morgan

You would be shocked at the number of vets who casually vaccinate dogs either the day before or the day of entry to a boarding kennel! When the owner asks if this is safe, they insist that the dog must be done for it's own protection, even if the vaccination is not due for another month or two. This either indicates that the vet is totally ignorant of the fact that the dog should be isolated for at least a week afterwards because of increased susceptibility, or greed, in that they know this, don't care, and just want the money...

My experience is that no vet will broach the subject of changed protocols. If you actually bring up the subject, and display some knowledge of it some of them will concede that you are right, but initiate the topic?? The survey that showed over 90% of Australian vets feared such changes would adversely affect their income was a tad conservative methinks...

My previous large breed litters were started on RC Starter, and their dams fed on this for the latter half of the pregnancy - the pups were swapped over to RC Maxi Junior around a couple of months old. They were then swapped over to the Maxi Energy formula at around 12-15 months, as adults they get either this or Maxi Sensible for a change. Every dam and pup has been given raw chicken necks, wings, turkey tails etc every day as well. My last litter was started the same way, but put onto Maxi Babydog at 5 or 6 weeks, as I felt the lower protein level would be better for them. One of the boys started knuckling over very badly by 8 weeks - by the third day he looked quite deformed. I started adding dolomite to his food to sort out the calcium/magnesium/phosphorus balance and within 3 days he was back to normal. I put the rest of the litter onto it at the same time, and they all stayed on it for 6 months. This condition is caused by excess protein upsetting the balance, and has been seen in a number of breeds - even whippets, so it is not just large breeds. I had to immediately reduce the protein levels, and started mixing adult dry food in with the babydog. Every time I let the protein level go up again by using some maxi Junior, something would happen - east-west fronts, cowhocks, upright pasterns. Each time I would reduce the protein level to around 24-25% and they would improve. It was a bit of a shock, as I have not had these problems in over 25 years of breeding from this dam line, no matter which stud dog I've used. The sire and his 2 siblings have wonderful sound legs, as did the previous few generations. These pups are now 10 mths, and have Maxi Energy and Maxi Sensible, with occasional Medium Energy and Medium Adult to lower the protein levels. Their fronts have settled down, but hocks are still a bit dodgy - a problem I have not seen in 8 generations. Since this happened I have spoken to several breeders who rear their pups on adult formula RC for the same reason. Hope this helps!

That is unfortunate - I have changed many pups and dogs over to RC abruptly without problems. Maybe the higher grain content of this particular formulation has caused it - I only use the adult formulations these days after having growth problems with the RC Maxi Junior formula in my last litter. Any food related diarrhea I always treat by withholding dry food and giving some natural yoghurt (with slippery elm if you have some) and just some raw chicken necks to stop them thinking they are being starved to death A day or two of this and they are usually fine, just reintroduce food gradually.

My vet has "confidentially" told me "as we all know, vaccinations last several years at least, and if customers ignore my annual vaccination reminders and leave it a year or two, I'm not at all concerned". Obviously, he does not share this advice with his usual clientele. Neither does he question my steadfast refusal to vaccinate my adult dogs. Friends in Victoria who work with a number of vet practices tell me that these vets are frantically trying to find new sources of income to replace annual boosters once the new protocols come in - not only will they lose income from the vaccinations themselves, they will lose the spin-off income from treating associated allergies, epilepsy, arthritis, immune disorders etc. I have never had a dog vaccinated after 2 puppy shots in 30 years, despite regular attendance at shows (sometimes over 50 shows a year). Even when my non-boosted adults have been exposed to parvo and distemper, they have not caught it. So don't be expecting your vet to tell you otherwise anytime soon! :D

Oops - hadn't realised Maxi Junior had that much maize in it - I only got one bag for my last litter, as I had to reduce the amount of protein (33% was too high for them) My pups all started losing their puppy coats at 7 - 8 months, but didn't lose the shine - had them on a mixture of medium and maxi energy, with some maxi sensible for variety. Mind you, the turkey tails have a lot of fat in them!

