Dry Food Comparisons

[Oscar (AmBull)]

I have been for a little while researching the different ingredients for different dry foods. We are at the moment feeding Royal Canin Maxi Junior however after researching I feel it is quite expensive for the ingredients it has. I am impressed with:

Artemis - Fresh Mix M/L Breed Puppy

Ingredients

Chicken, Turkey,Chicken Meal, Salmon Meal,Pearled Barley, Whole Brown Rice, Oatmeal, Millet, Potatoes, Dried Egg, Tomato Pomace,Chicken Fat ( preserved with mixed tocopherols Salmon,Flaxseed,Natural Chicken Flavour, Salmon Oil ( A source of DHA) Choline Chloride,Dried Chicory root, Kelp, Carrots, Peas,Apples, Tomatoes, Blueberries, Spinach, Cranberry Powder, Rosemary Extract, Parsley Flake, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Green Tea Extract, Barley Grass Extract, L-carnitine, Enterococcus Faecieum, Lactobacillus Casei, Lactobacillus Acidophilus, Saccharomyces Cerevesiae Fermentation Solubles, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Proteinate, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Thiamine Mononitrate, Manganese Proteinate, Manganous Oxide, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Biotin, Calcium Pantothenate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin, Vitamin D Supplement, Folic Acid.

Guaranteed Analysis

Crude Protein. min 27% Crude Fat, min 13% Crude Fibre, max 3% Moisture, max 10% Vitamin E, min 300IU/kg Biotin, min 0.33mg/kg Omega-6 Fatty Acids, min 2.5% Omega-3 Fatty Acids, min 0.4% DHA ( Docosohexaenoic Acid),min 0.05%

I also like the:

Pro Plan Sensitive Skin and Stomach

So some details and my questions:

Oscar is an Amstaff, turning 1 on the 24th of this month. He has a RMB for lunch then dry food at night. I am going to start mixing the dry food in with some raw. I am wanting to make the change as I feel his coat is quite dry and dull on the royal canin, harsh to touch, also as mentioned before I believe there is better out there for the money.

I am wanting to know what people's experiences are with the food mentioned?

Is there another food you would recommend?

Just overall opinions really on making the switch when unhappy.

Thanks.

[Tintin Jac]

My 1 yo had been on Artemis since we had him until a week or so ago.

The ingredients look good and I know that ther are dogs that do really well on it but I have just changed from it.

Tintin wasn't ever really interested in eating it unless it had added flavour - sardines, yoghurt etc. He also had poo which wasn't very nice...not that any poo is "nice" but you get the picture.

I have been researching raw for a bit and then heard about K9 Natural at the local pet supply store. I bought a small pack and he devours it in a matter of seconds. I also feed him some other raw food and rmb. His stools are now the sort that go white and crumbly in a few hours.

So, for us, unfortunately, Artemis wasn't great and I am very happy (so far!) that I changed his diet. Wish I had done it sooner. It is still to early to be able to tell how he will go, long term, on his new diet.

[twodoggies2001]

It has been said that kibble and raw digest at different rates and probably should not be fed together. What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'. Also, I feel there are too many carbohydrates in that mix. You say that your boy is eating raw. Then why don't you just continue with a full raw diet? I'm sure your boy will appreciate it, and you'll see the difference in his coat.

[16Paws]

We've been using Artemis med/lg breed puppy for about 2 months now. Previously our lab pup was on Royal Canin and then Hills Science Diet but we were forever at the vet to treat tummy upsets and the runs. Since changing to artemis her poo is the best we've seen it (though I've yet to see one go white and crumbly within a few hours?!)

Can't say I've noticed much of a difference in her coat on any of the foods. Neither of our dogs seem to love the taste and we do have days where we need to mix something in or at least add some hot water (enhanced the smell).

Our cattle dog foster loves the dry food and his condition has improved already in the week and a bit we've had him.

Edited March 12, 2010 by 16Paws

[Tintin Jac]

What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'.

Isn't chicken meal and salmon meal just squished whole chickens and whole salmon?

[twodoggies2001]

What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'.

Isn't chicken meal and salmon meal just squished whole chickens and whole salmon?

