Puppoochi

I have owned Bull terriers in the past and I currently have a Amstaff X Ridgeback but I am not in any way offended by Poodiful's comments. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and anyway I think that when Poodiful made reference to bull breed owners being dickheads they weren't talking about every single person that owns a bull breed but the irresponsible ones that want them for the wrong reasons and the byb that are supplying them to these idiots.

Many years ago I was enquiring about a Bull Terrier from what everyone here would call a ethical, registered breeder and was horrified to hear her say (after me reassuring them that I was responsible and didn't want the dog for the wrong reasons) that if I was paying them $X amount then I could do whatever I wanted with the dog and she didn't care!

It's these people that are the d*!#heads for selling their dogs to anyone that has the cash to pay for them (it's not just the pet shops and byb that do it).

efs

Back in the '80s I lived with my boyfriend Scott that had a white bull terrier (Max). Max was kept in a small courtyard and Scott only let him in once a day, in the evening. He was so excited when he came in he used to jump up and snap and Scott would punch him in the head to try to make him stop. I would tell him not to do it but to no avail. Max was manic for quite some time, and it took a long time till he settled.

Scott went to see his folks in Qld for a week, so what did I do, I let Max stay inside the for the whole time Scott was away and guess what, the dog wasn't manic at all. I liked Max a lot and I thought that Scott was cruel to leave the dog in the courtyard by it's self 22 hours a day. When Scott returned, Max was put back in the yard and his manic behavior returned. It turned out that Max was actually deaf, hence why he didn't listen. I ended up leaving Scott due to his violent tendencies.

Does this sound like someone that hates bulls? NO. It's the thugs that own them and don't know how to treat them that get up my nose. And the breeders that sell the thugs the dogs that need to be accountable. And yes, I'm sick of hearing, it the deed not the breed whenever there's a dog attack.

you know what, if you dont want to be "personally attacked" as you so put it, why the hell put your post up knowing there are so many bull breed fans and anti-bsl people on this site? boggles the mind!!... I feel you have personally attacked me as I have 4 bull breed dogs (you yourself said bull breed owners are dickheads, that must mean you think I am a dickhead) and my dogs have never, EVER bitten anyone, I have a 3yr old who cut the tips of one of my bull breed dogs ears off, did she bite? no, whimpered and ran away (I accept full responsibility for this occuring, my son should NOT have been allowed access to the dogs without my supervision).... I note you did not address any of my responses to your ill informed posts... figures! crawl back under your rock love, no one is interested in hearing your inexperienced opinions (again where is your proof of your vast experience with a variety of breeds?).... im not wasting any more of my time with you poodiful, ive got better things to do.....

If all Italians drive Fiats, I drive a Fiat, does that make me Italian?

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

it is you that's got your head in a dark warm place not me???

but that's what bully owners are generally like .

Only people in denial twist what others say to justify in their own minds that what they are doing is right.

Personal attacks and insults are so low brow

Yeah, so true.

You obviously don't know the definition of what a personal attack is

The problem as I see it unfortunately, 95% of the time a dog attack features in the media, it's a Bull something, you can bet your bottom dollar on it almost as soon as you read or hear the headlines the dog involved will be of Bull breed origin. There has been some occasional reports of unrelated bull breed attacks, but not many here in Australia in comparison.

So, how can the Bull breed statistics be reduced???, Personally I think there are too many Bull crossbreeds peddled around of unkown quality and I doubt many featuring in attacks are papered pedigrees or genuine Pit Bulls either. Of course responsible ownership will eliminate all attacks for the most part, but dogs with aggressive dispositions in the hands of the irresponsible is a nasty cocktail.

Not all the dogs who attack are great dogs made vicious by irrresponsible owners, some are just crap dogs of poor temperament bred by morons with a predisposition for aggression that irresponsible owner have attained. I think we really need to look at the big picture and flush out these types of dogs and get rid of them. There are plenty of ethical Bull breeders producing fantastic dogs where I am sure if the irresponsible had dogs of stable temperament and quality procured from an ethical breeder, the majority of these Bull breed attacks IMHO would disappear.

Fiona

thank you for an intelligent post Fiona

Very refreshing after being berated from many others.

