Puppy Vs Cat, Crate Training, Supplementing?

[Risey]

My partner and I have just had our pup for a week today, and while she is absolutely beautiful in some respects, she can be quite the little monster! She's a 10.5 week old GSD we obtained from a breeder. Her parents had good hip scores but sometimes she appears to have a slight wobble in her hind legs, especially after lying down for a while. Is it recommended to feed her a glucosamine/chondroitin (or ester-c) supplement at this age? She's had her first day in puppy pre-school and the instructors put it down to gangly puppy phase.

Another issue is positive reinforcement as taught in puppy pre-school. I was planning to bring it up at the next session but thought I'd see what DOLers think as well. The instructors teach not to reprimand the puppy but to always offer another item of higher value if she chews or does something 'bad'. Wouldn't that put it in pup's head though that "stealing mom's slipper makes her give me treats when I drop it" ? She doesn't listen to good firm "NO's" either. It's especially frustrating because when she's in the mood, she sits and comes over on command like a dream. If she's not, nothing can make her do what we want, not even treats or kibble. Pup has even refused those liver pieces that the puppy pre-school instructors use! She also hates having a leash on and will gnaw on it if we don't stop her or distract her with treats (again only if she's amenable to treats).

Despite that, she has learned to eliminate outside, except for the unfortunate occassion where she can't hold it in any longer! We have a crate for her, and she sleeps in it with the door open; we shut the door during mealtimes and only let her out when she stops whinging, but goodness can she whinge! She just will not settle in the crate at night if the door is shut even though we've been sleeping in the lounge where her crate is for the past week. I suspect we'll just have to suck it up and bear her bringing the house down till she gets used to it.

Another issue that's really stressing me out at the moment is my poor cat. He's an adult and used to having the run of the house, but is now self-confined upstairs because puppy keeps barking when he ventures downstairs. We've got a baby gate on the stairs so the cat can escape to the 'safe area'. The cat is wary of the puppy and growls/hisses when she gets too close, but when the pup starts barking, kitty makes a break for it. Suggestions from people we know who own dogs so far is "let them have at it" but what if kitty puts out an eye? We've tried introducing them calmly and they appear to get used to each other but the pup starts barking again whenever the cat starts moving around. Any suggestions? We've tried crating the pup and bringing the cat close but both parties freak out and the cat scrambles upstairs when the barking starts. ARGH! I love them both to bits and it's really stressful that they won't get along.

So in summary:

Hip/joint supplements for puppy, yes/no?

Positive reinforcement (treat suggestions?) or firm "NO"s?

Crate training, will there be an end! (I know there will be, but it helps when people say "YES!")

How do I get pup and cat to get along?

Thanks in advance for any and all replies... It's a blessedly quiet moment now, pup's worn out from playing/training/few-minute-crating exercise......

Edited May 8, 2008 by Risey

[Cosmolo]

Re Supplement- what diet is your puppy on at the moment?

Positive R vs NO- you can use a combination which is my preference- high value rewards when the puppy does something great nd some kind of correction when they do something you do not want repeated. A correction can be anything from a verbal no, to a collar correction, lead correction, time out, water spray etc. Different people choose to use only positive R which works if your dog is highly motivated by what you have- try chicken or devon for treats or use a toy to motivate and reward.

Crate Training- willl settle ONLY if you are 100 % consistent. If you let her out one time in ten when she is crying you will make the problem much worse as the dog thinks its always worth a try! What is in the crate for pup to chew on etc?

Put the dog on lead near the cat and give a lead correction for barking/ chasing etc. Then give high value rewards (chicken/ devon etc) for calm behaviour and focus- these rewards may need to be almost constant to start with to keep focus.

[miamay]

Great pics....Fun aren't they. My 11 wk old lab is very food motivated which is great to train with but I am still having trouble getting her to wait for me to put her food out and she nips with great eagerness for treats. I am being firm and am confident I will win.

[Gayle.]

Wouldn't that put it in pup's head though that "stealing mom's slipper makes her give me treats when I drop it" ?

Yes.

I had my bloke bring me everything that wasn't bolted down one night, simply because I used treats to get him to give up his "prize". He soon cottoned on to the idea that if I wanted something from him, I'd give him a treat, so I was brought all manner of "gifts" such as the remotes, shoes, clothes etc which he'd only give up in exchange for a reward.

