rajacadoo Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I have just started my Basenji's on Kelp... I feed it at night, mixed in with their dry, and whatever other things they are getting, (i.e. sardines, chicken mince, offal, yoghurt etc, etc), and I have noticed that when I put the boiled water on the kelp, and mix it around, it goes all gelatinous... Is this normal ??? The dogs dont seem to mind at all. I was just wondering if others have this problem ??? Another question I have is, I have also started them on Livermol as well, (alternating Kelp one night, Livermol the next), and in the ingredients it has Fish Oil. I give them a fish oil capsule every second or so night. It doesnt mention the amount, but its the 4th listed ingredient, out of 5 ingredients. Just wondering if I should stop the capsules ??? I also give them Vit E about twice a week as well, on advice from here :) ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajacadoo Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 No-one uses kelp ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben and Jerry Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I don't feed my guy kelp but we have some at work I can test tomorrow if no one is able to tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawksdale Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I use Kelp but I mix it in with the BARF mix when I make it up..haven't noticed that it changes in anyway. The only thing that changes is the Chia Seed, it goes like frog sporn when it gets wet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 seaweed is the natural source of Agar ... which is a vegetarian version of gelatine. It's normal to turn goopy especially when you soak it in boiling water. Just pour lukewarm over it as high temperatures destroy valuable nutrition. What dry are you feeding that you need to add so many supplements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I was under the impression that an overuse of kelp affects the thyroid? I could be wrong but I thought I read that somewhere. Agree with Nekhbet. Yoghurt is good, not sure why you need to give kelp if dry is the large percentage of the diet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajacadoo Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 Thanks for the responses :) ... The reason Im feeding both of these things, is because I am struggling to get my guys coats back to the correct rich reddy orange colour that the breed standard calls for. Over the last 6 months I have had issues with their coats, i.e. dead coat particularly around the neck, pale seedy looking red coat etc, etc. Prior to that, I was proud as punch with their colour. I have asked a few breeders if they uses anything to help this colour and in particular the breeder of 3 of my dogs, and this is what she has her dogs on, and has so for years. Her dogs often win Best Red/Tri colour at Specialties, as does a lot of her exports all over the world... Staff'n'Toller Basenji's are prone to Hypothyroid, I will do some more research into using the kelp, and in fact I may stop using it, till I have my answers. May even flick Jean Dodds an email as well... Thanks for the offer Ben and Jerry, I think that Nekhbet has answered why the seaweed meal is going all goopy. I did wonder if by using the boiling water I was possibly destroying the 'goodness' of both products, so I might stop that. The reason I was doing that, was to 'melt' the Fish Oil capsule... The dry that Im using can be anything, Bonnie, Supercoat, Royal Canin, depending on whats on special at the produce store. We are very limited in what dry is available down here in Tas. They would only get a very small childs handful of dry, in the morning, and probably an adults handful at night... The rest is the other 'goodies' mentioned in my first post... Thanks for the info, off to do some more research, methinks ;) ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 The diets too chip chop. Seaweed is a great source of iodine, so unless the OPs feeding cups of it there shouldn't be a problem. By the way seaweed browns the coat ;) I gave my Dogue seaweed meal for a while and he went a dark brown instead of a rich red, whereas the Livamol is bringing out the red tones in my Dogue and Malinois bitch. I wouldn't bother with the dry food since it's just filler most of the time (eg supercoat, Bonnie etc) and that can dry the coat out despite all you additives. And if you want a definite coat booster try the Ethical Nutrients High Strength Liquid Fish Oil, you only need under half a cap per Basenji. If they can't cope with a rich diet as yet at least a little boiled rice/veges added to their protein source. Conversely if you want guaranteed nutrition in a home made diet at least get something like the VAN health booster powder and add it to your dogs diet. I don't know how your dogs go with red meat but give them a little of that every now and again instead of dry, the iron source looks a little lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) You may not want the advice then, seems like you know what you're doing. The cheaper dry foods are renown for causing dry, scurfy, dull coats though. Again I would agree with Nekhbet, do only barf or only dry- I think you'll see a big improvement. This is actually my Staffy girl on Royal Canin Hypoallergenic- fish oil with balanced EPA/DHA that helps create a good skin barrier. She is 11 there - wouldn't know she had liver cancer would you? :) Edited February 3, 2012 by