wheres my rock

unfortunately clubs are clubs and theres always politics i would find somewhere where you can go teach the stuff then just use the club to consolidate it much easier that having to argue to get what you need

you'll get that whereevr you go unfortunately and the instructor probabaly was just concerned for the dog even if it was misguided as for other clubs action dogs is wednesday night in doveton or you could book a few privte lessons just to get her goine on all the equipment it might be worth it and then you can go whan it suits you better lea cogley and aldyth both have agility and so does robyn docker

a lot of triallers go with the teach a level at a time but then a lot dont we teach stuff from all over then polish each level as we go much more fun i mean wat fun stuf do you get to teach in novice well at least now we have a retrieve lol but before i perfer to mix it up

what was the exercise and wht did you want to do It would depend if you wantd to force a dog through a piece of equipment then i would see why they wouldnt want that at club it may be against their policy I havent had this fr a long time but the only time i have is when ive wanted to use food and the instructor doesnt agree and i just ignore them and use the food anyway and then went and foudn a club that would allow be to trian how i feel comfortable so really t would depend on why they said no

i think most epopel at club just seem to follow blindly what they are told by the instructor im acualy surprised how often they sem shocked when i say you dont hvae to do that that way I do my own thing i'll go in a class for a bit of distraction or to have somene else call left right but i still decide wehn i will reward when will stop and what i will and wont do. How often do you see a dog doing great work with little reward then when the instructor says exercise finised thaty all sart praising like crazy yet the work at that time was crap

i havent relly delved into herding but cant see how it would stuff him up look at judys sheltie thast an oc and has i think three or four herding titles now

its not so much that you need to concentrate on one thing to get it perfect but you need to make sure everything you teach you teach to the best you can so you can pursue two sports but you dont then take a half arsed attidue to both You'll most likely find the same person wouldnt do any better even if they foccused on one because it isnt the amount of area you trian in its how well you train each area

my first dog came to me dog aggressive very naughty and he would ignore everyone he was strung up by an instructor and that was the day i turned to positive trinaing withing six months fromt he day he came home he was trialling in novice a year later he had cdx ad and was inud My second dog came to me as a night mare seven trianers had tried and given up she had been quoted as untrainable very domninat aggressive and maybe even deaf lol this was assesed by a professional within a year she was competing in ud and she was hard she also got her beginner retrieving certificate great dog once you understod her. My whippet was independent and not into food or fetching he could run so fast if he took of he'd be gone in a second yet again with positive trianing he was ready for open unfrtunately he died before we got to trial him most of our dgs have been second hand so i can vouch that used correctly it can work and you can develop an eager working dog I find it interesting that epople will quickly say you need to find the method to suit the dog actually you need to fine tune the method to suit the dog but if you truly undrstand the method you are using and listen to the dog and get inside his head any method can work for any dog just as well Its the handler that has to trust in their tools Have a look at the very soft sensitive dogs that are trialling that have very heavy handd handlers i often wonder how they can get such good results using hard correction on a soft dog ts because they know their method they know when to push and when to back off.

and what about the perthses that sally is involved with they have chived countless titles using pp havent they Wasnt one of the top dog cmpetitors a pp trianer i dont know her but i was told she is gsd lady

and theres sara with the aussie her poodle cross did very well didnt it and a guy from croydon and kintala his golden got novice and open he strted a lot later i dont know if hes trialling in ud but ive seen he dog work so if he isnt its purely age hats stopped him Also the girl that won novice at the royal wit the powderpuff and a score of 190 something

back on topic I can think of at least a dozen trianers that use postive reward based training and have achieved hight levels of competition obedience and i havent really been involved in the obedience word for a while so im sure there area lot more

im talking about 15 years ago when pretty much everyone just used jerk and pull these days i dont see it as much I dont care wht method someone uses so lon as they dont tell me im wrong for choosing what i choose and i hate the whoe the collar speaks of cruelty epople choose a collar they feel comfortable using ive heard that if you have a chain your cruel comment its stupid as for clickers i havent had tht one but then noone else uss one at our club so i guess it wouldnt matter but i use a verbal marker anyway at club as i usually have my hands full. Te only time ive said soemthing is when a dog is being dragged by the ears or severely corrected or strung up for something stupid like dropping on a sit stay then i will state my feelings as not only do i think its cruel i dont think ts appropriate to do that sort of thing in a club environment where we have a duty of care to the animals and people who go there

