'm sure to get to know your face (and you mine) very well!

We will all certainly be welcoming you aboard. Look forward to meeting you.

[haven]

Also, just a question, is ADT a privately owned business? If so, what is to stop the owner from selling it, and the new owner lowering the standards, and then everyone is left with dud memberships? I am not saying this is going to happen. I am just wondering if it could happen.

The fact that we sign a contract guaranteeing that your dog will reach your chosen level of obedience and that you will receive free lifetime maintenence training.

Since joing ADT I have been to a few other schools just for the added socialisation value for my dogs issues. The longest I lasted at any of them was 6 weeks, because quite frankly most of the instructors were substandard. Each hour I spent there was a complete and total waste of my time and yes, I may have only paid $50 for a yearly membership, but these days I value my time far more highly than I value the money!

If anyone can find a club/school that offers the services and standard that ADT do at a lower cost, then good luck to you!

I get what you are saying Alison, about paying up front in case you don't like it. You should be aware that A) The first lesson is free and there is no obligation to join, B) you don't have to pay up front, there are payment plans available and C) Anne is quite right about the cancellation pollicy, if you change your mind within a certain time frame you get a percentage of your money back (how much depends on how much training you have already done).

Sorry for the hijack of this thread Anne, I'm glad that you and Murray are loving your time with ADT. I don't know about the rest of you but I have had the plesure of meeting Mr Murray and he's quite the handsome beagle

[Alison]

I too am sorry for hi-jacking your thread Cheyenne. Thanks to all the ADT trainers, members and fanatics for answering all of my questions. No one can argue that you lot aren't a passionate bunch! Your club seems nice and your trainers well educated and knowledgeable, I am not denying that. It was only the upfront fee that was questionable to me. If I wasn't happy where I am at the moment, and it wasn't for the upfront fee, I would certainly take the time to look into your club a little more. I do however have one more question if I could hi-jack once more Cheyenne, sorry Does ADT offer pensioner rates for older dogs? My girl is now 7.5 years old, and obviously her lifetime membership at ADT could be shorter than others who join with pups. Probably a silly question as all dogs natural life span would differ. Thanks again for all your responses. I appologise if you have found my questions intrusive.

Edited for spelling

Edited December 5, 2005 by Alison

[Erny]

I do however have one more question if I could hi-jack once more Cheyenne, sorry 

I don't think Cheyenne minds.

Alison:  Does ADT offer pensioner rates for older dogs?  My girl is now 7.5 years old, and obviously her lifetime membership at ADT could be shorter than others who join with pups. 

I can't answer that, Alison. It's not the "norm" .... consider this: An older dog can be more difficult and take more effort (from trainers and owners alike) to achieve the level status of the course you chose. So, whilst the dog would have a shorter life span, it might take more dedication and time from the trainers to sort through any training/behaviour difficulties. When we get the dogs as pups, we can sort out difficulties BEFORE they become ingrained .... and often before they even start, and the training is smoother sailing.

This would be something that would be discussed at "assessment" stage.

Alison:  Probably a silly question ...

The only silly question is the one that is not asked .....

Alison:  If I wasn't happy where I am at the moment, and it wasn't for the upfront fee, I would certainly take the time to look into your club a little more. 

I'm glad you're happy at your club . Feel free to book into an ADT "First Timer's Session" at any time, regardless, though (obligation and cost free ... save for your time), if you feel inclined. We'd still enjoy meeting you.

Alison:  Thanks to all the ADT trainers, members and fanatics for answering all of my questions. 

You're welcome.

Alison:  No one can argue that you lot aren't a passionate bunch! 

You should see us when we have our meetings!

Alison:  I appologise if you have found my questions intrusive.

No apology necessary .... never felt "intruded" upon. We thank you for your interest and feedback.

Edited December 5, 2005 by Erny

[haven]

Thanks to all the ADT trainers, members and fanatics for answering all of my questions.

I'm all three rolled into one

If you'd like a closer look Alison, come and take one. Like I said it is free and if nothing else would be a good excuse for us all to meet

[Cheyenne_Fury]

Certainly don't mind the Hijack at all. Didn't even really consider it a hijack. I am talking about one of my favourite subjects at the moment and Erny will be able to vouch for how I go on and on about it as will Lablover1 I am sure that I bore them both to tears, but I am just so pleased that I have found ADT to be so great and for me it is worth every cent I will pay for my membership.