Personal attacks and insults are so low brow

I refuse to get into an argument with such small minded people as poodilfan, so i will simply post this link up & say read & learn....

http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/breedism

Oh & be sure to tell all the bull breed enthusiasts that they are all dickheads next time you attend an all breed show, i'd be interested to know their responses.

Who's 'poodilfan'? Do you mean 'poodlefan' - who I don't think deserves the small-minded tag btw - or maybe 'poodiful1'??

Edited: "snap" pf

:D

personal attacks now, typical bully bahaviour

What a surprise NOT!!!!

BTW, dog aggressive or people aggressive, doesn't make any difference to me. I'm just sick of people running to defend the dogs whenever there's a dog attack. That was my point in the first place.

BTW, my poodles have never bitten anyone,

Also, I never said that all bull breeders are dickheads, I said the dickheads that own these types of dogs.

The people that breed the dopgs have a responsbility to screen buyers properly and it's obviously not happening.

Just like Poodle breeders have a responsibility to screen who or what breed they are constantly crossing their dogs with and its obviously not happening. Just look at all the whatever/oodles in all the pet shops. I think that says more than enough about the integrity of Poodle owners.

Yes i know that is a generalised & inaccurate statement but it's just as stupid as the statements made by clowns such as poodiful.

Personal insults, what else should I expect from someone of your ilk

BTW, I screen my buyers extensively, that's why I still have 3 out of 4 pups left out of a litter atm, they are now 11 weeks old. I have turned down many people, including registered breeders that sell their dogs on full register to anyone

Only fools believe the modern media in its entirety.

The media always has an agenda, make no mistake about it.

Only people in denial twist what others say to justify in their own minds that what they are doing is right.

Yes maybe, they like crossing their breed with all sorts of stuff dont they?...labradoodle,spoodle,cavoodle,stupidoodle etc...

Not nice when someone makes generalised statements about your chosen breed & its owners is it????

Nah that's Deshonko. We've just come up with the 'must have' oodle for this year. Its a hypoallergenic bull breed I'm working on a blue one now. Text or email your orders and credit card numbers and I''ll guarantee delivery before Xmas.

Ta daaaa!!!

too cute, is that your dog?

I refuse to get into an argument with such small minded people as poodilfan, so i will simply post this link up & say read & learn....

http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/breedism

Oh & be sure to tell all the bull breed enthusiasts that they are all dickheads next time you attend an all breed show, i'd be interested to know their responses.

Who's 'poodilfan'? Do you mean 'poodlefan' - who I don't think deserves the small-minded tag btw - or maybe 'poodiful1'??

Edited: "snap" pf

:)

personal attacks now, typical bully bahaviour

What a surprise NOT!!!!

BTW, dog aggressive or people aggressive, doesn't make any difference to me. I'm just sick of people running to defend the dogs whenever there's a dog attack. That was my point in the first place.

BTW, my poodles have never bitten anyone,

Also, I never said that all bull breeders are dickheads, I said the dickheads that own these types of dogs.

The people that breed the dopgs have a responsbility to screen buyers properly and it's obviously not happening.

Look at all the bullies ganging up on me, with their rhetoric or should I say bullsh!it, I'm sick of the bullies defending the bullies, but that's what bully owners are generally like and you are all not going to convince me or the general public that certain breeds are not more dangerous than others.

Please explain how me disagreeing with your statements is now "bullying". How tiresome that accusation is becoming on this forum when people seek to distance themselves from their failing arguments. :D

I would remind you I'm not the one who suggested that another poster's vocabulary was lacking. Personal attack anyone?

I can only recommend that you read the studies, read the bite stats and do your own homework. There isn't a case on record of breed specific legislation reducing the incidence of dog attacks in a community. I commend to you the study on the impact of owner education in reducing attacks in Calgary in Canada. There is plenty of hard evidence about that on the net. None of this is rhetoric. The evidence is there for all to see.

Perception is NOT reality when it comes to breeds and the danger they represent. I'm sorry but there is simply no evidence I can find to support the efficacy of breed bans. If you can come up with some, please post it.

I'm over it sorry. Like I said, you can't convince me that some breeds are not more dangerous than others. I'm so sick of hearing news stories of attacks and you people always going in defence mode with your " It's the breed not the deed" Sick to death of it.

