Steve

Yep and put more focus on it.

Actually I think the complaint is they are on concrete all their lives - there is a conversation going on about this in the news section.

I'm not a supporter of Oscar's Law and I've given my reasons here and elsewhere several times. I'm also about convinced that the battle against puppy farming is probably lost. But as a rescuer I am angry that the PM should choose to ignore the 250,000 companion animals which die in Australia every year, and choose to buy a dog over the internet like an item of luggage. It's not the mutt thing I mind, it's the complete disregard of the work of rescue and everyone trying to save some of those lives. Had she chosen to go the rescue route it would have been such a boost for rescue animals. I'm so disappointed. O.K. I get it but I would never go a rescue route either and I buy my animals over the net and I sell them via the net - not like they are a piece of luggage but unless he was going to buy via a local recue how else is he supposed to source a breeder of any breed ? We need to stop and see how this looks from the outside - you are passionate about dogs dying in pounds and rescue and so am I but not enough to bring one into my family and lots of people arent - looks like the PM is one of them. No matter what breed she chose she was going to cop it from someone and if she chose a rescue dog there would as miny if not more against her than there are now - but at the end of the day it has to be one person's choice based on what they think will best suit them .

Or perhaps they are going on what the RSPCA australia call a puppy farm and not what rednecks call a puppy farm.

Thanks guys we have several of you who have said you could give a hand so far The more the merrier.

seems there are two issues here - the breed and where it came from. Doesnt bother me one bit if they chose to get a cross bred mutt and a puppy I dont see that as anything they need to answer for. After all better than anyone they should know its a free country and you get to have choices which is really the point to all of those yelling about how cross bred breeders should be stopped. I dont see it as a failure for registered breeders or rescue because they chose a mutt. I do however, see it as a signal that OL is seen as a bunch of rednecks who have no credibility - and Im still getting over the fact that Tranter has had to move 3 times in 12 months because she is worried about someone coming onto her property and threatening her dogs. Considering her undercover work and the theft of dogs from other properties it all seems like a bit of a joke to me. People on either side who are jumping up and down and beating a drum about her choosing a mutt are at risk of looking like fanatics and the game is lost.

Why is it that our PM buying a DD is a big failure for Oscars law in particular? It is a slap in the face for registered breeders and rescue. It also highlights the scale of the DD problem. I would say more so for Oscars Law - this is one of the farms they have targeted and written about as examples of what they are fighting. Sorry Steve I disagree. Register breeders and rescue orgs have been around for a lot longer than Oscars Law. We cant seem to be able to tackle the PF'ing issues either. Why do we expect OL to reslove all the issues overnight? It can take years to close down a hideous and proven inhumane PF even when the RSPCA are involved. I dont expect OL to resolve things over night and the way they are going the only thing they will change is any progress anyone else is making. This is not a proven inhumane puppy farm at all and that is the whole point - apart from the obvious breed issues it is the selection of this particular breeder which is a slap in the face for OL because from what I can see they are the only ones who have said it is inhumane.

Why is it that our PM buying a DD is a big failure for Oscars law in particular? It is a slap in the face for registered breeders and rescue. It also highlights the scale of the DD problem. I would say more so for Oscars Law - this is one of the farms they have targeted and written about as examples of what they are fighting.

Because we have changed the way we are judging the Dog Owners Choice Awards we need a team of people from all areas of the dog world who are able to have a go at judging a couple of categories for us. This way we can be sure to keep it all as fair as possible and allocate people to judge categories they are unlikely to have had dealings with and the only criteria is that you need to own a dog. Each nominee this year is given the opportunity to add to their nomination to strutt their stuff and tell us about themselves. You will be asked to look at the nomination and the added information supplied by each one and judge which one you think is best suited to taking out the award. We are aiming for 5 judges in each category so depending on how many of you put up your hand will determine how many categories you will need to judge each. You will be asked to sign a confidentiality agreement and those who are judging won’t be told who else is judging the category you are until after judging is completed and we have a winner to cut down any chance judges can talk to each other about who they are choosing. I can’t leave this open for long as it’s going to take a bit to slot you all in and get it all organised as judging needs to be completed by around the end of January. – so applications for judging close on 14/10/11. Please apply telling us a bit about what you do with your dog and what groups you belong to. depending on how many of you would like to have a go we will work something out to say thank you [email protected]