Alison, I can understand the hesitation with the upfront fee but for me it wasn't really an issue because I just knew that ADT was the place for Murray and I to get the help and support that we both need.

Haven - Really enjoyed meeting you and only recently put two and two together and realised that ADT customer feedback on the website about Loki the GSD was actually your dog. Derr I am a bit slow and my hair is blonde! What a great story and just one of the many success stories that have come out of ADT. Thanks for saying that Murray is handsome I certainly think so but my family keep telling me he is ugly and that only a mother could love him, well this mother certainly does! Can't wait to introduce Jake the dally to ADT in the New Year.

wyvernblade - I am glad that you decided to join ADT Berwick. Look forward to meeting you in the new year. I am also attending one of K9's workshops, though I have opted to fo to the handlers workshop in Feb and will be going to NSW for the weekend. It is a workshop where you learn to properly handle and assess dogs etc. and they provide dogs for you to use so you don't need to take your dog/s with you. Poor old Murray and Jake wont like staying home. They will have to go and visit my mum for the weekend or might even try out Wellington Park and give them a bit of a holiday too

Anne

Edited December 6, 2005 by Cheyenne_Fury

[Erny]

Thanks for saying that Murray is handsome I certainly think so but my family keep telling me he is ugly and that only a mother could love him, well this mother certainly does!

I've seen his picture here on DOL! No way is he ugly! He is as Haven says "handsome" .... the description fits him beautifully.

Anne - you going to the ADT fun day on 18th Dec at Scoresby? Waiting for the roster to come down ... hoping I might get to be there. If I do, I'll be looking out for you.

And if Murray comes for a holiday at Wellington Park ... let me know when - I'll specially look out for him.

PS .... I THINK I might be at Berwick this Saturday - but I'll be working with NDTF students, not training ADT. If I'm there, I'll try to look out for you there too.

[Cheyenne_Fury]

Thanks for saying that Murray is handsome I certainly think so but my family keep telling me he is ugly and that only a mother could love him, well this mother certainly does! 

I've seen his picture here on DOL! No way is he ugly! He is as Haven says "handsome" .... the description fits him beautifully.

Anne - you going to the ADT fun day on 18th Dec at Scoresby? Waiting for the roster to come down ... hoping I might get to be there. If I do, I'll be looking out for you.

And if Murray comes for a holiday at Wellington Park ... let me know when - I'll specially look out for him.

PS .... I THINK I might be at Berwick this Saturday - but I'll be working with NDTF students, not training ADT. If I'm there, I'll try to look out for you there too.

Hi Erny :thumbsup:

Yep we will be at training on Saturday. We have training from 10am onwards and socialisation after that. I have been getting there around 9.30am so will no doubt be around

Yep will be heading to the fun day on the 18th so may see you there. :D

Yeah was thinking of having Murray and Jake to Wellington Park when I go to K9's workshop.It is either that or for them to stay with my mum, but might be nice for them to have a little 5 star luxury and don't know if mum will be able to have them. I will ring in the morning and see if the weekend of the 18th of Feb has any vacancies for my boys...

Look forward to meeting eventually and can't wait to meet your gorgeous girl either! Murray and I are almost ready to have some lovely social walking. He has improved so much and with another week or so I think he will be almost perfect :D (in my eyes anyway)

Anne

[wyvernblade]

I'm looking forward to meeting you all too! I'm hoping to join with a new pup early next year but will probably talk my hubby into bringing his GSD before then. We're waiting to speak to a private trainer first as he has some fear aggression issues (He's only 6 months old but pertrified of everything! Big sook!) so you'll know me when I come, I'll have the great GSD puppy that's crying about everything!

[Cheyenne_Fury]

I'm looking forward to meeting you all too! I'm hoping to join with a new pup early next year but will probably talk my hubby into bringing his GSD before then. We're waiting to speak to a private trainer first as he has some fear aggression issues (He's only 6 months old but pertrified of everything! Big sook!) so you'll know me when I come, I'll have the great GSD puppy that's crying about everything!

wyvernblade - ADT to deal with fear aggression to and are great with people who's dogs need space and a bit of extra help The behavourists are worth their weight in gold!

