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Prey Drive Control & Focus..


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How about, in case someone needs to search it later, we have a topic for this subject..?

I use prey drive for a lot of obedience, sport & bitework, it's a high energy drive that can, in the right dog, be channeled very effectively to gain outstanding results.

The requirements are good nerves, good prey drive & very little in the way of fear based issues...

Training in drive isnt for couch potatoes be it people or dogs, it takes a lot of physical activity & you have to be committed to carry out the complete program if you want complete results.

There have been many questions on this, so lets talk about it here.

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Ok i stuffed up and need help SEX drive is a powerful distraction my male entire sheltie has hit sevn months and has suddenly become a sex machine i had noticed a chenge in him in the last couple of weeks not as playful seemed quiet put it down to the weather took him to my sisters to play with the one dog he is allowed to play with all he wanted to do was hump diddy hump.

Well today we went to the park me armed with ideas of working him a distance from her shebeing a distraction well he was on a long line but do you think i could even get him to lok at a piece of food and as i said in the other thread we are still building prey drive at home he was so focussed on her all he wanted was to get to her my sister not realising this came within reach he hit the end of the long line grabbed her and hunp diddy hump so i took him away decided to leave it too hard basket and we did our walk .

Now i havent taken him out with other dogs to know if he has generalised any behaviour i dont want a hanit forming he is banned from seeing her till i have this sorted is this just a passing phase that boys go through or could it become an issue

Also in the other thread i explained why i want good prey drive to get animation and speed on trial work so what should i do to get the prey drive wehn out of the house should i restrict access to any other form of drive satisfaction till the prey drive is stronger no food trianing for the time being was thinking of getting him a toy for humping then using that as a prey toy as well double bonus lol seriously what do i do now

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YB:

Ok i stuffed up and need help SEX drive is a powerful distraction my male entire sheltie has hit sevn months and has suddenly become a sex machine i had noticed a chenge in him in the last couple of weeks not as playful seemed quiet put it down to the weather took him to my sisters to play with the one dog he is allowed to play with all he wanted to do was hump diddy hump.

K9: turn on the tv, stops most guys, (no not me! lol)

You know if you do nothing he will settle down right, he will see that not every dog can be mated & start only reactin on scent (provided this is not a rank issue...)

YB:

Well today we went to the park me armed with ideas of working him a distance from her shebeing a distraction well he was on a long line but do you think i could even get him to lok at a piece of food and as i said in the other thread we are still building prey drive at home he was so focussed on her all he wanted was to get to her my sister not realising this came within reach he hit the end of the long line grabbed her and hunp diddy hump so i took him away decided to leave it too hard basket and we did our walk .

K9: its a known factor that to reduce / extinguish drive, you add a correction..

YB:

seriously what do i do now

K9: 1. develop drive on tie out with toy, remove other toys from his daily routine.

3 times a day, 3 minutes a time, 7 days per week, he will be dying for it..

Then remove tie out & tease him with the ball, tug etc, teach him sit in drive down in drive then heel.

Then add distraction of the street.

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lol like the tv idea but if its a nature documentary he might get more ideas.

So you think this is a noraml phase and just not allowing him to interact with her will settle him down nah i dont think its a rank thing he usually very respectful of what want him to do this has happened kinda suddenly and i figured hormone surge thats what it seems to be and not having undexed male dogs before i just need to hear it from someone else .

Ok we have the no toy at home thing have done that from early on. we have great prey drive at home he will do anyhitng to get his toy but once out he switches of it so do i tether him and tease him with it out the front till im getting a response as we did at home in the back yard

or should i make him work harder to win the toy at home maybe that will make it more desirable

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Yay, a question and answer session with the King of Drive. :(

K9, can I ask a question I've been wondering about?

Is it true that a dog can only be at one drive at the same time? (Like, if he's in prey, he can't be in fight drive, etc. Or if he's in food drive, he can't simulatneously be in prey drive.) Or can a dog sometimes be in different drives at the same time?