Because we have changed the way we are judging the Dog Owners Choice Awards we need a team of people from all areas of the dog world who are able to have a go at judging a couple of categories for us. This way we can be sure to keep it all as fair as possible and allocate people to judge categories they are unlikely to have had dealings with and the only criteria is that you need to own a dog. Each nominee this year is given the opportunity to add to their nomination to strutt their stuff and tell us about themselves. You will be asked to look at the nomination and the added information supplied by each one and judge which one you think is best suited to taking out the award. We are aiming for 5 judges in each category so depending on how many of you put up your hand will determine how many categories you will need to judge each. You will be asked to sign a confidentiality agreement and those who are judging won’t be told who else is judging the category you are until after judging is completed and we have a winner to cut down any chance judges can talk to each other about who they are choosing. I can’t leave this open for long as it’s going to take a bit to slot you all in and get it all organised as judging needs to be completed by around the end of January. – so applications for judging close on 14/10/11. Please apply telling us a bit about what you do with your dog and what groups you belong to. Depending on how many we get of you to have a go we will work out a way to say thank you. [email protected]

Because we have changed the way we are judging the Dog Owners Choice Awards we need a team of people from all areas of the dog world who are able to have a go at judging a couple of categories for us. This way we can be sure to keep it all as fair as possible and allocate people to judge categories they are unlikely to have had dealings with and the only criteria is that you need to own a dog. Each nominee this year is given the opportunity to add to their nomination to strutt their stuff and tell us about themselves. You will be asked to look at the nomination and the added information supplied by each one and judge which one you think is best suited to taking out the award. We are aiming for 5 judges in each category so depending on how many of you put up your hand will determine how many categories you will need to judge each. You will be asked to sign a confidentiality agreement and those who are judging won’t be told who else is judging the category you are until after judging is completed and we have a winner to cut down any chance judges can talk to each other about who they are choosing. I can’t leave this open for long as it’s going to take a bit to slot you all in and get it all organised as judging needs to be completed by around the end of January. – so applications for judging close on 14/10/11. Please apply telling us a bit about what you do with your dog and what groups you belong to. [email protected]

Because we have changed the way we are judging the Dog Owners Choice Awards we need a team of people from all areas of the dog world who are able to have a go at judging a couple of categories for us. This way we can be sure to keep it all as fair as possible and allocate people to judge categories they are unlikely to have had dealings with and the only criteria is that you need to own a dog. Each nominee this year is given the opportunity to add to their nomination to strutt their stuff and tell us about themselves. You will be asked to look at the nomination and the added information supplied by each one and judge which one you think is best suited to taking out the award. We are aiming for 5 judges in each category so depending on how many of you put up your hand will determine how many categories you will need to judge each. You will be asked to sign a confidentiality agreement and those who are judging won’t be told who else is judging the category you are until after judging is completed and we have a winner to cut down any chance judges can talk to each other about who they are choosing. I can’t leave this open for long as it’s going to take a bit to slot you all in and get it all organised as judging needs to be completed by around the end of January. – so applications for judging close on 14/10/11. Please apply telling us a bit about what you do with your dog and what groups you belong to. depending on how many of you come in we will work something out to say thank you. [email protected]

Just write in that box unknown and when I ring them I will ask for it but I have to have a phone number - without that the nomination doesnt go ahead as I dont have time to surf around trying to track them down anything else I can sort out when I talk to them.

Brisbane - very posh too and we wont be squashed this time - Last year was a bit snug The info is on the website now and tickets are now available Id love to see you there poodlefan! Julie

You'd be hoping in vain. I can think of at least one in our own breed that exports whole litters regularly. Yep some are pretty high up too.