Look forward to meeting you and your pups

Anne

[haven]

I've seen his picture here on DOL! No way is he ugly! He is as Haven says "handsome" .... the description fits him beautifully.

Yes, he struck me as quite the 'debonair' gentleman

Yep Loki's story on the website is about my dog. He is a GSD, my other dog Nova is the Rotti. The story as it is written on the website is pretty remarkable I think, but it hasnt been updated for well over a year. Since that was written Loki has passed Advanced obedience and spent 6months in Team Extreme where he learned a whole bunch of cool tricks! Since then I have changed his diet and tried a few different things for his axiety, DAP, vitamin and mineral supplementation and Bach flower remedies among them and his behaviour was greatly improved. Unfortunatley he is having a bit of a regression at the moment since Nova has surgery to repair her ruptured cruciate ligament. Because she is crated a great deal of the time he has noone to play with and he won't go anywhere without her so he spends all day on my bed feeling miserable

[Cheyenne_Fury]

I've seen his picture here on DOL!  No way is he ugly!  He is as Haven says "handsome" .... the description fits him beautifully.

Yes, he struck me as quite the 'debonair' gentleman ;)

Yep Loki's story on the website is about my dog. He is a GSD, my other dog Nova is the Rotti. The story as it is written on the website is pretty remarkable I think, but it hasnt been updated for well over a year. Since that was written Loki has passed Advanced obedience and spent 6months in Team Extreme where he learned a whole bunch of cool tricks! Since then I have changed his diet and tried a few different things for his axiety, DAP, vitamin and mineral supplementation and Bach flower remedies among them and his behaviour was greatly improved. Unfortunatley he is having a bit of a regression at the moment since Nova has surgery to repair her ruptured cruciate ligament. Because she is crated a great deal of the time he has noone to play with and he won't go anywhere without her so he spends all day on my bed feeling miserable

Whoops sorry Haven, got confused, of course Loki is you GSD and Nova is your Rotti Derr I really am a blonde!

Poor Loki sounds like he is missing his play time with Nova. I am sure that once she is up and about again he will be back to his normal self.

Anne

[Cheyenne_Fury]

I've seen his picture here on DOL!  No way is he ugly!  He is as Haven says "handsome" .... the description fits him beautifully.

Yes, he struck me as quite the 'debonair' gentleman

Yep Loki's story on the website is about my dog. He is a GSD, my other dog Nova is the Rotti. The story as it is written on the website is pretty remarkable I think, but it hasnt been updated for well over a year. Since that was written Loki has passed Advanced obedience and spent 6months in Team Extreme where he learned a whole bunch of cool tricks! Since then I have changed his diet and tried a few different things for his axiety, DAP, vitamin and mineral supplementation and Bach flower remedies among them and his behaviour was greatly improved. Unfortunatley he is having a bit of a regression at the moment since Nova has surgery to repair her ruptured cruciate ligament. Because she is crated a great deal of the time he has noone to play with and he won't go anywhere without her so he spends all day on my bed feeling miserable

Whoops sorry got confused...

I am sure that Loki will return to hus usual self when Nova is up and about again

Anne

[Steve K9Pro]

K9: just seen the thread & thought I would throw my 2 cents in.

People that feel that $610 is a lot of money to train their dog are the lucky people that havent had a dog ruined by the wrong trainer/instructor, & I hope they are lucky enough to remain that way.

As the dog training industry is largely un regulated, anyone with the hide to call themselves a trainer can start up & charge whatever they like.

As ADT only have trainers that have (imo) supierior qualifications, I think $600 is a deal!

Sure $1.50 is cheap, but not if your doing more harm than good.

I would rather spend $600 wisely than waste $1.50.

None of this is saying that other clubs are always bad nor a waste of time & money, however much of my work comes from fixing mistakes others have made.

The Behaviour consult package I do will get 90+ % of people with real problem dogs well on their way to 1. understanding the dog, 2. managing the fault & 3 curing the fault.

What I call a real problem dog is what most people will call a dog thats uncureable.

For that I charge $195.00, 2 visits, span approx 3 hours, just me, client & dog (family members are allowed / encouraged also).

When I take someone on, I make it my goal to solve the problem, my commitment doesnt stop until we get results.

The 5 lesson pack gets you about 10 hours with me, in which we will get your dog as far as genetically possible in that amount of time.

