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Scottsmum

New (Selective) Noise Aversion

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So over the last ... maybe 10 days I've noticed something really odd, and (I think) new.

I've noticed that if I crack my knuckles or toes when Scottie is next to me he leaves the room. Like he's got a rocket up his bum, up and off the couch or away from my feet before I can register what's going on.

It's only if he's right near my joints - like if hes on the couch and my feet are on the floor that's fine - no need to scamper. If he's next to my feet that's not ok. If he's sitting on the couch my hands are almost in line with him, or on him - that's also not ok.

I've never noticed it before. Now, don't get me wrong - I'm not repeating the process to torture him but I do click and pop and crack a lot - it's a bad habit and left over from too many spills riding horses as a kid.

Interestingly hubby and I have wondered if he's starting to go deaf - but this observation seems to be at odds with that theory.

Any thoughts?

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perhaps there are changes in the way his body is perceiving different pitches etc of sound ?

Can't remember if you mentioned anything - but has he had any injury to his head /neck ?

Ever since I had a fall 2 yrs ago .. my sound perception has changed somewhat . For months some sounds would physically HURT ...

Even now .. if my neck is playing up .. certain sounds are just really uncomfortable .

Edited by persephone

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perhaps there are changes in the way his body is perceiving different pitches etc of sound ?

Can't remember if you mentioned anything - but has he had any injury to his head /neck ?

Ever since I had a fall 2 yrs ago .. my sound perception has changed somewhat . For months some sounds would physically HURT ...

Even now .. if my neck is playing up .. certain sounds are just really uncomfortable .

He's got a dodgy back - but nothing new that I'm aware of. He's just about due for a 6 monthly seniors check up. Will add it to the list of things to ask the vet...

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perhaps there are changes in the way his body is perceiving different pitches etc of sound ?

Can't remember if you mentioned anything - but has he had any injury to his head /neck ?

Ever since I had a fall 2 yrs ago .. my sound perception has changed somewhat . For months some sounds would physically HURT ...

Even now .. if my neck is playing up .. certain sounds are just really uncomfortable .

He's got a dodgy back - but nothing new that I'm aware of. He's just about due for a 6 monthly seniors check up. Will add it to the list of things to ask the vet...

Best of luck with it ..poor Scotty ...

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I seem to recall that Scottie is on anxiety meds. Did the prescription or dose change recently? Has he been under any additional stress of late? Or has a previous stressor resolved itself only to have this issue pop up?

Reason I ask: Malcolm has Generalised Anxiety Disorder and we see this all the time. We desensitise / counter-condition him to one trigger (usually noise related) only to have another appear soon after. This is not verbatim, but our vet behaviourist said that this whack-a-mole like situation can come about when you do behavioural modification (training) without treating the underlying anxiety disorder. She also warned that although rare, some dogs can have increased noise sensitivity on some medications, in which case you discontinue it and try something else, and that other medications if not judiciously used can cause rebound anxiety in the longterm.

Definitely mention the noise sensitivity to your GP vet or even better your vet behaviourist if you have one.

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He is on SA Meds. A very low level at the moment. We have the full blessing of our GP Vet to dial it up and down as we need it.

I really can't think of any changes to home. Things are reasonably normal here - other than the fact I've been dog walking for other people so (at the moment I) come home two to 3 times a week STINKING like other dogs. :eek:

He's usually nose phobic - hates storms and it was domestic violence / domestics (not in our own home) which lead to us medicating him. Thankfully we have not had a single thunderstorm since being here. We're close to the army camp but the guns and odd explosion don't seem to bother him. I've only felt one quake since I've been here - I was home at the time ad it didn't appear to bother him either.

We don't have a VB - but will mention it to the GP when I get around to making the appointment.

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Snook   

Although it doesn't sound like it's an issue at the moment, PK made a good point to keep an eye on if you do decide to increase Scottie's medication in the future. Justice's VB gave me the okay to increase him from one tablet to one and a half and then two if I decided he needed further assistance from the medication. We went up to one and a half with no problems and sat at that for a couple of months before I increased to two tablets but after about a week, that extra half seemed to make him ever so slightly edgy at times and a bit more prone to getting upset by things. I persisted for a couple of weeks but it didn't improve so I dropped him back to one and a half and that edginess has disappeared. Even if a dog is approved for a higher dose than what they're getting, it can still cause issues that aren't there at a lower dose, the same with antidepressants in humans. Anyway, I know you've said that's not behind what's happening with Scottie at the moment but I thought I'd mention what happened to Justice in case you do increase the dose later on.

As for what's actually happening with Scottie, it's really hard to know. Is it possible that stress from the move and changes that have happened to his routine since then have caught up with him and caused him to have an anxiety based response to something that has never bothered him before? I guess I'm thinking along the lines of what PK said about generalised anxiety disorders sometimes resulting in the dog developing new fears as old ones get addressed? I'm just taking a stab in the dark though and don't have any idea how likely that is.

