The Project, Tonight.

[Guest lavendergirl]

According to whom?

C'mon - ask a person on the street if a puppy farm is a good or bad thing and what answer do you think you will get??

A question which doesn't provide the answer as to what the general public thinks a puppy farm is.

This is Steve's comment I was responding to:

"a puppy farmer is someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions"

I said that the general public thinks that is what a puppy farm is.

I don't know if you ever talk to the average person but there is a widespread belief that description is accurate.

And again, according to whom? People you speak to in the street? This directly contradicts my people in the street who simply consider a puppyfarm as a commercial enterprise. No conditions mentioned.

Well the people in your street must live in cloud cuckoo land to not have heard about all the appalling puppy farm stories is all I can say to that :laugh:

[Steve]

No offence to anyone who supports it but I think Oscars Flaw used to stand for something but now it is just full of crackpots who would abolish the breeding of any and every animal on the planet if they were allowed to.

[Sheridan]

1348556370[/url]' post='5967276']

1348553560[/url]' post='5967214']

1348549433[/url]' post='5967169']

1348544664[/url]' post='5967103']

1348538237[/url]' post='5967033']

1348536312[/url]' post='5967009']

According to whom?

C'mon - ask a person on the street if a puppy farm is a good or bad thing and what answer do you think you will get??

A question which doesn't provide the answer as to what the general public thinks a puppy farm is.

This is Steve's comment I was responding to:

"a puppy farmer is someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions"

I said that the general public thinks that is what a puppy farm is.

I don't know if you ever talk to the average person but there is a widespread belief that description is accurate.

And again, according to whom? People you speak to in the street? This directly contradicts my people in the street who simply consider a puppyfarm as a commercial enterprise. No conditions mentioned.

Well the people in your street must live in cloud cuckoo land to not have heard about all the appalling puppy farm stories is all I can say to that :laugh:

Where did I say that they hadn't heard of appalling puppy farm stories? I'm looking back through the thread and I can't see where I have posted anything even remotely like what you have claimed. Please advise where I have posted this.

[Guest lavendergirl]

1348556370[/url]' post='5967276']

1348553560[/url]' post='5967214']

1348549433[/url]' post='5967169']

1348544664[/url]' post='5967103']

1348538237[/url]' post='5967033']

1348536312[/url]' post='5967009']

According to whom?

C'mon - ask a person on the street if a puppy farm is a good or bad thing and what answer do you think you will get??

A question which doesn't provide the answer as to what the general public thinks a puppy farm is.

This is Steve's comment I was responding to:

"a puppy farmer is someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions"

I said that the general public thinks that is what a puppy farm is.

I don't know if you ever talk to the average person but there is a widespread belief that description is accurate.

And again, according to whom? People you speak to in the street? This directly contradicts my people in the street who simply consider a puppyfarm as a commercial enterprise. No conditions mentioned.

Well the people in your street must live in cloud cuckoo land to not have heard about all the appalling puppy farm stories is all I can say to that :laugh:

Where did I say that they hadn't heard of appalling puppy farm stories? I'm looking back through the thread and I can't see where I have posted anything even remotely like what you have claimed. Please advise where I have posted this.

Oh forget it and take a chill pill for God's sake.

[Sheridan]

1348573542[/url]' post='5967655']

1348570170[/url]' post='5967554']

1348556370[/url]' post='5967276']

1348553560[/url]' post='5967214']

1348549433[/url]' post='5967169']

1348544664[/url]' post='5967103']

1348538237[/url]' post='5967033']

1348536312[/url]' post='5967009']

According to whom?

C'mon - ask a person on the street if a puppy farm is a good or bad thing and what answer do you think you will get??

A question which doesn't provide the answer as to what the general public thinks a puppy farm is.

This is Steve's comment I was responding to:

"a puppy farmer is someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions"

I said that the general public thinks that is what a puppy farm is.

I don't know if you ever talk to the average person but there is a widespread belief that description is accurate.

And again, according to whom? People you speak to in the street? This directly contradicts my people in the street who simply consider a puppyfarm as a commercial enterprise. No conditions mentioned.

Well the people in your street must live in cloud cuckoo land to not have heard about all the appalling puppy farm stories is all I can say to that :laugh:

Where did I say that they hadn't heard of appalling puppy farm stories? I'm looking back through the thread and I can't see where I have posted anything even remotely like what you have claimed. Please advise where I have posted this.

Oh forget it and take a chill pill for God's sake.

