Behaviour Change With A New Puppy?

[CollieLover1979]

HI i have a rough collie who is 8 mths old. She is very well behaved and listens to commands. We are looking at getting a playmate for her the same breed. Just a question for anyone that has an older dog and has brought a new puppy into the family did you notice any behaviour changes in your older dog? thanks

[W Sibs]

Aside from being more energetic, happier and is more playful... no, not really.

[wuffles]

My older dog got naughtier when we introduced a puppy. Back to digging holes, pulling the bed out of the kennel, etc. He's also noisier - more barking in play and also at sounds/people.

[CollieLover1979]

Wuffles thats what im afraid of! She is already a digger so afew more i can deal with...

[wuffles]

Wuffles thats what im afraid of! She is already a digger so afew more i can deal with...

And my older dog was 5 years old when we got the puppy

It can go either way. Some dogs calm down or wear themselves out with a playmate and some just turn into double trouble. My older boy is a lovely dog and has taught the younger girl good manners and lets her know that she has to be calm at least some of the time. They are just naughty together. I don't regret getting another dog at all

[koalathebear]

My dog was 8 months old when we got a 3 month old puppy. It has only improved him He has learned to play more - he used to be quite reserved with other dogs, but now he will run around with them and even initiate play, although he'll never be the life of the party.

He's a bit more chilled - when he was an Only Pup, he would shadow us a lot more but after we got Hoover, there will be days he's quite happy to lie on the grass and chill out on his own.

Hoover's a bit of a digger sometimes but it doesn't seem to have made Elbie regress and even Hoover's digging is tapering off. Having the first dog certainly made it easier to toilet-train and teach basic house manners.

Training is great because they watch and learn from the other and you can use competitiveness to motivate the other. Hoover finally learned how to 'stand' on cue because Elbie does it. Sometimes one is crated and watching while the other one is being trained. It's funny when they're not crated though because then you'll end up with two dogs heeling on your left hand side.

I haven't noticed any bad signs from having a second dog. I worried that having two energetic pups would mean that they would play themselves into exhaustion but so far no signs of that. They have short bursts of very intensive play where they chase each other madly around the yard - but then they take a break and laze around for ages, then play begins again. It's handy because they do a lot of self-exercising that way but they also love to go out still.

Also, I think getting the second pup at 3 months made life much easier than 8 weeks ...

ETA: One thing I remember that I did find stressful at the time was the hierarchy. Despite being the younger and smaller puppy, Hoover appeared a lot more assertive and bossy than Elbie. For a while it looked as though he was going to put himself ahead of Elbie and we felt bad for Elbie being pushed down the lines like that. To be honest, it all seems to have sorted itself out and they have a strange understanding - Hoover rushes through doors ahead of Elbie but Elbie initiates play and Hoover defers to and looks to see what Elbie's doing. Hoover's also usually the one who goes up and snuggles with Elbie in the dog bed. They share toys and seem to have figured out their own power dynamics.

Edited March 20, 2011 by koalathebear

[CollieLover1979]

thanks, i might even consider getting an older dog. Im sure WIllow will love having a playmate. Theres no litters in brisbane atm anyway so will have a fair wait.

[dandybrush]

im finding all these replys interesting...as i keep considering then changing my mind on getting a second dog

ktb you sound like you are doing well, did elbie lose any focus on you at all when hoover came along? or did you end up with 2 dogs focusing on you? did hoover ever focus on elbie more than you? i have heard of second dogs bonding more to the first dog than the pple

[Odin-Genie]

I got my second puppy when my first puppy was 6 months old. My first puppy was an extremely boistrous puppy. When my second puppy came, he calmed down significantly within a week. He was more relaxed, less crazy and easier to manage.

We still had to train them separately. But for me, getting the second puppy at that time was the best decision.