Shame really, I hope you are more open to new and different ideas in your breeding endeavours :D

No I won't be crossing my toy poodle with a pitbull :D ;)

Look at all the bullies ganging up on me, with their rhetoric or should I say bullsh!it, I'm sick of the bullies defending the bullies, but that's what bully owners are generally like and you are all not going to convince me or the general public that certain breeds are not more dangerous than others.

Please explain how me disagreeing with your statements is now "bullying". How tiresome that accusation is becoming on this forum when people seek to distance themselves from their failing arguments.

I would remind you I'm not the one who suggested that another poster's vocabulary was lacking. Personal attack anyone?

I can only recommend that you read the studies, read the bite stats and do your own homework. There isn't a case on record of breed specific legislation reducing the incidence of dog attacks in a community. I commend to you the study on the impact of owner education in reducing attacks in Calgary in Canada. There is plenty of hard evidence about that on the net. None of this is rhetoric. The evidence is there for all to see.

Perception is NOT reality when it comes to breeds and the danger they represent. I'm sorry but there is simply no evidence I can find to support the efficacy of breed bans. If you can come up with some, please post it.

I'm over it sorry. Like I said, you can't convince me that some breeds are not more dangerous than others. I'm so sick of hearing news stories of attacks and you people always going in defence mode with your " It's the breed not the deed" Sick to death of it.

Look at all the bullies ganging up on me, with their rhetoric or should I say bullsh!it, I'm sick of the bullies defending the bullies, but that's what bully owners are generally like and you are all not going to convince me or the general public that certain breeds are not more dangerous than others.

Shock horror, what a surprise. NOT!!!

yet another bull something or rather being responsible for another attack.

It's the deed not the breed Blah Blah Blah, so sick of hearing it.

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

Who cares what sort of bull it was, some breeds are just dangerous, start and end of story.

If you chose to breed a dangerous breed, you may be responsible for selling them to irresponsible d!ckheads.

True to a degree but how can any breeder ever be 100% sure that the people purchasing a dog

will prove to be responsible owners and not irresponsible dickheads? Short of psychoanalyzing people one can never be too sure unfortunately.

Correctamundo, a breeder cannot, so yes they are responsible to an extent.

Poodiful:

Dangerous breeds have the ability to inflict fatal injuries

There's no such thing as a "dangerous breed". By that definition, any breed larger than about 15kg would be "dangerous".

My friend's 10kg Miniature Poodle put 20 stitches in her arm. If he'd hit a vein or artery that attack might well have been fatal.

You're comment is a speculation

Yes, it is.

Your comment about breeds that "have the ability" to inflict fatal injury is speculative catergorisation also. You're labelling dogs based on potential, not bite history. How speculative is that? You'd have dogs labelled dangerous based on no attack history whatsoever. It may interest you to know that the number one dog for bites in Canada is a gundog. Shall we add Golden Retrievers to the "dangerous dogs" list now?

You're categorising dogs based not on what they HAVE done but what they MIGHT be capable of. That Miniature Poodle could have killed my friend. He sure made a mess of her arm. Unlike so many dogs you'd like to see labelled dangerous, that dog had actually inflicted harm.

A fierce resource guarder with very little bite inhibition can do that when a person impulsively tries to take a stolen bone. His breed had bugger all to do with it.

I suggest you look up the definition of speculation.

Poodiful:

Dangerous breeds have the ability to inflict fatal injuries

There's no such thing as a "dangerous breed". By that definition, any breed larger than about 15kg would be "dangerous".

My friend's 10kg Miniature Poodle put 20 stitches in her arm. If he'd hit a vein or artery that attack might well have been fatal.

You're comment is a speculation

Some are just more dangerous than others. Do you think the press deliberately excludes attacks out of the news by what is regarded as non dangerous breed? I don't think so.

I have yet to see in the news Toy Poodle kills young child.

Why do suppose that is?

I'm sick of people defending dangerous breeds.

Because Poodles are considered sissy dogs for sissy people and so not owned by the type who like to breed/raise thug dogs.

