Steve

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I would like to remind you all that we will be closing our health survey soon. Its important you ad your dogs details in for us. That is any dog regardless of how well or sick it may have been if it has been alive in the last 10 years. There are many breeds which have an under representation from breeders answering and some which wont be able to be included due to small numbers being represented. There is a survey for every breed including mixed breed and F1 crosses. Please take 10 mins to fill in the survey for each dog as we wil be closing it off at the end of December. survey

I would like to remind you all that we will be closing our health survey soon. Its important you ad your dogs details in for us. That is any dog regardless of how well or sick it may have been if it has been alive in the last 10 years. There are many breeds which have an under representation from breeders answering and some which wont be able to be included due to small numbers being represented. There is a survey for every breed including mixed breed and F1 crosses. Please take 10 mins to fill in the survey for each dog as we wil be closing it off at the end of December. survey

Do you mean McGreevy's working dog survey - Sydney Uni? What happened with it?

Our health survey is showing several breeds get SM including F1 crosses. Surely if it was a simple as head size they would have worked that out by now - especially in humans.

O.K. Helen looks like you win.

Good idea.

I looked for some a couple of years ago and there was no such thing .Id take it out if you can find it.

No one like this one?

$35 will do You win Trishm Next - Doc Halligans what every pet owner should know

itsmeg is the winner on this one [saddlebag] Next another book- The best ever on Canine Nutrition and its actually the text book for one of our nutrition courses. CANINE NUTRITION by Lowell Ackerman Expanded Description: What every owner, breeder, and trainer should know! If you're one of those people who wants to make intelligent decisions about your dog's dietary needs, this book is for you. What food are you going to buy? Does your dog need a supplement? What kinds of treats are healthiest? What should you feed your dog if he has a medical condition? What are your dog's nutritional needs at different stages of his life? Should you feed a commercial diet, or a homemade diet? Includes information on reading labels, nutritional requirements, calories, what the various enzymes, vitamins, and minerals do for your dog, and much more. Appendices.

Late call for this one.

How about one of these next?

Ahhh sorry didnt think of that. Sydney time. Julie

Ill need your address details [email protected]

Thank You Baifra - could you email your address details to me. Next ends at 9.30 pm today POSITIVE TRAINING FOR SHOW DOGS - BUILDING A RELATIONSHIP FOR SUCCESS by Vicki Ronchette http://www.dogwise.com/SearchResults.cfm?S...ubSearch=author Expanded Description: Apply the latest scientific research on how dogs learn to the world of dog showing. Whether you are just getting started in the breed ring or are an experienced show dog handler, you will enjoy learning how to work with your dog as your partner. Get outstanding showing results by using positive reinforcement methods including clicker training and lure/reward methods. Written by a dog show person for dog show people!

All I know is that the Cavalier Heads ,here in Britain are Smaller than they were 20-25 years ago. Even the Cavalier Dogs now look Effeminate. That a Geneticist here has suggested that Cavaliers with Larger Heads be MRI Scanned against those with Smaller Heads. There is a EBV Program soon to be started in Britain, the Question will be ,what if the the Cavaliers with Biggar Heads are suggested for Cavalier Breeding Programs, but maybe will have no chance of Winning in the Show Scene, will the Cavalier Breeders be interested. Professor Sir P Bateson's Report will be releasd in the Middle of January,I expect there will be more information coming from it. Bet Hargreaves Well I dont know what its like in other countries and no doubt there would be some breeders who are slow to get the message but Im absolutely positive no breeder who is a member of the MDBA would consider putting a championship over the health and future of their dogs or their breeds. If it came out that a small head was in fact responsible then most breeders would breed bigger heads and thats a promise.

that was easy . Next one finishes at 5pm today. Donated by Vicki 5 coats will be custom made to fit.... come in the color of your chioce...polar fleece,toweling lined with velcro front and attached belly strap.

Thanks Raz !

We have a well known doler who is need of a hand. Sway must be busy so Ill give this one a go while we wait for her. Starts : NOW! Ends: Saturday Dec 19 8pm Melb time Pay: Paypal address is [email protected] and bank details are Commonwealth Bank 062600 account number 10488688. Im asking those who wish to donate an item to email me direct [email protected] 2 x Adult movie tickets for use at Greater Union/Villiage Cinemas/Birch Caroll Coyle Note: expire july 2010. not for use after 5pm Saturdays. Thank You to Robyn - gillbear for the donation.