[koalathebear]

im finding all these replys interesting...as i keep considering then changing my mind on getting a second dog

ktb you sound like you are doing well, did elbie lose any focus on you at all when hoover came along? or did you end up with 2 dogs focusing on you? did hoover ever focus on elbie more than you? i have heard of second dogs bonding more to the first dog than the pple

Experiences seem to vary a LOT from person to person. I have had an absolutely wonderful experience and don't regret getting Hoover at all but you'll find that there will be a lot of people who haven't been so fortunate. I don't think that there's any universalising possible – you just have to look at your own circumstances and select the second pup on the basis of your current situation.

Just by way of example:

we've had a wonderful experience getting two pups who are five months apart but you'll see in this post that some people have had a less than ideal experience with two pups.

You will see from this post that many people recommend against: (a) getting two males; (b) getting a pup at 3 months (might have missed critical socialisation periods). A lot of what swayed us despite views to the contrary was the breed. A well-bred working line Kelpie will generally be ok with another male. A well-bred working line Kelpie can still have a great temperament even if it's not been widely socialised from a very early age. We spoke with Kelpie-people and also with the breeder and felt pretty comfortable that Hoover would be a good fit – that's why we went with a purebred through a WKC-registered breeder rather than getting a rescue dog. That's why Hoover is totally fine despite only ever having met his litter mates and his breeder's family by the age of 3 months and never having travelled in a car/been off the farm since then.

In terms of your specific questions – Elbie did not lose focus when we got Hoover. I think he wasn't entirely happy at having an interloper at first but he's fine now and seems to love having Hoover around. Elbie is very people-focused so he definitely has bonded with us more.

Hoover adores Elbie and will follow him around and be fascinated by him. He is very much a pesky and adoring younger brother so we made sure we did a lot of work at the start so that he comes when called. They have separate time i.e. we will take one and not the other out on walks/car trips. Sometimes one is in the house and the other is in the yard. We train them separately and also together because we know that some siblings have difficulty concentrating if the other sibling is nearby so we've worked hard at having them trained right near each other so that they don't consider it distracting.

For me the most difficult things about having two dogs was:

• High value items like bones – we have to tether them a distance apart to feed them bones/lamb flaps because we want to avoid any conflict/disagreement
  
• Watching them sort out hierarchy and dynamics – I felt quite guilty for taking away Elbie's 'spoiled only dog' position, but honestly it's fine now – they adore each other and have so much fun
  
• Walking. They're walked separately because I want them both walking nicely on a loose leash before I try to walk them
  

together.

Hope that helps

[dandybrush]

thanks ktb, very helpful

[SmoothieGirl]

Personally I would almost always wait until my older dogs are 18 mths or older before I introduce a new pup, its ensures their training is really well established and they have moved far away from their teen troubles so are less easily influenced by puppy hi-jinx.

The timing of Ren was just perfect. I got the pup I wanted, from my chosen bitch and luckily it all landed that he came home at exactly the time of year I wanted. This meant Bronte was nearly 2 when he came home. Collies are fast maturing though, so they are probably easier to mix with pups. I always say that Bronte was never a puppy, she was born with an adult attitude, but that may be down to our constant involvement in training for dog sports of some kind.

She plays a lot more now that Ren is in the household and her hearing is a bit more selective than before he arrived, other than that she hasn't really changed much. He has learnt many subtle house rules from observing and copying her, which has been very useful. I'm not sure that a teenage pup would have that level of influence over a baby pup though, it may actually regress their training a bit if they feed off each other.

Given the breed though I don't imagine you will have any huge issues, but you'll have to be prepared to control the mania though, there are definitely periods of that, but that's why we love them.

Edit - Ren showed early signs of resource guarding his food not from me, but from Bronte. I quickly got some advice from my trainer and now I have two dogs that are fed next to each other happily, with rules about when they can approach their bowls and each other. They also behave nicely when they have chew treats, although this is something I will continue to supervise until he has fully matured.

Edited March 22, 2011 by SmoothieGirl