Ah, the response that says 'I can't justify my bullshit.' Just as I thought. Typical.

[Guest lavendergirl]

1348573542[/url]' post='5967655']

1348570170[/url]' post='5967554']

1348556370[/url]' post='5967276']

1348553560[/url]' post='5967214']

1348549433[/url]' post='5967169']

1348544664[/url]' post='5967103']

1348538237[/url]' post='5967033']

1348536312[/url]' post='5967009']

According to whom?

C'mon - ask a person on the street if a puppy farm is a good or bad thing and what answer do you think you will get??

A question which doesn't provide the answer as to what the general public thinks a puppy farm is.

This is Steve's comment I was responding to:

"a puppy farmer is someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions"

I said that the general public thinks that is what a puppy farm is.

I don't know if you ever talk to the average person but there is a widespread belief that description is accurate.

And again, according to whom? People you speak to in the street? This directly contradicts my people in the street who simply consider a puppyfarm as a commercial enterprise. No conditions mentioned.

Well the people in your street must live in cloud cuckoo land to not have heard about all the appalling puppy farm stories is all I can say to that :laugh:

Where did I say that they hadn't heard of appalling puppy farm stories? I'm looking back through the thread and I can't see where I have posted anything even remotely like what you have claimed. Please advise where I have posted this.

Oh forget it and take a chill pill for God's sake.

Ah, the response that says 'I can't justify my bullshit.' Just as I thought. Typical.

No it just says you are an incredible bore and I can't be bothered with your "bullshit"

[Sheridan]

To state it quite clearly, lavendergirl cannot justify that the 'general public' believes that "a puppy farmer is someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions".

She has been asked 'according to whom' and will not answer it.

She chose to attack me instead.

[asal]

However, calling for changes to puppy farms ends up ensuring new laws actually benefit and advantage commercial breeders over small hobby breeders .

Someone breeding commercially is different to someone who is breeding in sub standard conditions unless they are also breeding in substandard conditions. Standard conditions are those which were determined by regs and laws which make it easier to breed large numbers commercially and make it difficult for small breeders to comply. They are standards which small breeders dont want to have to comply with. How will you determine who is breeding commercially? Is there a magic number 5? 10? 20? 50? or is it if they say they are breeding for nothing more than money? Maybe its if they are not breeding registered dogs or perhaps if they dont show their dogs. When you run off small breeders you leave a greater demand for commercial breeders and the situation gets worse not better for the dogs.

2 weeks ago I spoke with a registered breeder who has 10 dogs of a Toy breed. They are a very laid back breed and do better living inside the home as part of the family .The breeder lives on a large property out in the boonies and her dogs sleep inside and run free all day but council have said she needs a DA to be able to breed her dogs and in order to comply she needs to build a concreted area and house her dogs there in order to comply and be within the standards. Her choices are desex all of her dogs - she is able to have her dogs living inside as long as they are not fertile or Sell all of her dogs and give up breeding or comply with the order , spend 35,000 dollars to do so even though she knows its not in her dog's best interest . If she spends $35000 to set the place up and keep her dogs in what she considers to be substandard but will be standard according to the laws isnt she more tempted to breed more puppies to cover her expenses?

i know another breeder who has a concreted area all set up and her dogs have never been in it as they live in her house because she believes its not good for the dogs to live in regulation standard conditions - not many breeders who are not breeding commercially have that kind of money to throw around without any hope of ever having anything to show for it.

Its not as easy as it all sounds and there are unintended consequences when changes are advocated without all of the required knowledge.

exactly, I chucked it in when some one reported me last month for transporting my dogs in the back of my station waggon in " tiny boxes which looked like they lived in them permanantly" yes, the inspector was very nice and agreed that the airline accredited carry cages were perfectly adequate for transportation and the fact they were now stacked with the hay and not a single dog in residence let alone near them satified her they were not being mistreated after all.

interestingly all a complainant needs is to give them your number plate and look out.

she kindly gave me a copy of the new u beaut conditions under which you are only allowed to breed now.

since I do not even have air conditioning for myself let alone my dogs that is the end of me as a breeder. so ive surrendered all but my few pets.

I simply cant risk another stringy incident, not fair to my hubbie knowing you can be slugged a minimum of the 500 per dog for "health" tests even if theres nothing wrong with it. heaven help you it it has dirty teeth or and ear infection you would be facing bankruptcy.

so Im outa it.

You better be aware of how dangerous financially it can be to have them and thus attract the possible costs attached as I learned with Stringy.