The 5th Annual MDBA Dog Owners Choice Awards are sponsored by Dogzonline. Troy's continuing support has enabled the awards to get bigger and better each year and it's one of the many things Troy does to help the dog world. Im Just letting everyone know that today Im going to again start calling those who have been nominated this year - so get ready here I come. And as I move through them I will put them in the general discussion area for all to see. You can nominate people who you feel have done the right thing by dogs and the dog community here You dont need to be a member of the MDBA and those you nominate dont need to be a member This year the judging is being done a little differently as each nominee will get the chance to tell us more about themselves in the hope that this gives every one a more even shot at it all rather than only have the judging done by what the nomineee has to say. In previous years some put in essays for their nominees and others only a few sentences so we needed to sort out a way of getting a better look at each one. We also removed everything from the nominations which identified who each was but this year the judges will see who they are judging. Help us to recognise and promote the positive things which are going on in the dog world . Categories for the 5th Annual awards are. nominations close 31.12.11. Winners will be announced March 2012. 1. Master Breeder of the Year. The nominee must be a financial member of the MDBA and be nominated by a puppy buyer. This award is not about the success of the breeder’s dogs in dog-related events or the amount of litters they breed. This is about standards of service, support and ethics provided to their puppy buyers. 2 Master Responsible Pet Owner of the Year. To be eligible to be nominated in this category, the nominee must be a financial member of the MDBA. 3. Master Puppy Buyer of the Year. Must be nominated by the person who bred their dog and that person must be an MDBA member. 4. Master Rescuer of the Year. Must be nominated by someone who has adopted one of their dogs, or by someone who is a foster carer /rescuer attached to them. This award is not about how many dogs they have rescued but about their standards of service, support and ethics to their clients and foster carers. Must be a financial Rescue member of the MDBA 5. Breeder of the Year. Must be a registered breeder [not necessarily ANKC] and be nominated by a puppy buyer. The nomination is not about the success of the breeder’s dogs, or how many they breed. This is about service, standards and ethics provided to their puppy buyers. 6. Responsible Pet Owner of the Year. Must be an Australian Resident 7. Best Canine Rescuer of the Year. Must be nominated by someone who has one of their dogs or by someone who is a foster carer /rescuer attached to the group. Open to Australian residents and this is about service, standards and ethics they have shown to their clients and foster carers 8. Best Canine Foster Carer of the Year. To be eligible for nomination for this category the nominee must be nominated by a rescue group/service. This award is not about how many dogs a foster carer has fostered but about their standards of service and dedication. Open to Australian residents. 9. Pet Sitter /walker of the Year. To be eligible to be nominated for this category, the nominee must be nominated by a client for excellence in standards of service. Open to Australian residents. 10. Most Supportive Vet of the Year. To be eligible for nomination in this category the nominee must be nominated by a client. Australian residents 11. Best Vet Nurse /Receptionist of the Year. Must be located in Australia and nominated by a client or a vet. 12 Best Vet surgery/clinic of the Year – Must be located in Australia and be nominated by a client, 13. Best Canine Specialist Service Provider of the Year – Must trade in Australia. Must be nominated by a client.1 14. Best Canine Groomer of the Year. Must be nominated by a client. This nomination is about standards in service. Australian residents. 15. Best Dog Trainer of the Year. Must be nominated by a client. This award is not about awards dogs that have been trained by the nominee have achieved but about the trainer’s dedication and standards in service. Open to Australian residents. 16. Best MDBA Student of the Year. Must be a Current student of the Master Dog Breeders Academy and nominated by a faculty member of the MDBA 17. Best Dog related Website of the Year. Must be owned by an Australian resident. 18. Excellence in Contribution and/or Leadership in Canine Affairs. Must be located in Australia. 19. Boarding Kennel of the Year. Must be nominated by a client. Must be located in Australia 20. Pet Transport Service of the Year. Must be nominated by a client and branches or based in Australia 21. MDBA Pacers award for outstanding Service. 22. Best dog related Publication of the year. 23. Best Dog Supply retail outlet. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be located in Australia. Must not sell live animals 24. Best Dog Photographer /artist. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be based in Australia. 25. Best Dog Insurance Provider of the Year. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be based in Australia 26. Best Dog Friendly Tourist destination. Must be nominated by a dog owner who is a client /visitor. Must be located in Australia. 27 Best dog related product of the year. 28 Best dog related service provider of the year. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be based in Australia. 29. Best Youth Participation in Canine Affairs. Must be aged between 14 and 18 as at 1/1/2011. Must be an Australian resident. 30. Best Junior in Canine Helpfulness and or Kindness. Must be aged between 8 and 14, as at 1/1/2011.Must be an Australian resident