Secondly, because the most often owned Poodles would be miniatures or toys so if a child gets bitten, the wound is small and not enough to require hospital attention. Certainly not enough to create a "newsworthy" picture of a face full of stitches.

That's right, I agree.

Excellent! So, no more rants about breeds then, just rants about owners.

Dangerous breeds have the ability to inflict fatal injuries.There's no denying it. Constant news reports make that apparent.

What do you mean by dangerous breeds?

Do you consider GSDs, lab, border collies etc dangerous because they are big to inflict fatal injuries?

I'm talking about dogs that were bred for guarding, protecting and fighting. The ones that are always in the NEWS.

Some are just more dangerous than others. Do you think the press deliberately excludes attacks out of the news by what is regarded as non dangerous breed? I don't think so.

I have yet to see in the news Toy Poodle kills young child.

Why do suppose that is?

I'm sick of people defending dangerous breeds.

Because Poodles are considered sissy dogs for sissy people and so not owned by the type who like to breed/raise thug dogs.

Secondly, because the most often owned Poodles would be miniatures or toys so if a child gets bitten, the wound is small and not enough to require hospital attention. Certainly not enough to create a "newsworthy" picture of a face full of stitches.

That's right, I agree.

Excellent! So, no more rants about breeds then, just rants about owners.

Dangerous breeds have the ability to inflict fatal injuries.There's no denying it. Constant news reports make that apparent.

Shock horror, what a surprise. NOT!!!

yet another bull something or rather being responsible for another attack.

It's the deed not the breed Blah Blah Blah, so sick of hearing it.

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

Who cares what sort of bull it was, some breeds are just dangerous, start and end of story.

If you chose to breed a dangerous breed, you may be responsible for selling them to irresponsible d!ckheads.

FFS here we go again.

I almost lost my face to a poodle I was grooming, would you classify Poodles as a dangerous breed??

ALMOST is the critical word here, now isn't it.

Why?? If I was a child I would have lost my face, the dog was deadly serious, it was dangerous.

Any breed can inflict terrible injuries you would certainly have your head in a dark warm place not to understand that.

What child grooms poodles for a living? Some dogs are easier to groom than others, some dogs hate it and find the groomer to be threatening, they cannot flee, so they fight.

If you think that a toy poodle can inflict the same injury as a bull something or other it is you that's got your head in a dark warm place not me???

Shock horror, what a surprise. NOT!!!

yet another bull something or rather being responsible for another attack.

It's the deed not the breed Blah Blah Blah, so sick of hearing it.

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

Who cares what sort of bull it was, some breeds are just dangerous, start and end of story.

If you chose to breed a dangerous breed, you may be responsible for selling them to irresponsible d!ckheads.

all breeds are potentially dangerous in the wrong hands.

Some are just more dangerous than others. Do you think the press deliberately excludes attacks out of the news by what is regarded as non dangerous breed? I don't think so.

I have yet to see in the news Toy Poodle kills young child.

Why do suppose that is?

I'm sick of people defending dangerous breeds.

Actually, I do.

For one thing, i think if they can't accurately identify a dog as a purebred (and it has been proven many times that most people have no idea, its only us dog obsessed that would actually be able to identify a APBT or bullmastiff etc), they should say crossbred dog or mixed breed.

A labrador or GR attack rarely makes the news yet they do have quite a high incidence of biting people (I'm not lab/GR bashing, it is probably due to their popularity)

Obviously a pit bull, GSD, labrador, pointer etc are potentially more dangerous than a toy poodle, pug or chihuahua due to their size.

"bull breeds" appear to attack people more often because the media chooses to publicize any attack where the dog looks vaguely like "bull breed"and then call it a Pit Bull. most of these dogs are actually crossbreds (bred by bybers who don't care who they sell to) and owned by not the most respnsible people.

Where do you suppose the BYBs got their foundation stock from? If the dog resembles a bull whatever, it makes no difference to me or the rest of the general public.

Some are just more dangerous than others. Do you think the press deliberately excludes attacks out of the news by what is regarded as non dangerous breed? I don't think so.

I have yet to see in the news Toy Poodle kills young child.

Why do suppose that is?

I'm sick of people defending dangerous breeds.