Staff'n'Toller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 wow staff n toller she looks absolutely incredible! I wish more people could realise thats what a healthy coat looks like especially on SBTs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dog geek Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) Hooly dooley, S&T - you must be so thrilled and relieved with your girl, she looks amazing. No - I would NOT have guessed she had any disorder or illness at all! Rajacadoo, if you purchase flax/linseed seeds (same thing, two different but common names) and grind it fresh before adding it to wet food you will increase the red tones in the hair. This works in a range of animals - Palomino owners avoid it because darkens the horses' coats; and personally, I have given it to a pale red Saluki and within four months he had a richer colour. Oh - and how is this for funny: of my two sons, one is a strawberry red head, the other is a dirty blonde. They both consumed huge quantities of a soya and linseed cracker for a couple of years, and the dirty blonde boy had hair that was so gingery, people used to say he was a redhead, too, like his brother. I knew he was not a redhead, and would explain about the linseed crackers (he is Aspergers, and fixates on a particular texture/taste to the exclusion of all but literally one or two other foods) changing his hair colour... and people would look at me like I was crazy. So I have to admit to now feeling smug and vindicated - the company stopped making the crackers (actually, they continued to make the crackers in that flavour - but they CHANGED THE SHAPE !!! AND BEGAN COOKING THEM FOR LONGER!!!! UNTIL THEY THEY WERE A DIFFERENT COLOUR !!!) and so for the last year and a half my son has had no linseed in his diet. And he no longer has even a tinge of ginge. :D So, there is my opinion, supported by experiences in two different species. Edited February 3, 2012 by dog geek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Kelp has not just iodine, but a host of other trace minerals that may be lacking in diet, including copper, cobalt, zinc and selenium among others. Trace minerals can be lacking in commercially grown foods, whether grains, veges or meats. Copper in particular is frequently linked to coat fade or lack of colour. Dark haired animals (and humans!) have been shown in some studies to require up to 6 times the dietary trace copper of pale haired or fair ones. Lack of iodine will cause thyroid issues, scurf/dandruff and problems with estrus, or if breeding, a lack of female offspring, who either are not conceived, or born dying and hairless. Excess dietary iodine has the same signs as not enough, but if yours have not had iodine supplement previous this is very unlikely. I feed seaweed meal to my dogs. When I had goats and horses it was offered to them free choice. In your situation I would feed the Seaweed meal three times a week about a half teaspoon for a Basenji, the Livamol two or three nights and have a night or two with none. Iodine is used up faster in cold weather and a little mire seaweed meal at these times is usually good. The only worry I have with too much Livamol long term is the sugar levels and teeth etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rajacadoo Posted February 4, 2012 Author Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Thank you sooo much everybody, you have all give me a lot to think about, and research. At the moment I have stopped the kelp, until I have a chance to research and contact Jean Dodds... I will do the Livermol evey second night and I will also look into flax/linseeds, thanks to dog geek's info... Dog geek is the seeds I want, or can I use oil, (I think you can flax/linseed oil) ??? Really interesting about your son's hair colour change, really interesting :) ... Alyosha I too wondered about the very high sugar level, with Molasses, (?sp?), being the main ingredient... More research needed... Also very interesting about the lack of iodine also causing dandruff/scurf, because all 4 Basenji's have dandruff in spades. I have tried to get rid of it, with no success at all, and had put it down to them all wearing their coats a lot, due to the climate, (Im in Tassie), and also cos 'I think' they are cold, so they do wear them, probably more than they actually need ... S'n'T your girl's colouring is exactly what I want in my B's... She is gorgeous, and no you most certainly wouldnt know she was 11, and had liver cancer... Huge congrats to you, shes looks sensational ... Nek, I want to eventually change all my dogs onto raw, but firstly I need a big freezer, and it is another thing I need to do tons more research on :) ... Need more hours in the day !!! I will lookinto the Fish Oil you have mentioned as well... ETA needed to make sentences make sense... Edited February 4, 2012 by rajacadoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I was speaking to Dr Bruce Symes the other day and he recommended flax seed oil over fish oil as you need a lot less for the same results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Funnily enough. my boss has always stocked the VAN flax seed oil in the fridge at our clinic. :) Unfortunately for most clients with dogs with itchy/bad skin, they are non-compliant and don't return for another bottle to give it a good chance to work. Err..I meant to say in the other post that poodlefan had a good barf mix - I think it's at the top of nutrition in the stickes somewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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