The 5th Annual MDBA Dog Owners Choice Awards are sponsored by Dogzonline. Troy's continuing support has enabled the awards to get bigger and better each year and it's one of the many things Troy does to help the dog world. Im Just letting everyone know that today Im going to again start calling those who have been nominated this year - so get ready here I come. And as I move through them I will put them here for all to see. You can nominate people who you feel have done the right thing by dogs and the dog community here You dont need to be a member of the MDBA and those you nominate dont need to be a member This year the judging is being done a little differently as each nominee will get the chance to tell us more about themselves in the hope that this gives every one a more even shot at it all rather than only have the judging done by what the nomineee has to say. In previous years some put in essays for their nominees and others only a few sentences so we needed to sort out a way of getting a better look at each one. We also removed everything from the nominations which identified who each was but this year the judges will see who they are judging. Help us to recognise and promote the positive things which are going on in the dog world . Categories for the 5th Annual awards are. nominations close 31.12.11. Winners will be announced March 2012. 1. Master Breeder of the Year. The nominee must be a financial member of the MDBA and be nominated by a puppy buyer. This award is not about the success of the breeder’s dogs in dog-related events or the amount of litters they breed. This is about standards of service, support and ethics provided to their puppy buyers. 2 Master Responsible Pet Owner of the Year. To be eligible to be nominated in this category, the nominee must be a financial member of the MDBA. 3. Master Puppy Buyer of the Year. Must be nominated by the person who bred their dog and that person must be an MDBA member. 4. Master Rescuer of the Year. Must be nominated by someone who has adopted one of their dogs, or by someone who is a foster carer /rescuer attached to them. This award is not about how many dogs they have rescued but about their standards of service, support and ethics to their clients and foster carers. Must be a financial Rescue member of the MDBA 5. Breeder of the Year. Must be a registered breeder [not necessarily ANKC] and be nominated by a puppy buyer. The nomination is not about the success of the breeder’s dogs, or how many they breed. This is about service, standards and ethics provided to their puppy buyers. 6. Responsible Pet Owner of the Year. Must be an Australian Resident 7. Best Canine Rescuer of the Year. Must be nominated by someone who has one of their dogs or by someone who is a foster carer /rescuer attached to the group. Open to Australian residents and this is about service, standards and ethics they have shown to their clients and foster carers 8. Best Canine Foster Carer of the Year. To be eligible for nomination for this category the nominee must be nominated by a rescue group/service. This award is not about how many dogs a foster carer has fostered but about their standards of service and dedication. Open to Australian residents. 9. Pet Sitter /walker of the Year. To be eligible to be nominated for this category, the nominee must be nominated by a client for excellence in standards of service. Open to Australian residents. 10. Most Supportive Vet of the Year. To be eligible for nomination in this category the nominee must be nominated by a client. Australian residents 11. Best Vet Nurse /Receptionist of the Year. Must be located in Australia and nominated by a client or a vet. 12 Best Vet surgery/clinic of the Year – Must be located in Australia and be nominated by a client, 13. Best Canine Specialist Service Provider of the Year – Must trade in Australia. Must be nominated by a client.1 14. Best Canine Groomer of the Year. Must be nominated by a client. This nomination is about standards in service. Australian residents. 15. Best Dog Trainer of the Year. Must be nominated by a client. This award is not about awards dogs that have been trained by the nominee have achieved but about the trainer’s dedication and standards in service. Open to Australian residents. 16. Best MDBA Student of the Year. Must be a Current student of the Master Dog Breeders Academy and nominated by a faculty member of the MDBA 17. Best Dog related Website of the Year. Must be owned by an Australian resident. 18. Excellence in Contribution and/or Leadership in Canine Affairs. Must be located in Australia. 19. Boarding Kennel of the Year. Must be nominated by a client. Must be located in Australia 20. Pet Transport Service of the Year. Must be nominated by a client and branches or based in Australia 21. MDBA Pacers award for outstanding Service. 22. Best dog related Publication of the year. 23. Best Dog Supply retail outlet. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be located in Australia. Must not sell live animals 24. Best Dog Photographer /artist. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be based in Australia. 25. Best Dog Insurance Provider of the Year. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be based in Australia 26. Best Dog Friendly Tourist destination. Must be nominated by a dog owner who is a client /visitor. Must be located in Australia. 27 Best dog related product of the year. 28 Best dog related service provider of the year. Must be nominated by a client or customer. Must be based in Australia. 29. Best Youth Participation in Canine Affairs. Must be aged between 14 and 18 as at 1/1/2011. Must be an Australian resident. 30. Best Junior in Canine Helpfulness and or Kindness. Must be aged between 8 and 14, as at 1/1/2011.Must be an Australian resident