Because Poodles are considered sissy dogs for sissy people and so not owned by the type who like to breed/raise thug dogs.

Secondly, because the most often owned Poodles would be miniatures or toys so if a child gets bitten, the wound is small and not enough to require hospital attention. Certainly not enough to create a "newsworthy" picture of a face full of stitches.

That's right, I agree.

Shock horror, what a surprise. NOT!!!

yet another bull something or rather being responsible for another attack.

It's the deed not the breed Blah Blah Blah, so sick of hearing it.

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

Who cares what sort of bull it was, some breeds are just dangerous, start and end of story.

If you chose to breed a dangerous breed, you may be responsible for selling them to irresponsible d!ckheads.

FFS here we go again.

I almost lost my face to a poodle I was grooming, would you classify Poodles as a dangerous breed??

ALMOST is the critical word here, now isn't it.

Shock horror, what a surprise. NOT!!!

yet another bull something or rather being responsible for another attack.

It's the deed not the breed Blah Blah Blah, so sick of hearing it.

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

Who cares what sort of bull it was, some breeds are just dangerous, start and end of story.

If you chose to breed a dangerous breed, you may be responsible for selling them to irresponsible d!ckheads.

all breeds are potentially dangerous in the wrong hands.

Some are just more dangerous than others. Do you think the press deliberately excludes attacks out of the news by what is regarded as non dangerous breed? I don't think so.

I have yet to see in the news Toy Poodle kills young child.

Why do suppose that is?

I'm sick of people defending dangerous breeds.

Shock horror, what a surprise. NOT!!!

yet another bull something or rather being responsible for another attack.

It's the deed not the breed Blah Blah Blah, so sick of hearing it.

Sorry but the d!ckheads that own these sorts breeds have much to answer for.

Who cares what sort of bull it was, some breeds are just dangerous, start and end of story.

If you chose to breed a dangerous breed, you may be responsible for selling them to irresponsible d!ckheads.

OMG this thread has made me feel ill. I was all for the rally, now I'm all confused.

IMO, Companion animals should be treated as such, be it 1 or 10, "breeders" and/or pets, one must provide adequate care to ensure that the dog's physical and mental needs are met to ensure it to be a good companion, and that the animals are well fed, have clean water always available and live in a clean comfortable and warm condition without abuse. If one was to breed the animal, one must do testing that is available pertaining to the breed, be it pure or cross. And not to breed an animal to the degree that it is detrimental to the animal's health.

If this is what I'm rallying for, then I'll be there.

I think that pet insurance is the way to go in this contract.

I think the way to go with this contract is not to enter into it at all, go elsewhere.

I'm sure as hell not letting my lines go out to an unknown novice in QLD. that isn't even a member of dogs QLD yet. I don't know about your breed Miranda but there are many disreputable breeders in Toy Poodles. I was trying to help the girl by co-owning a quality dog with her.

I don't know of any breeders in Toys that let their dogs go out just like that. Yes she can go elsewhere, and that's what shew will probably do, but the likelyhood of her getting a quality dog with Smash lines is pretty slim.As far as I'm concerned, I would rather put the dog in a pet home than to sell a dog outright to someone I don't know that lives 2000km away. Gotta save the lines, and gotta make sure the dog doesn't get into the wrong hands!!!!

Sorry i thought I was replying to a thread about a contract for a Bernese not a toy poodle My fault, I didn't read the complete thread. obviously I've missed something

No worries

I think that pet insurance is the way to go in this contract.

I think the way to go with this contract is not to enter into it at all, go elsewhere.

I'm sure as hell not letting my lines go out to an unknown novice in QLD. that isn't even a member of dogs QLD yet. I don't know about your breed Miranda but there are many disreputable breeders in Toy Poodles. I was trying to help the girl by co-owning a quality dog with her.

I don't know of any reputable breeders in Toys that let their dogs go out just like that. Yes she can go elsewhere, and that's what shew will probably do, but the likelyhood of her getting a quality dog with Smash lines is pretty slim.As far as I'm concerned, I would rather put the dog in a pet home than to sell a dog outright to someone I don't know that lives 2000km away. Gotta save the lines, and gotta make sure the dog doesn't get into the wrong hands!!!!