Aidan3

If your dog loves it, you are doing it right You can use it to teach things like impulse control, training in drive etc and for those purposes there is an art and a science.

Sorry, I'm confused. Are you saying that you had been working with Roo without the influence of Clomicalm and were having success? Then Roo started taking Clomicalm and started going downhill again? If so, has Roo been taking the full dose of Clomicalm for 8 weeks or not? Medication doesn't always work, and every now and then owners will report the dog's symptoms becoming worse with medication. But it would be difficult to verify that medication is indeed the cause of this. Changes in the dog's environment or routine, progressions in behaviour modification protocols, and normal, cyclical patterns of regression to (and away from) the mean are obvious factors. How does anyone separate out those factors and blame any one thing? The simple answer is that you can't (but if you take out a factor, e.g quit medication, and things improve anyway - it becomes a moot point).

Sorry to hear of this set-back. Has she been on a reduced dose until today? There is a cumulative effect, so temporarily upping the dose won't give you much of a dose-response effect. On that note, it can take 6-8 weeks to see any effect of the drug at all (it's not like taking valium, for a comparative example). Unfortunately, some dogs do not respond. Most dogs improve a lot, some dogs improve a little, some dogs don't improve at all. Some dogs respond better to other anti-depressants/anxiolytics.

I agree that polite dogs don't approach too directly, but it is polite for dogs to greet face to face.

I don't think there is a solution, hankdog, but I do know that it makes a big difference when dog owners can train themselves to keep calm when a stray dog rushes up to them. It won't stop a dog hell-bent on doing damage, but it will avoid those problems which can be avoided. Other than that, choose your walking route carefully, and report any known problem dogs and make sure the council has followed up.

Dogs don't need a social life, but some very much enjoy it.

I take mine along the beach every day, but I think it's important to recognise that not all dogs enjoy that. With a previous dog, I would take her places where we were less likely to have a strange dog run up to us, she didn't enjoy that at all. My other dog at the time had brilliant social skills, but wasn't interested in playing with other dogs so that suited him just fine too.

Neither does mine but how do you know what the other dog's going to be like? That's why I cross the road. The odds of a "worst-case scenario" are pretty slim. I think most people who have a dog who will cause actual damage are usually acutely aware of the risk. It's a much, much bigger problem if you own a reactive dog, or a dog who would be hurt easily. Having previously owned a reactive dog, one who would also cause actual damage, I know I would always avoid any chance of trouble even though she was trained well enough to walk past another dog at close quarters.

I don't have this problem at all with Toby. He just doesn't give a crap.

I will always ensure the welfare of my pets to the best of my ability, but my kids come first.

The behaviourists methods were Clomicalm, which appears to have made a tangible improvement. The cost and stigma seem to be the problem there. I don't have any solution for the cost, but the stigma is unwarranted. Clomicalm reduces anxiety, and that's it. It's not a hypnotic, any extra sleeping is because your dog can relax. There are anxiolytics out there which do some strange things, and even clomicalm can do some strange things in rare individuals, but it is not a drug that comes with a huge risk of that. Jelly, you mentioned state-dependent learning earlier in the thread. It's an astute observation, but not a huge practical concern. What you really need to be satisfied with is that the benefits of the drug outweigh the costs. Put aside cultural concerns or any ideas that a dog "shouldn't" need drugs to be able to function normally. Which genes your dog gets are a random assortment of what is available when dog meets bitch. Mood disorders appear with some probability just as serious liver or joint or heart problems do. The real problem (as i see it) is the financial cost vs the amount of benefit gained - is that benefit enough? I feel for you, and for Roo, and commend you on the outstanding effort you've made to ensure that Roo gets the very best chance.

Margate is pretty close!

Yes, the vast majority of dogs I work with wear either a flat collar or martingale and learn not to pull on the leash. Effective use of positive reinforcement and consistency are the keys.