Yep and prices just went up sky high at Billabong Creek.

In case it counts a federal MP has one of my beagles - labour too.

Take heart spot Ive no doubt a battle is about to wage and someone will be "educating " the PM's partner on what he is doing and giving him loads of advice about correcting the error of his ways.

Billabong Creek Farm - not a very bloody effective job done by those who tell us how bad it is and want it shut down. This is a cruel blow for Oscars Law and prisoners for profit. these are the ones Tranter accused of planning to raid their homes and kill their pets http://www.prisonersforprofit.org.au/?p=410 We advised our police contacts and our lawyers, but we have also had to move our pets for their own safety. I have had to move house for the third time in 12 months. These people don’t hesitate to kill their dogs and I have been told “we are going to shoot you, like we shoot our dogs”. They watch our facebook pages obsessively and take note of every little detail. They have hacked into our emails and the computer crime squad are investigating, they have phoned our Council’s and lodged complaints about us keeping too many dogs on our properties. These are the type of people that are breeding our pets. These are the type of people the pet shops deal with, out the back, and hidden from public view. These are the people that we are fighting to shut down. We can shut down this industry that views our pets as mere breeding machines. Don’t ever give up, keep up the pressure. let the games begin!

How sad FD But I too agree its seems to be a growing trend. I sent a Maremma pup home at 8 weeks when it was 10 weeks old I got a call to tell me the vet wanted to do XRAYS on ALL of its joints but he didnt think the problem was HD because he said the hips lined up with spine just fine but felt there must be some other terrible problem because the pup couldnt jump up onto the couch. He tried for a while and then it looked like his back legs collapsed and he sat down. Also he had been taken to an offleash dog park [at 10 weeks] and had been wresting with some other dogs and had a bit of limp in his front leg. I was nice about it and asked how tall the couch was from the ground - 25 cm and I explained that I would never expect a Maremma pup to do that .The owner responded with - well I have friends who have dogs this size and they can jump up that height. So I went through it all and explained about the breed and how I felt that for them to have all of an 11 week old pups joints X rayed because it was a bit sore after wresting with big dogs and not being able to jump up on the couch. I suggested a second opinion before they went ahead with that but he said he felt he should trust his vet who had said large breed dogs usually get joint problems. This was the email I sent through. Thanks for letting me know about what is going on with your pup.Ive never known a Maremma pup to be capable of jumping up onto a 25cm high couch and sometimes when they have had strenuous exercise and different activities at this age they get a bit of muscle soreness for a day or two.This is normal and all you normally need to do is let him rest and don't push him. At this age he shouldn't be walking very far and the breed doesn't need as much exercise as others especially at this age.Normally at this age they are locked into very small areas to bond with the animals they will be working with and they don't run or play or have the opportunity to climb or jump at all until they are about 6 months old.Jumping and chasing etc is discouraged and the breed is expected to not do either. You cant compare him with other breeds or other dogs his size. This breed is different to any other and he is a baby Maremma not a Labrador.Mind you lab breeders would want to discourage a lab pup from going up and down stairs or jumping up on couch's or even going for walks until they are much older too.I still have some of his brothers and sisters here and none of them would be able to get up onto a couch and appear to collapse when they work out they cant.This is normal for this breed.Anyway please keep me informed on any developments but please remember he is a Maremma and be aware that vets are not very experienced with the breed in suburbia and love new puppy owners as its easy to over service them. Since then Ive had two comunications with them and both times I asked about this and both times other questions were answered but not this one - so I have no idea whether they went ahead and had all of his joints Xrayed but it appears whether they did or not the dog is doing well with no symptoms of bad joints . Im just the breeder.