I have been wondering about this since an incident about a month ago. I was playing with my dog at a park, we were playing retrieve and he was very focused on his toy. A strange dog suddenly ran round the corner (no owner) and before I could intercept it, it started sniffing and bumping and crowding my dog.

Normally, my dog would have whirled round and taught this dog a good lesson, but in this case I was able to keep his attention almost entirely on me till the owner came to collect the rude dog. My boy was so focused on the stick that he totally ignored the new dog, just waited for me to throw. I assumed that was because he was in prey drive, so he wasn't interested in pulling rank on the new dog.

Am I right, or just confused? :eek:

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Just to add this is what i did to build his prey drive i started with him on a tie out at hoome teasing him with the toy and letting him get it now and again i only did it twice a aday but at the end of a week he was desperate for the toy and would really grab at it as ssoon as it was produced.

then i got rid of the tie out and did as you say teased him with the toy and over the next few weeks started asking for things to get the toy as a reward he will fetch and tug with the toy. In the meantime i was using food to teach things and when out i was using food only to work on stuff as he had no desire to play with a toy we have been working on this for a couple of months now and i still cant get him in prey drive anywhere but home so im missing something

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I am tingling already!!!

I could type and type and type what I love about training in drive, but will not bore you all, or ramble on into confusing myself, LOL.

I think the reason the higher prey drive a dog has, the better they focus and the faster they are easier to control, is because dogs are PURE AND SIMPLY are self satisfying.

They do what suits them - then we manipulate them to work for us.

Just like wolves and other animals, I suppose, when they work/hunt in a pack/together.

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I agree Ll I know my gsp who had very high drive had been a pain for several previous owners becasue they didnt channel it when i got her she soon learnt that to satisfy her drive she needed to do what i asked she was such an easy dog to trqain because she wanted what i had and knew there was one way to get it the more you with held it the harder shed work for it.

yb

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LL, Please do go on and on, this is a subject I'd like to know much more about!

My Rotti works in drive, ut gets so het up she bark and carries on. How do I get her to stop, without correcting her and therefore diminishing her drive?

Also she has just had a second cruciate ligament surgery and the vets said no more playing will balls (which is akin to telling her not to breathe in and out really). Is a tug an acceptable substitute?

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YB:

So you think this is a noraml phase and just not allowing him to interact with her will settle him down nah i dont think its a rank thing he usually very respectful of what want him to do this has happened kinda suddenly and i figured hormone surge thats what it seems to be and not having undexed male dogs before i just need to hear it from someone else .

K9: lol, when I said rank issue, I meant with your sisters dog, thats the one he is humping, right? lol. Not you.

Yes he will settle down, he has worked out a new trick & will play with it for aq while, its a boy thing.

YB:

Ok we have the no toy at home thing have done that from early on. we have great prey drive at home he will do anyhitng to get his toy but once out he switches of it so do i tether him and tease him with it out the front till im getting a response as we did at home in the back yard

or should i make him work harder to win the toy at home maybe that will make it more desirable

K9: you have to elevate the drive, so it will fly outside. So more intense drive work at home, then start the game & heel him into the front yrad, then drive satisfaction, then down the street until the light goes off that the environment is of no importance, you of course need a turn on command...

****************************************

yb:

Yay, a question and answer session with the King of Drive

K9: excellent, I can ask a few lol...

A:

Is it true that a dog can only be at one drive at the same time? (Like, if he's in prey, he can't be in fight drive, etc. Or if he's in food drive, he can't simulatneously be in prey drive.) Or can a dog sometimes be in different drives at the same time?

K9": I feel that dogs have drive overlap, but find it hard to be in a negative & positive frame of mind at one time.

I believe that guard drive is a mix of defence & rank drives..

A:

Normally, my dog would have whirled round and taught this dog a good lesson, but in this case I was able to keep his attention almost entirely on me till the owner came to collect the rude dog. My boy was so focused on the stick that he totally ignored the new dog, just waited for me to throw. I assumed that was because he was in prey drive, so he wasn't interested in pulling rank on the new dog.

Am I right, or just confused?