If the first ingredient is Maize, you must have him on the Medium Adult - which is totally unsuitable for pups. I only use it for older dogs with a weight problem, and even then I mix it with Medium Energy, which has a higher fat and protein content. The Adult range is basically a budget range, which is reflected by the ingredients. RC recommends their "Junior" range until 18 mths. I have not had this here for a while, so can't be 100% sure of ingredients, but am fairly certain that maize isn't the main one. All my dogs are fed on the Energy, Junior or Sensible ranges, which work well, together with chicken necks and turkey tails.

Have seen some of the smelliest, baldest, most miserable, filthy, dull coated GSDs improve drastically within 10-14 days of eating a Royal Canin and raw chicken neck diet. They weren't even bathed! Would suggest the "sensible" range, as it is chicken and rice based to eliminate allergens. Add fish oil each day as well. This diet should assist the ears, but they sound so far gone you might need to try the "Blue Power" treatment or something similar. (just google it) If this diet doesn't make a big difference within a few weeks to his odour, would definitely try a full naturopathic type overhaul - cleansing etc.

If this is due to the possibility of the dobe being Von Willebrand's affected, scotties that don't have parents tested clear have the same problem.

Call me cynical, but it sounds like a wallet massaging exercise to me. Unless of course your pup is already suffering from allergies or is in poor health?

If it is cancer, vitamin c MUST be given to bowel tolerance level to give the best chance of survival (along with several other alternatives)

Yep - sodium ascorbate powder is the form I use - the ascorbic acid form is too rough on the stomach, and tablets contain too many fillers etc that also can cause upsets. It tastes salty, so you have to dissolve it in water and syringe it down the throat - try for at least 10 gms a day, divided into several doses, as it doesn't stay in the system for long. The ideal dosage rate is to give it until "bowel tolerance" is reached - when there is looseness of the bowels you know that the system has stopped being able to use it, so cut dosage back a little - this applies to people as well! (AIDS patients can take 200 gms intravenously every day before reaching this level - the body's health dictates how much it needs) As health improves, you will find that the body doesn't need as much, and bowel tolerance will kick in at lower dosages.

If you really feel that it has been purely since you applied the chemical, it may simply have been too toxic for him for some reason. For any kind of chemical overload, try large doses of vitamin c several times daily for some time to help detoxify his system. try some omega 3's in his diet as well to help his skin health. Blood tests at the vet might be of assistance if there is something else wrong.

Agree with that - a friend lost her queen when she chewed out all her stitches after a caesarian during the night, basically disembowelled herself - had to handraise all the kittens

Poor little bugger is right! Not fair on a young puppy - if they are going to do it like that they should wait til she's a bit older and not needing to be fed twice a day any more! (trying not to display my huge bias against early desexing here )

Some vets are staffed overnight, my previous vet always used to have a vet nurse live in who would periodically check animals during the night and call her in if there were any problems. (Vet only lived 5 minutes away)

I thought the big alleged advantage of speying babies was that they recovered more quickly? When have you been told to take away her water? I would be very concerned about the possibility of late afternoon surgery if she is to have no food/water after midnight the night before - very rough on a baby! Having had surgery myself after more than 12 hours fasting, I can honestly say it was dreadful! Talk about head spins... As I have never had a puppy desexed I cannot say what the usual procedure is, but the timing of the op would concern me more than the overnight stay.

Who considers it to be safe? My vet stopped using it well over a year ago because of the incidence of auto immune hemolytic anemia - he said that statistically it might have been small, but try telling that to the owners of the affected dogs!