Now I use the word "Give" and show him the reward but he only gets it after he's worked for it. Given back the object then done a few sits, drops, some heelwork and a stay.

[Kavik]

Does your pup like toys? These can be great motivation for training. I use cheese as treats, the dogs love it Also I have found GSDs really like a good pat and scratch as a reward (more than my Kelpies who would sell their soul for food!). Diesel loves a chest rub!

[Risey]

Re Supplement- what diet is your puppy on at the moment?

Positive R vs NO- you can use a combination which is my preference- high value rewards when the puppy does something great nd some kind of correction when they do something you do not want repeated. A correction can be anything from a verbal no, to a collar correction, lead correction, time out, water spray etc. Different people choose to use only positive R which works if your dog is highly motivated by what you have- try chicken or devon for treats or use a toy to motivate and reward.

Crate Training- willl settle ONLY if you are 100 % consistent. If you let her out one time in ten when she is crying you will make the problem much worse as the dog thinks its always worth a try! What is in the crate for pup to chew on etc?

Put the dog on lead near the cat and give a lead correction for barking/ chasing etc. Then give high value rewards (chicken/ devon etc) for calm behaviour and focus- these rewards may need to be almost constant to start with to keep focus.

Thanks! I've been working with her all day, using her kibble as the main reward and other treats randomly - seems to be working quite well. She's currently on dry food only, with liver bits and chicken as an occassional treat. Training works well without distractions, she has a crazy long attention span. She's still easily distracted by outside sounds or people but.

Crate training: We never let her out if she's crying, only if she is quiet... and we're slowly increasing the "quiet time" before letting her out. I've also been treating her for being quiet, but not letting her out of the crate. She slept in it all last night, even with the door open. It makes it a lot easier, because I just have to shut the door when she's snoozing, no fuss! =) And YAY! She slept through the night without needing to go out!

Thanks for the advice with the cat too, I'll try it once I've figured out what's a strong drive for her! Just wondering though, does lead correction mean holding the lead taut/close to the collar, or does it include a firm tug?

Cheers!

[Risey]

Great pics....Fun aren't they. My 11 wk old lab is very food motivated which is great to train with but I am still having trouble getting her to wait for me to put her food out and she nips with great eagerness for treats. I am being firm and am confident I will win.

Hehe, indeed! Yeah, an adorable lab at puppy school performed beautifully in the first class - so focused on the treat that he blocked out all the commotion around him! Firm and confident does seem the way to go, I'll try my best!

[Risey]

Wouldn't that put it in pup's head though that "stealing mom's slipper makes her give me treats when I drop it" ?

Yes.

I had my bloke bring me everything that wasn't bolted down one night, simply because I used treats to get him to give up his "prize". He soon cottoned on to the idea that if I wanted something from him, I'd give him a treat, so I was brought all manner of "gifts" such as the remotes, shoes, clothes etc which he'd only give up in exchange for a reward.

Now I use the word "Give" and show him the reward but he only gets it after he's worked for it. Given back the object then done a few sits, drops, some heelwork and a stay.

Aww, that's adorable! I might start on the "Give" command sometime, but for the time being, I'm just being extra vigilant and doing chewtoy exchange. Once she's ready to learn more new commands, I'll definitely try that! Thanks for the advice~

[Jigsaw]

My cat stands her ground usually and belts the poor pup!! However when she has had enough of being mouthed and pawed and cornered she will make a run for it. As long as your cat has an escape route - somewhere high and out of reach and a safe haven she should be fine. I have taken the course of letting them settle it themselves but my cat is a "dominant" cat and they can now share a room or backyard without making it a boxing match every time - well not all of the time at least! If your cat runs every time she sees the dog and is showing signs of stress, ie not eating, over grooming, diarrhea etc you need to make sure that your dog learns that it must be calm preferably in a drop position and on lead when they meet (as stated by others). I was also advised by a very experienced trainer to feed the cat first and make sure that the cat is fed in a higher place than the dog. It is very hard though especially when the cat has had the run of the house prior to the pup. We have used baby gates to give the cat a safe haven when she's had enough of the pup!

My dog under distraction will not take treats either, instructor remarked at her first obedience class that she had never seen a dog "so turned on"!