lol sad isnt it that we have to justify every little thing I used to feel so un comfortable at trianing and trials because i was always being bailed up about how i trained people at our club used to love it if my dogs made amistake and would jump on me like gee give a girl a break its why i quit for a time Now i dont care i just do what i do have a heap load of fun and ignore the criticisers i figure their just jealous rofl Does crack me up though when at club someones dog nicks of and comes to me owers growling dogs playing keepings of i call it it comes and then they say yeah but youve got food toy whatever i used to get its attention and i just smile and say wel whos the smart one then hehe Because we do a lot of food throwing running away and play in trining we oftn haveother peoples dgs visit us to join in i even got asked to train soemwhere else because i was too bigger distractio i pointed out that i was training a long way from the classes the classes were certificate top class and that if their dogs were that easily distracted at that level then they should probably go back a few classes and work on focus Im a b$^$#h but hey im really careful not to do things that would distract most dogs and i'd never train that way in a class so to them just kidding

i think you would qualify leo in my books anyway im pretty fair to growling if the dog jumped on the bench its what you would do then to stop it happening again that goes under trianing most peoples first reaction will be to yell that however is not trining thats reating to a situation if a child goes to run across a road your first instinct would be to yell stop but then what you teh the child road safety same with your dog if you had a bolter a dog that bots out the front into the road you may yell to stop the initial bolt but the you would go away and teach a stop teach door mnners be more aware and gain better control so it doesnt hapen again. but you wouldt decide that to teach that sudden stop command or the door manners that you should use force because its a danger you would still teah what you want positively and save the punishement for yourself for allowing the dog to bolt lol

yes ness i know you your a great ambassador for the methods lol there are quite a few nowdays gosh wehn we started we were the weird epopel that didnt have a clue because we wouldnt string a dog up lol

they put a heap of articls on the ground and then you hold one to add your sent the others dont have your scent then the dog has to find the one wit your scent I udx they use clothes and the scent to find is the judges he scents a cloth and give it to you to show the dog and the dog has to find his scent does that help

i agree ness if you find you are using an nrm then you need to look at why but i dont have a problem with it its a good comunication tool its not nasty and can come in handy with fast thinkers sometimes I would prefer to break t down and look at why i was getting the wrong response coz i know it will be somenthing the handler is doing

I love the way as soon s we start talkign about not correcting everyone tries to pick it to pieces oh but this could be +punishment this doesnt fit any experienced trainer which most of you are know exactly what we mean when we talk about pure positive trianing we dont jerk our dogs drag our dogs force our dogs yell at our dogs in other words we dont reprimand incrrect we set up for success reward correct behaviour and have a whole lot of fun in the process well thast my definition of a pp trianer I cant think how else to explain it but youve read the books seen epople trinaing i think you know what we mean throwing around tonnes of terminology isnt doing anything but trying to look smart so how many people have gained titles with the above philosophy

i used to do agility obedience and retrieving at once never had a confused dog each complimants the other in many ways if trined right and well Now i just do obedience and agility am teaching both at once dont have probs with cnfusion its all just trianng why do i do both at once because i like teaching both so why not at the moment we are working on heeling stay positions tunnel and seesaw much of the foundations for both focus targetting working at a distnce moving ahead of me are neded for both anyway

yup its always hard with the titls thing but its all we have of course the cgc could be considered a title too

i hate labbelling epople im not classed as a purist clicker trainer by many because i mainly use a verbal marker among other thigs and then the traddies just think im weird so i try not to put poeple in pocketcs but yes you can train a dog to highl levels without force

i know but a lot of people i know use it and im willing to still call them pp because its the only thing they do use that doesnt really fit

it can do ive seen dogs do the tug test im not keen on mats my gsp used to lunge herself intot he middle and send everythign flying little enthusiatic lol

andrews dogs do tracking so wuld be used to his scent some dogs do just get it from the start others takea while Ll tie downs are still used a lot i use the one at a time method usually start with one get them egtting it everywhere even under the chair then i place a second of a different material and toss the scented but well away from the unscented and slowly move closer until im placing it anywhere and they are egttign the scented everytime then dd another etc however with my sheltie i used the tie down being a stresshead he just found it much easier that way hes not a great retriever anyway so i wanted it to be very clear which one i wanted so it depends on the dog afriend of mine uses squeeze chees on the correct article until they get the idea it really depends on you your dog and what works best for them

obedience isnt a drag unless you make it one and not just working dogs enjoy it actually conor is my first working dog breed Isnt it amazing how we keep coming back to teh same old argumanet with the same old epople on purely positive no physical correction and the only verbal on is a NRM no yelling no etc cant think what else but i think that gives you an idea with out getting nit picky and trying to find an argument