My concern about grains is that in their present form they have only been around for a few hundred years. In any form they have only been around for 10,000 years, when agriculture first started due to the pressures of increasing population on limited numbers of game to be hunted. Compare this to 60 or 70,000 years of evolution, with humans eating meat, nuts, fruit, eggs, vegetables. Dogs, as they have been associated with humans for so many millennia, would have had a similar diet, so digestions all round were not geared to grain consumption, and carbs were only eaten in the form of fruit and vegetables. Many people today still cannot handle the vastly increased amount of gluten to be found in many grains, as this has has only occurred in the last century or so with selective plant breeding. So, while people and dogs are, to varying degrees, omnivores, there is an evolutionary bias to meat consumption - indeed vegans have no adequate source of vit B12 without animal protein and their brains suffer as a result - the synthetic forms are inadequate, and the plant based forms are too difficult for the body to absorb. If vegans' health suffers, I don't see why a dog's wouldn't.

Same reason it goes into dog and human foods - cheap alternative source of protein. Apparently it was fed world-wide to cheetahs in zoos and caused problems. Here is a link to a well respected site giving details of studies on animals fed soy. Soy and animals

Soy is highly toxic to people and all animals! It should not be consumed unless in a fermented form like soy sauce or miso - there are too many natural toxins in it to be fed in any other form (inc tofu). It is especially toxic to the thyroid in any animal or person, and implicated in quite a number of different cancers. Feeding soy in the diet almost decimated one zoo's cheetah breeding program, as they rapidly became infertile, esp the next generation, and destroyed many fanciers bird breeding programs over several generations. eg crimson rosellas take 18 months to colour up, yet those fed with some soy in their diet colour up in less than 3 - sends their hormones haywire! As for myself, I don't even believe in people eating grains - try to avoid them where possible.

Why single vets out? ALL medical practitioners follow accepted practice, whether it is the fear of losing income, clients, credibility or running foul of regulatory bodies. It is up to us to do the research and state what we want! You might just as well ask why doctors still push the party line on cholesterol - statin drugs are every bit as dangerous and unnecessary for people as boosters are for dogs, but you have the media, the pharmaceutical companies, the Heart Foundation et al shoving the whole cholesterol myth at us, brainwashing everyone! Same thing! Tell me you've found a doctor who says the whole cholesterol thing is a load of bull***t and I'll eat my hat! (I know - OT )

You seem to have had problems in finding decent vets! Both my vets do very thorough checks on puppies and kittens - many is the time that vaccinating and chipping 3 or 4 babies has taken over half an hour! Even when I lived on the North Shore I was able to get much better breeder rates than $70 a pup! I have never had a vet in 30 years do such a quick check as you mention. Most vets that I know live simpler lives than you suggest, and quite frankly, with the time and effort they put into their careers, they deserve some sort of reward! Yes it is unfortunate that so many follow the party line with vaccinations, but they are a product of their environment - it is up to we consumers to educate them as to what we will tolerate, and what we won't. My vet decided never to give the 12 mth Proheart injections or Fort Dodge products again, (from his own observations) and I have educated him to the existence of immunity titre testing, which he will now happily do - so it is possible! Fine champagne most vets I know don't drink much at all, as there is always the possibility of a late emergency callout! Many is the time I have had a vet out of bed at 2am or 3am for an emergency caesar or bloat case... (personally I think they deserve a fine champagne or two!) Remember, you can always vote with your feet!

Agree with not vaccinating at 6 weeks - but I leave it till 9 or so weeks - puppy buyers just have to wait! Disagree with the notion that vets charge $70 just for a C4 - they are also charging for a full consultation, including checking temperature, heartbeat, testicles in a male pup, gum colour etc. Breeders are almost always given discounts - I only pay about $28 per C3 for my pups, with full health check! (And I would never give any more than a C3 to a pup - polyvalent vaccines are a bit much for some babies) As much as I personally don't approve of over-vaccination, and the reliance on it for keeping vet practices solvent, I understand that many have a huge investment in equipment, property, staff etc, and I do appreciate their existence when my bitch needs an emergency caesar, or a dog has had an accident! So I never argue with their pricing, I just find one that suits me...

Doesn't it also contain sodium nitritates? (Or was it nitrites :rolleyes: ) I know I never used to let my kids eat any kind of cold meats for that reason - carcinogenic! Bake your own liver treats - very tasty plus loads of vitamins A and D. There is nothing of any value in cabanossi except it's taste being handy for baiting.