Kaos Central Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 (edited) Our poodle cross has always been an excellent dog, she did very well at obedience, and she has always been a joy to train and handle. However in the last few days she has become very temperamental, she is 7, and in very good health. She will not heal, will only sit if bribed and she has begun to steal food off of our other dogs and off of the kitchen bench or table. We have been rescuing dogs for 9 yrs and there have always been dogs coming and going, we have more permanent dogs than we have ever had before but the rules have not changed. Any ideas? thank you Edited October 1, 2007 by Kaos Central Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 Kaos - on the strict assumption (which is all I can do, given that I don't have the opportunity to observe you, your dog and your relationship) that what you write is all there is to it, then my mind wanders to the possibility of the outset of some sort of cognitive dysfunction, such as dementia? Having just come away from a seminar which has briefed on the topic, it has refreshed my memory (I think sometimes I suffer the cognitive dysfunction myself!!! ) that this can affect dogs at around the age of 7 years ..... although often it is not identified until the dog is somewhat older. Perhaps this is an area which is worth exploring given that you have identified all other areas (eg leadership) to be properly in place and without issue? What might also help track back and reach accurate diagnosis as to the even more finite of behaviours that might have been there but brushed aside as inconsequential, when they began to occur and what was happening within the household at the time. Eg. A new dog coming into the household (even though I know you say her behaviour has remained unchanged with all the others). Something else to consider, in particular to the stealing of food ................. are there any other of your dogs that do or have done this and from which the behaviour has become learnt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaos Central Posted September 17, 2007 Author Share Posted September 17, 2007 thanks erny, i never thought about it but we have had my sisters 2 staffys here and they are not well behaved when they eat, maybe she has leanrt it from them. i will keep an eye on her and see how it goes.... she has also become very clingy ie she hates it if she cant follow me everywhere, which i have read can be an early sign of dementia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted September 17, 2007 Share Posted September 17, 2007 Becoming clingy at your dog's age - assuming this is unlike her normal behaviour - can be another sign of cognitive dysfunction. Nutritional antioxidants can help with that and also, so I'm informed at the recent seminar, Gynkgo leaf extract. You could contact Robert McDowall who helps and supplies holistic medications for dogs. At least speak with him and describe what you have detected. I don't wish to draw your attention away from the possibility of more simple things that are behaviour adaptations which might have developed as a result of imitation and/or inadvertent reinforcement, or even things that have not seen consistency in training (eg in your case the 'heel') or even inadvertent lapse of leadership which in itself can alter dramatically where things such as the members of the household changing can have quite an impact. But if you address these things confidently and are assured they are not contributing to the problems, then at least reference to someone such as Robert McDowall might be helpful. Good luck, and it really would be interesting if you would refresh this thread at some stage to let us know what you discovered and how you got on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poodle wrangler Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 I'm not a training expert, but they often advise that you go back to basics when your dog isn't responding. Go back to using food as bribery until your dog is consistently responding well, then make the food an intermittent reward, then phase out (if you don't like to use it). Going back and reteaching the right behaviours isn't something that would do any harm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaos Central Posted September 18, 2007 Author Share Posted September 18, 2007 We have just come home from the vet... pepsi has significant hearing loss and is loosing her sight. she has cateracts, the vet has advised me to consider putting her to sleep. Something i do not want to do she is still a young dog. She was taken from her mum at just 4 weeks and had a really tough start in life, now at 7 i dont want to let her down. I suppose these are the things that puppy farmers dont think about, what happens to them in middle age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelpie-i Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 PTS for becoming blind and deaf. Unless your dog is suffering in severe pain and discomfort, I would not have him PTS. This is definitely your decision in the end, but not a valid reason to end a life just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 Much is your choice Kaos and I for one would not judge you for whichever choice you make, as there will be some adjustments needed in your general way of life to cater for your dog's loss of these two senses. I have not had experience with a dog who was both blind and deaf so I'd recommend you pop into the "health forum" here on DOL and