Yes, but the chicken etc. used is of inferior quality

[poodlefan]

We've been using Artemis med/lg breed puppy for about 2 months now. Previously our lab pup was on Royal Canin and then Hills Science Diet but we were forever at the vet to treat tummy upsets and the runs. Since changing to artemis her poo is the best we've seen it (though I've yet to see one go white and crumbly within a few hours?!)

Can't say I've noticed much of a difference in her coat on any of the foods. Neither of our dogs seem to love the taste and we do have days where we need to mix something in or at least add some hot water (enhanced the smell).

Our cattle dog foster loves the dry food and his condition has improved already in the week and a bit we've had him.

You'd need to feed raw meaty bones like chicken wings to see that.

[poodlefan]

What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'.

Isn't chicken meal and salmon meal just squished whole chickens and whole salmon?

Yes, but the chicken etc. used is of inferior quality

Perhaps but still human grade.

[twodoggies2001]

What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'.

Isn't chicken meal and salmon meal just squished whole chickens and whole salmon?

Yes, but the chicken etc. used is of inferior quality

Perhaps but still human grade.

I don't think so. Jump on to google and see what really is in pet food.

[laffi]

twodoggies2001 I think you confuse "meal" with "by product".

Meal just means that most of the water has been removed from the ingredient. Dry food that contains chicken meal and salmon meat as the first ingredients is the way too go :D

Even though Artemis - Fresh Mix M/L Breed Puppy lists Chicken and Turkey as the first 2 ingredients, once the water is removed (this happens during the rendering process while making the dry food) these two drop in their position significantly.

So the first true ingredients are:

Chicken Meal, Salmon Meal,Pearled Barley, Whole Brown Rice, Oatmeal, Millet, Potatoes, Dried Egg, Tomato Pomace,Chicken Fat

which, ingredient-wise, makes this dry food one of the best ones available in Australia.

It does not mean your dog will go well on it. It just means that potentially your dog can do excellent on it.

Hope that helps

ETA: I feed prey-model diet and am not here to argue "what really is in pet food".

Edited March 12, 2010 by laffi

[twodoggies2001]

twodoggies2001 I think you confuse "meal" with "by product".

Meal just means that most of the water has been removed from the ingredient. Dry food that contains chicken meal and salmon meat as the first ingredients is the way too go :D

Even though Artemis - Fresh Mix M/L Breed Puppy lists Chicken and Turkey as the first 2 ingredients, once the water is removed (this happens during the rendering process while making the dry food) these two drop in their position significantly.

So the first true ingredients are:

Chicken Meal, Salmon Meal,Pearled Barley, Whole Brown Rice, Oatmeal, Millet, Potatoes, Dried Egg, Tomato Pomace,Chicken Fat

which, ingredient-wise, makes this dry food one of the best ones available in Australia.

It does not mean your dog will go well on it. It just means that potentially your dog can do excellent on it.

Hope that helps

ETA: I feed prey-model diet and am not here to argue "what really is in pet food".

I'm not here to argue either, but I sure would want to know what I'm feeding my dogs.

[Crisovar]

What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'.

Isn't chicken meal and salmon meal just squished whole chickens and whole salmon?

Yes, but the chicken etc. used is of inferior quality

Perhaps but still human grade.

I don't think so. Jump on to google and see what really is in pet food.

Having been inside some Petfood manufacturing plants and having friends in the industry, there is a big difference between the ingredients of the top brands and that of the lower priced brands.

Roadkill and Euthanased animals do not feature in Australian products or in the super premium brands.

If you want to feed organic free range human consumption meats to your pets then that is all well and good, but there is nothing wrong with feeding a good quality processed food if that is what the owner chooses and the dog thrives on.

Chicken feet, chicken necks, carcasses, offal, bones and offcuts are all perfectly acceptable food sources for dogs some of us might feel better feeding them prime cuts, but they don't need them.

[Mas1981]

How does Holistic Select compare to Artemis? I am going to try the Salmon, Sardine and Anchovy meal formula for my boy.

[Oscar (AmBull)]

Thanks for all the responses so far.

We have tried a Raw Diet with him beofre. We had many issues with it. The issue with feeding a full raw diet for us was/is:

Freezer Space

The right ratio's.