I would hate to add up what I have spent on education, but its well over $100 000 in the past 20 with trips to USA & Europe.

Good trainers keep attending seminars, & learning all the time, this costs money, & to make the world go round, they need to get at least some of it back.

Last time I was in Vic, there were quite a few ADT & NDTF people there, gaining more knowledge to help them do a better job for their clients, I also did a private seminar for Four Paws K9 Training in which they had their trainers attend & some council officers. There were some there that had attended the other workshop too, thought they would have been sick of me by then lol..

This commitment is what makes these type of people surge ahead of the others.

I would rather pay for results, not time.

[Alison]

Again, I never said that $610 over the dogs lifetime was too much for a good experienced trainer, what I said was that I would not be confortable paying an upfront cost for training, and would prefer to pay the $610 on a weekly basis so as the trainer had to prove their worth every week in order to get me to return.

[Erny]

As has been mentioned, Alison ... ADT have cancellation policies where, if you're not happy, a portion of your moneys are refunded, depending on how far down the track you elect to cancel. ADT aren't about clinching a deal and keeping you there if you're not happy. (That's not good for you, your dog nor ADT.) I guess that's because ADT are confident in the quality of their Trainers and the quality of their instruction and advice - something that has been proven time and time again over the last 20 years. I don't think ADT overtly seek to prove themselves to anyone .... it becomes self evident. They offer and show as much about themselves as they can in the non-obligatory "First Timer's Session" ... then it's up to you whether you like/feel comfortable with what you see and hear around you.

It's also already been mentioned that you don't have to pay the fee upfront if you prefer to opt for their payment plan.

Edited December 13, 2005 by Erny

[nickyp]

Just to add my 2c worth. We joined ADT about 3 years ago. We'd tried the local obedience club and weren't happy with their methods (if the dog won't listen, just correct harder & harder until it does), or the variation in the quality of the trainers and we didn't know of any professional trainers in our area. ADT was recommended by my chiropractor. I don't remember what we paid for our 2 dogs at the time, but it did feel like a lot of money.

For me, one of the good things about having paid up front was that it gave me an impetus to keep going when I got a bit frustrated, or the weather was bad, or I was tired, etc. When it came down to it I just said "I've paid my money and I need to make use of this" and got myself moving. If I had been unhappy with the quality of the training I'd definitely have said something and expected either an improvement or a refund. Having paid the full amount, I had an investment in it that I wanted to see results for. If I'd been paying week by week and been unhappy I would have just stopped going.

We did stop going and haven't been back to ADT in a couple of years. The dogs have taken a bit of a back seat because of my son's arrival and I'm just starting to redress the balance a bit. One of the good things about having paid for 'lifetime training' is that, when I go back in the new year as I plan to, I don't have to find more money to pay for training, which makes it easier to return. If I went back to the local obedience club I'd have to come up with another membership fee and start all over again.

I suppose, at the end of the day, it's horses for courses.

[Erny]

...... when I go back in the new year as I plan to, I don't have to find more money to pay for training, which makes it easier to return. If I went back to the local obedience club I'd have to come up with another membership fee and start all over again.

Look forward to seeing you back there, Nickyp!

[haven]

Just to point out also, to anyone not familiar with ADT, $610 is not the standard price for everyone, it is what you pay if you want the highest level of obedience we offer, plus the socialisation and confidence course and membership costs.

The actual cost to join ADT is $50 lifetime membership. You then pay for a standard of training, for example if you just want pupy training you can go to puppy classes until your dog is 18 weeks of age for $90.00. If you were to join with an 8 weeks old pup, with access to 7 (soon to be 8) clubs in Victoria, that $90 could get you as many as 50 (yep 5-0) puppy classes. From there you can go through basic ($190), control ($240) or advanced ($370). The cost of the socialisation and confidence course, where we cover everything and anything posible and include agility, food refusal, command refusal and dog to dog work is $190.

So you don't have to join and pay $610 unless you want to do advanced level obedience and the socialisation and confidence course.

We train your dog to your requirements

[Cheyenne_Fury]

Good on you Haven for pointing that out!

ADT might not be for everyone, but it is working well so far for Murray and I. On a side note not really training wise I am having some problems with my boys escaping from my yard (I think Murray is the insticator and Jake is doing the digging) would one of the behaivourists be able to help with this problem?

Anne