If purebred breeders are left to work on the issues as the responsible ones already were and it promotes the good ones and alerts the public to the fact there are rotten ones that would be a positive outcome. Remember that screening, and testing capabilities are a relatively new tool for breeders and used in conjuction with pedigree analysis and breeder and buyer education breeders will be able to identify the real problems and the extent of them and work on eliminating them and truly improving the breeds. However, its pretty obvious that this isnt the way its going to go down.We still face the major issue in that no one knows the prevalence of these things IN AUSTRALIAN PUREBRED DOGS. We hear all kinds of percentages quoted but in the next sentence we are told no studies exist.Cavaliers for example have been cited as having Mitrial valve disease at 60%. Our survey is showing that this is an issue in the breed but nowhere near 60% and a quick phone survey of several vets in my area says they dont believe its running at 60% and nor do the people who see more than average of the breed and live with more than average of the breed either. Syringomelia has shown up but this is negligible and its shown in F1 crosses and a couple of other breeds as well.Very few of the diseases are not in mixed bred and F1 crosses even though most are in less ratios. Obviously purebreds get higher incidence of fewer diseases,there's nothing new in this.My point is that although some diseases are in a higher incidence in certain breeds those diseases are also in mixed breeds and this fact can work in our favour.Knowing what problems are in a breed then allows us to identify the modes of inheritance and work toward eliminating them. People who dont understand all of the things a purebred breeder has to do to try and get it right and those with expertise in other areas are yelling about what they feel is the cause of problems and how they need to be fixed.My fear is that because they have initials behind their names or because they belong to a certain group such as the RSPCA that what they think is the necassary laws and regulations will remove some of the tools a purebred breeder may need to use and muck it up for the future of our dogs and our breeds. Every day new and wonderous things are being discovered in canine health and there are so many other things which impact on the health and happiness of a dog - many of which we are just beginning to understand and learn about.Most of which depending on what our specialty is have more than one theory or solution.Most of which the experts are not in agreement on. So many of the big deal things we see in our dogs are of a genetic nature but are also impacted by other things and many of them we still have little knowledge of the modes of inheritance or how we can identify those which may pass it on to future generations. Obviously some of these things are caused because of their physical characteristics unique to their breed.If it turns out that Syringomelia is caused by small heads then breeders will need to establish a breeding protocol to get it gone from the breed but if the best and quickest way to identify the cause, the mode of inheritance and the solution is to use tight in breeding for a generation or two in an educated and controlled way and a government has taken away the right for us to use that because they have banned close in breeding its a tool we cant use. Im not saying it is but we dont know and nor do they but they do know we rarely in breed because they have done studies on it recently using our pedigrees.Bringing in laws to stop us doing it under POCTAA is not only a waste of time because we rarely in bred this closely but because it takes away a tool we may need to eliminate a disease or a trait from a breed and by the time they work out that they have created a bigger problem it will be too late. The same potential occurs if they follow the UK recommendation of putting in a welfare group over all things dog related - to make breeders answerable to people who dont breed but who are classified qualified because their group is known to work against animal cruelty for everything we do. O.K. We get it we have work to do but these are things we have to be able to assess , analyse , put plans in place and work on without animal rights and government intevention because at this point that would be the very worst thing that could happen to our dogs.If it turns out that eliminating Syringomelia is as simple as breeding dogs with bigger skulls [ and I dont believe it is] then I promise the minute they know this breeders world wide will go into breed only dogs with bigger skulls.Co incidentalLy in my opinion one of the quickest ways of working this out would be to inbreed and do test matings in a controlled colony. If they allow us to concentrate our energy on working out what we need to do to ensure we breed happy and healthy purebred dogs and not have to battle to prevent laws designed to control us, based on their limited experience, [which would limit our right to make the best decsions for our breeding programs] we can get on with what needs to be done.

Its pretty hard to get it right isnt it? some people come here complaining because the breeder isnt interested enough and they dont contact them. Just be honest and tell the breeder what you think - maybe a little more nicely than you have here- and then maybe she can explain to you herself how she feels and apologise to you for making you feel upset about it. I love photos from my puppy buyers and Im just as interested when they are old as what I am when they are young. Its also really important for breeders to get updates about their dogs and see photos to know what they may need to change in their breeding programs.

I think the problem in the following statement is in the \'give us\' Give us a system where we FEEL we have the ability to be heard and defend ourselves and our animals and where we dont FEEL threatened and helpless against goliath. . . . . Policing seems to be the most difficult area of governance. If you have a stomach for cursing, I'd recommend viewing The Wire (rent the DVD's . . .HBO stuff), a cop show like no other, which deals with the problem of policing in terms of individuals, bureaucracy, education, and the full gamit of complexity. I see that you (Steve, MDBA, and friends) are working hard and effectively. But no one is going to give provide the dog world with a utopian system for encouraging good practice and cutting back on outright cruelty. It's hard, endless, work to improve the bloody system that has come down to us. Companion animal legislation is every bit as hard as dealing with race, sexual orientation, or drugs . . . and governance systems may be equally as f@$#'ed up. But our budgets are in the hundreds of millions instead of the multi-to-hundreds of billions scale. So it's hard to get attention. Personally, I don\'t think the RSPCA are the bad guys. Not sure 'bad guys' is the problem. It's the lack of a sensible framework for management of a complex problem. Its not the lack of sensible frame work its the fact that animal rights loonies have been able to dictate animal law. Because some whacker who happens to be attached to the RSPCA said debarking is a cruel barbaric procedure they all agree and bring in laws to outlaw it.Vet students arent even taught how to debark and they are being educated by animal rights nuts too. Now they run radio campaigns to tell the public the bad bad people who have their animals debarked are horribly cruel people who have to be legislated against to be sure they dont do these terrible things unless its the last resort.Why? What the hell is wrong with a dog owner wanting to have their dog debarked by a vet if they want to? So what if some want to have their dogs debarked by a vet without jumping through hoops with council because they think the dog will be happier barking more softly than being trained to shut up? It makes no sense - none - not any to advocate and in some places make it law to desex your dog which carries much more serious possible side effects and is much more cruel and barbaric than debarking and yet these laws go ahead and then just to be sure that just in case a cruel purebred show breeder finds a loophole and actually finds a way to do with their dog what they think is best slap another law on them and seize their dogs and turn them into crimminals for taking them to a dog show???????????? In NSW you cant have an electric fence - why? In some states you cant give an injection - why? They are making laws based on what is said by people who have no experience or real knowledge of the issues or the unintended consequences. They say something is cruel so it must be. No one can stand up and say bugger off because it makes us look like we do it and we are the bad guys they are talking about "Look at the bad breeders - we have to have laws to stop them" the public sees we need laws to stop us being so cruel.Then they give these people the power to police it all with no accountability. So the problem begins with animal rights influencing animal law and not just the lack of a sensible framework.Its a lack of sensible anything. If RSPCA says it cruel - it must be.

Cut down on your vegie mix to 200 grams and your liver to 50 grams add a pinch of iodised salt and 5 mils of apple cidar vinegar.