Accesibility.

We were unable to get him to eat any organ meats which is essential to a Raw diet I have been told. We also had huge difficuly with the vege part. We bought around $60 worth one day juiced it up and it looked like something out of a baby's nappy, he wouldn't touch it at all. We tried adding it for about a week and it just was not happening. Furthermore, we have had trouble getting certain thing, like fish. We can source Chicken mince and roo mince, that is about it in our area.

I am just not sure what dry food will suit us, we did jump around a lot when he was younger as we were not happy with certain products, however have now been on royal canin for many months.

Some people also talk about CopRice? What is this like in comparison? I am just a little lost in all the food and ingrediants.

Thanks

[Tintin Jac]

We have tried a Raw Diet with him beofre. We had many issues with it. The issue with feeding a full raw diet for us was/is:

Freezer Space

The right ratio's.

Accesibility.

Oscar, that is why I went for the K9 Natural. You can feed it exclusively or in combination with a raw diet. It is raw, freeze dried food. Well, so they say; it smells like roast lamb to me but is apparently raw. The end result for us so far has been very positive.

Good luck. It can be really hard to work out what is best for your dog/s and for you too.

[Mas1981]

Thanks for all the responses so far.

We have tried a Raw Diet with him beofre. We had many issues with it. The issue with feeding a full raw diet for us was/is:

Freezer Space

The right ratio's.

Accesibility.

We were unable to get him to eat any organ meats which is essential to a Raw diet I have been told. We also had huge difficuly with the vege part. We bought around $60 worth one day juiced it up and it looked like something out of a baby's nappy, he wouldn't touch it at all. We tried adding it for about a week and it just was not happening. Furthermore, we have had trouble getting certain thing, like fish. We can source Chicken mince and roo mince, that is about it in our area.

I am just not sure what dry food will suit us, we did jump around a lot when he was younger as we were not happy with certain products, however have now been on royal canin for many months.

Some people also talk about CopRice? What is this like in comparison? I am just a little lost in all the food and ingrediants.

Thanks

I would also love to feed raw but my pup cant tolerate bones, he gets the runs and he vomits and he cant tolerate a lot of fat or rich stuff like marrow, he is alright with roo tail bones so when I can get them he has them.

[dee lee]

I have been using Adult Artemis for a couple of months now and I have to say Im very happy with it. Im about to switch to the Power formula (Honey is very active and its higher in fat) and hope it will be just as good.

I'm a bit bemused about the earlier poo comment though- I find her poos fantastic on it, light, formed and easy to pick up. Her breath is much better and her coat is very soft.

Why is poo turning white a good thing? :cool:

I totally understand your reasoning for using dry food- my freezer is too small too!

I used to feed my last dog (staffyx) mostly raw but as Honey is that much bigger I find the kibble so much easier. And the poos are easier too. :D

[poodlefan]

What I don't like about the dry food you listed is that the 2nd and 3rd ingredients are 'meal'. That could be any rubbish, not to mention the 'flavours'.

Isn't chicken meal and salmon meal just squished whole chickens and whole salmon?

Yes, but the chicken etc. used is of inferior quality

Perhaps but still human grade.

I don't think so. Jump on to google and see what really is in pet food.

Jump onto Google and see what goes into different pet foods. All Artemis meat comes from USDA inspected sources (ie. human grade food and no Chinese imports)

No euthanased pets or road kill in that. :cool:

[whippets]

Poodlefan is right. I did ALOT of research when choosing potential dog food brands. I liked Innova and few others that are out in Australia BUT their importer and distributor also own the company that sell pets, thus I won't support them.

Therefore I use Artemis. It ticks all the boxes as far as: human grade ingredients, quality ingredients and NOT gamma irradiated.

[shells]

I have just switched my 2 to Artemis the main reason being it is wheat free and had a resonable postage rate to Canberra.

My male dog isnt interested in any raw meats except chicken necks or wings so RAW isnt going to work for us plus I am a working mum with 2 small kids and to be honest it is much easier to open a bag and know my dogs are getting a balanced diet instead of stuffing around trying to guess it myself.

They still get chicken necks and wings and I still offer lamb/beef bones. He often just chews on the ones my female is finished with.