You can own a prefix with Vic dogs and never breed a puppy or you can breed cross bred puppies or you can breed cross bred and purebred puppies . Lots of people who breed cross bred dogs have a Vicdogs membership and are therefore exempt form all things other Vicdogs members are exempt from. Vicdogs can only say what you can do with your registered purebred dogs not what you can do with your unregistered dogs. The codes of conduct only cover what you can do with your registered purebreds and you dont need to show whether your dogs are registered purebreds to be exempt - you have to have Vicdogs membership and not own more than 10 fertile bitches. I am a member of Dogs Victoria & I'm pretty sure that it is EXPRESSLY forbidden for members to crossbreed their dogs (or to breed a registered dog with an unregistered dog) - I've been trying to find it on their website - no luck so far but I'll keep looking. It is forbidden for them to breed their registered purebred dogs with dogs of another breed or dogs which are of the same breed but not registered. But you can do anything you want with your dogs which are not registered with them. Lots of registered breeders breed registered and cross bred dogs. If they started telling you that you couldnt own a mongrel or what you can and cannot do with it they would be pinged for restriction of trade.Gotta read the fine print.

We have beefed up security here too and the Maremmas make sure when Im not around or if its dark that all is well but its not possible to cover all possiblities and Ive no doubt that some people feel much more vulnerable than I do and dont want people to know where they live, who they live with , what their movements are and that their dogs are safe. You dont have to look far to see what some are prepared to go through to catch a puppy farmer if there is any suspicion or to steal a dog if they see an opportunity so I get why people who do have another life and who work ect or who live alone dont want everyone to know where they are and Im not sure its something that should be pushed so heavily as some kind of determinant of whether a breeder is ethical or not . Its a basic assumption that we all have huge kenels with staff and separate to where we live. they just dont get that for many of us our kennels are our loungerooms.

Holy **%%%!! Don't you own a shotgun Steve Yep matter of fact I do but seriously how far does a breeder have to go and what do they have to put up with because someone says its how to determine whether they are puppy farming? Ive had peope who just decided to walk in and ask to see my dogs right in the middle of a family bar be que celebrating one of my kids engagements - you know dont let em know you're coming so they cant hide the bad stuff attitude. people who tell me they wil be here at 10 but arrive at 8 to "catch me out " - no concept of what it means to be a mother and the need to feed kids and dress them and have time for a shower or clean my teeth first thing in the morning but just in case I keep my puppies in shit get there early so she doesnt have time to clean up and you see what its really like. Ive come home from shopping to find people camped in my yard having a picnic waiting for me to return after having had a look around and patting the dogs while they are waiting. How did they find me? easy pay off the bird at the pizza hut and give her my phone number and she will give you my address from where I had a pizza delivered. You too can have this if the RSPCA get their way and in order to breed you have to have your street address listed for all to see.