K9: I would say the focus your dog had in prey stopped him from seeing the other dog as a trigger to rank drive.

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LL:

I am tingling already!!!

K9: I will wave the topic around in front of you until you vibrate!

H:

My Rotti works in drive, ut gets so het up she bark and carries on. How do I get her to stop, without correcting her and therefore diminishing her drive?

K9: your on the threshold of getting there, this intensirty is good, just the dog is unfocussed.

You need to put a lot of movement into the prey item, then if the dog starts to bark, slow down, start reducing movement, this is not what the dog wants, so bark will stop, then start again & as you work up in drive, give a sit command, have the dog sit in drive & imm issue the item...

Is a tug an acceptable substitute?

K9: I use, ball on string for exp dog, bite roll, small roll for new dog...

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She's not new to it, she's done bite work before but I'm new to it.

I don't even need a prey item, all it takes is a command, eg, sit, drop etc in the right tone and she's there.

ETA: Actually that could account for the barking, right? As barking was part of the work?

Edited by haven
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H:

She's not new to it, she's done bite work before but I'm new to it.

I don't even need a prey item, all it takes is a command, eg, sit, drop etc in the right tone and she's there.

ETA: Actually that could account for the barking, right? As barking was part of the work?

K9: fofl, see how easy it is to answer your own questions? lol, thats exactly the reason.

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YOUR THOUGHTS K9...

I notice that you mention the following drives in various threads:

prey

food

play

In my learnings about drives, there are only 3 drives being, pack, prey and defence. Of these 3, stem the anthropomorphistic descriptions such as "food", "play", "chase", "fight" etc.

Also, my belief is that a dog cannot be in two drives at once therefore the dog is constantly switching. These switches/changes in drive can be extremely subtle and we may or may not see them occur. However, the last ever drive that the dog will switch to is pack drive, before defence and before that, prey.

I'd like to hear your comments on these.

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K:

In my learnings about drives, there are only 3 drives being, pack, prey and defence. Of these 3, stem the anthropomorphistic descriptions such as "food", "play", "chase", "fight" etc.

K9: in very basic terms some people limit drives to those, many trainers like myself who have spent a long times working in drive recognose the traits of other drives.

K:

Also, my belief is that a dog cannot be in two drives at once therefore the dog is constantly switching.

K9: using my eg of guard drive from earlier, its a mix of defence & rank.

You have a dog that will bark at people when at home or in your car, but no other time, this is because his rank drive is deminished when his confidence is not there... the defence drive may be there but rank is gone...

Fight drive (not fight behaviour) is a mix of prey, defence, experience & nerves all wound into one.

Many people use food in what I deem an exchange program, sit & in turn I will give you one piece of food.

I make drive with food & this raises adrenalin in the dog, it means the dog "has drive" for the food.

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K9: Pack drive is the desire for emotional contact with the other pack members.

I use a fair amount of pack drive to train other peoples dogs, not so much use it to begin training, but recognise it when it comes alive.

When I see the dog start to go into pack drive for me, I know that it is gaining respect for me, desires emotional response from me.

Its when I see that I have this I move on. It's the secret little reason all these people keep telling me how much their dogs love me...

I try not to start off using any motivators such as food or toys until I have pack drive, I get this via consistency, fairness & praise when the dog gets it right.

Once I have pack, it makes it easier to share my toys of my food with the dog... in the dogs mind anyway..

Does that make sense to people?

Edited by K9 Force
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K9: Pack drive is the desire for emotional contact with the other pack members.

lol I expected it to be a bit more complicated than that. When you aske me in the other thread about how my dogs pack drive was I wan't sure how to answer.

You have a dog that will bark at people when at home or in your car, but no other time, this is because his rank drive is deminished when his confidence is not there... the defence drive may be there but rank is gone...

Loki does this and very well I might add! I wondered if working on this would be good for his confidence, but I fear that if he learns that is they way to deal with issues outside the home, it will be like opening the floodgates to fear aggression, which he has never shown before. I've been 'lucky' in that respect because if he were a fear biter he would be an extremely dangerous dog :rolleyes:

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