Front-attach harnesses, correctly fitted, are completely unrestrictive across the chest. A dog could run quite happily off-leash in one, I can't see how it would be a problem unless the front strap was pulled far too tight. I don't see too many front-attach harnesses around, but of those I do see, it's rare to see a dog pull in them. I'm not sure what damage they could do, even if the dog were pulling, but if anyone knows of any dogs injured (acutely or over time) while wearing one I'd be interested to hear about the circumstances. I would suggest that if someone has fitted a front-attach harness and the dog is pulling, that they seek the help of someone competent in their use to check fit and then teach how to avoid having the dog pull. It's very awkward for a dog to pull in a front-attach harness and they aren't in a strong position to do so unless you (subconsciously) "help them" pull by giving them something to pull directly against.

Considering they're an off the shelf product, I see it a lot. Or they don't work at all and the owner is still dragged. It's just they're so gentle and nice, how could they cause ANY harm at all! Has any evidence of harm come to light? I'm not aware of any.

They are loose across the front, and because the dog is not pulling, there should not be any issues of the sort Dr Zink has concerns about.

Why would that be OK? You don't allow them to walk that way in the first place, which is possible because you have the leverage advantage.

A lot of people cannot legally use or access a prong collar, but aside from that issue I think it's a very good idea to see a competent trainer and learn how to use any equipment you plan on using. The same goes for a front-attach harness, and I've not had any issues in teaching people to use them (or, for those who do not suffer some terrible back or shoulder injury, how to transition to a flat collar). They are pretty much "set and forget", but a strong dog can learn to pull sideways. It's a simple matter to stop that, and the tool gives you the leverage to do it if you've been shown how or can figure it out. Most of the time when I've seen a problem, the owner has been unconsciously allowing it to continue.

They just cook up the leaf (which is otherwise worthless) in butter. THC is oil-soluble and requires heat to activate (which is why eating a plant would have little effect on it's own). Marijuana has been used medically in dogs, they seem to tolerate it quite well unless it gets to a toxic level. The problem with hash cookies these days is that people are making them using more potent strains, and sometimes even with the very potent (and valuable) buds. A very small amount ingested can be toxic in that case. Back in my day (many moons ago) hash was black and usually came in a block commonly known as a block of Johnny Cash. You could also melt it back to resin and smear it inside a tally and smoke it that way or through a pipe. Cooking poo(leaf) and making cookies or cakes was a whole nother thing. Hash stoned is completely different to choof stoned. I'll give you the tip - if anyone offers you a hash brownie or hash cookie these days, "just say no" :laugh:

They just cook up the leaf (which is otherwise worthless) in butter. THC is oil-soluble and requires heat to activate (which is why eating a plant would have little effect on it's own). Marijuana has been used medically in dogs, they seem to tolerate it quite well unless it gets to a toxic level. The problem with hash cookies these days is that people are making them using more potent strains, and sometimes even with the very potent (and valuable) buds. A very small amount ingested can be toxic in that case.

People who teach their kids that dogs are 'evil' are evil.

I think we're all just relieved that we didn't have to say it :laugh:

Yes, you need at least four weeks, up to six to see improvement. Did the vet behaviourist give you an idea of what to look for as far as signs of improvement? That's usually a good time, "rest and digest". Energy from food can be stored indefinitely.

So the long term harm to his organs and brain is not a concern to you? What long term harm are you referring to?

Never thought you were :) I know they're a highly controversial training tool, but although I will try some gently gently training methods first ('cos I can't currently buy the collars/lid the pen and have found a good resource for a gentle method after doing a lot of googling yesterday), judging their behaviour I think it's going to take something a bit stronger. If I can get them to associate the poultry with a shock then I think I've a fair chance of getting them to leave them alone. But will definately lid the pen in due course and will never, ever, trust them around the poultry the way I can the seniors. I didn't suggest them because of any particular controversy, but because there is really no evidence to suggest greater reliability from using them in this situation. They work great initially, but don't become complacent.