ask for those who have, to give you some insight on things they did to make their dog's (and their own) lives a bit easier and how they coped in general. I'm really sorry for your dog's diagnosis. But unless the Vet had a very good reason for suggesting pts without informing you of the option of change of lifestyle or perhaps possible treatments, I'd probably go seek a second opinion. Again, I'm no expert on the subject but I believe there are treatments available for cataracts ..... one of which are drops. I've not had much feedback on the "drops" treatment, but the very little I have had has been quite good. You also say she has "significant" hearing loss ..... that doesn't mean "total" so there may be ways of working around that too. I'm also curious to know if the Vet has investigated or spoken about investigating whether there is a cause to the significant hearing loss ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaos Central Posted September 18, 2007 Author Share Posted September 18, 2007 She didn't see our regular vet, she seen a guy who was filling in for him, so he could take some time off. When my vet gets back i will take her back and see what he thinks. I dont think there is anything wrong with her hearing personally, if she is in her kennel and i open the fridge, she is there. same as when i pick up the food bowls, they are no where to be seen, usually up stairs and she is usually the first at my feet. I think she was just being beligerent with the vet. I know her sight is going becasue if we move things she will often bump into them.... so we dont move things any more!! Her health is otherwise very good, she loves her walks and tumbling around with our other dogs, We have gone back to basic training, ( not a bad thing when you have a house full of puppies) switched back to walking her in a gentle leader. she seems very happy... and when that changes i will reassess her future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poodle wrangler Posted September 19, 2007 Share Posted September 19, 2007 We have just come home from the vet... pepsi has significant hearing loss and is loosing her sight. she has cateracts, the vet has advised me to consider putting her to sleep. Something i do not want to do she is still a young dog. She was taken from her mum at just 4 weeks and had a really tough start in life, now at 7 i dont want to let her down. I suppose these are the things that puppy farmers dont think about, what happens to them in middle age. So sorry to hear that! If she's still enjoying life and can be a happy member of the 'family', I wouldn't rush to PTS either. If after you've made some adjustments she still isn't coping or becomes snappy and untrustworthy, that's a different matter . Whatever happens, at least you've given her a good 7 years she might otherwise never had . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted September 23, 2007 Share Posted September 23, 2007 We have just come home from the vet... pepsi has significant hearing loss and is loosing her sight. she has cateracts, the vet has advised me to consider putting her to sleep. Did your vet just present you with PTS as an option, Kaos, or did they tell you that it was definately the best idea? Just asking, as presenting PTS as an option is pretty much your vet's moral obligation (having a client PTS an elderly or sick animal is better than having the animal live neglected or in distress if the client can't be arsed catering to its needs). But if the vet told you that PTS was the best idea, that sounds a little extreme to me. If the vet said this, I too would suggest seeking a second opinion. Good luck with your elderly dog, I'm sure you'll do your best to make her old age comfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frufru Posted September 23, 2007 Share Posted September 23, 2007 (edited) Read something a couple of months ago which might be helpful since you said your dog is a poodle cross. It was suggested that whiskers (vibrassae) are very important for sight impaired dogs - so if you trim or shave his whiskers stop doing this. The book was How Dogs Think by Stanley Coren and it stuck in my mind as I have 2 poodles who are getting on. Good luck with your dog who definitely is not elderly at 7 years of age. Edited September 23, 2007 by frufru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaos Central Posted October 1, 2007 Author Share Posted October 1, 2007 Hi all, i just thought i would update you....we are doing a lot better.... our regular vet refered us to another vet and the dog is doing a lot better....we are putting drops in her eyes a couple of times a day and we have changed her diet....we have also reduced the amount of time she spends away from familiar suroundings....and if we do take her anywhere we always make sure she is in her harness and lead....we also discovered that her hearing was being effected by an infection and we have now got that cleared up....all in all i think she has a lot of years in her yet...thank you all for your support and your help it was very much appreciated.....sometimes when you are told bad news you stop listening to the future!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted October 1, 2007 Share Posted October 1, 2007 Wow! All things considered, that's GREAT news!!!! And the first Vet suggested pts??? : Glad you didn't take his word as gospel and act on it straight away. Boy, was HE ever off the mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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