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So just updated the thread where I post about Scotties 6 monthly seniors check ups.

But thought I'd pop in here & tidy it up best I could in case some one searches it in the future. Asked the vet about the noise aversion - she had no ideas :/ Other than to suggest it could be frequency of the sound. I asked if it could be a a weird vibration & she looked doubtful & said she thought it could be possible.

I said in my OP we had wondered if he was going deaf - we'll we're as sure as we can be that he's basically entirely deaf. I got out of bed on Sunday morning (only human at home), walked the length of the bed room, stood directly behind him and said his name 3 times. Only time I got a reaction was when I moved in front of the window and my shadow moved into his line of sight. I'm not entirely sure what lead Hubby to his conclusion, something similar involving a squeaky toy I think.

So that's is. A pretty inconclusive result to the knuckle cracking question. He also jumps at claps and the other night Hubby dropped a spoon on his bowl and Scottie was off like a shot - so I assume its all vibration related. :confused:

So back to life with a deaf foxie! At least we're in a better spot then when Guin went deaf. He knows signals for stay, drop, sit, stand and come.

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Snook   

That's interesting, Scottsmum. I hope that as Scottie gets more used to his hearing loss that he starts to settle with the vibrations from noises and they don't stress him so much. It must be very difficult to see him get frightened like that.

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I would probably do the same if someone cracks their knuckles in front of me I would run outside :bolt: also as I can't stand it.

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That's interesting, Scottsmum. I hope that as Scottie gets more used to his hearing loss that he starts to settle with the vibrations from noises and they don't stress him so much. It must be very difficult to see him get frightened like that.

I'm sure he'll settle. Guin adjusted perfectly to being deaf - I mean the old bitch never listened anyhow. The real bonus was that she shopped reacting to storms too. But it is hard - when he takes off you can't call him back you have to go and find him.

I'm thinking I'll try to work on clapping while we're playing fetch so he associates it more with fun things and (I hope) he'll look around for the source when he "hears" clapping in the future - instead of just taking off.

I would probably do the same if someone cracks their knuckles in front of me I would run outside :bolt: also as I can't stand it.

Yeh - It's a gross habit but one I've had most my life. I'm a krickety rickety (not so) old thing after a few too may horse accidents as a kid.

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Thanks for the update. Poor little man. If most of his world is quiet now, and then suddenly hearing noise in a particular frequency or whatnot could be very startling.

I guess the question is how can you make Scottie feel more comfortable and relaxed at this time? I know he has a crate he can retreat to. Have you ever tried an Adaptil collar?

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Thanks for the update. Poor little man. If most of his world is quiet now, and then suddenly hearing noise in a particular frequency or whatnot could be very startling.

I guess the question is how can you make Scottie feel more comfortable and relaxed at this time? I know he has a crate he can retreat to. Have you ever tried an Adaptil collar?

We're going to try medication - the name of which escapes me (not Vetanonin) as a i said on the other thread. We'll try to work on the clapping thing so he learns to look around for the source when he hears it and I'll try to stop cracking my knuckles :)

I've tried adaptil on another dog - didn't find it helped too much in that case. We'll just plod along at this point and see what we can do. Good news is that he's otherwise very healthy with perfect bloods - which is great news.

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I've read that not all dogs respond to Adaptil, so it's possible Scottie might respond differently. I get the collar cheaper by getting online store prices matched by physical stores. Online stores can have inferior overseas stock that isn't up to the standard sold in Aus. Anyway, I'm rambling and will pop over to the other thread. I wrote a long response but it got eaten, ugh.

Fantastic news about the bloods. :thumbsup:

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.... He knows signals for stay, drop, sit, stand and come.

When Frodo's hearing faded this was so good for a while - but when the eyesight fades also it's a new challenge to work with. You can certainly teach an old dog new tricks: Frodo has good sense of smell still, and knows a hand in front means come forward, and which touch can mean stop or turn or keep going or drop. He's still playful within the constraints of some arthritis and being careful of leaping into the unknown. Very slight signs of oncoming dementia so it's just watch carefully, he is okay for now. Pretty good in fact at 16 and with an unfair background of illness and injury he has overcome.

Hope Scottie settles, I know Fro went through a bad patch at the onset of losing hearing and sight, became very nervous and extremely clingey. He has worked through it and I'm proud of him (as always) - and he knows when he is a bit lost or needs to go outside, or food, or a drink, that he can just vocalise quietly and help comes. When he is home alone he sleeps very well for which I'm glad: separation stress would be hard to deal with.

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.... He knows signals for stay, drop, sit, stand and come.

When Frodo's hearing faded this was so good for a while - but when the eyesight fades also it's a new challenge to work with. You can certainly teach an old dog new tricks: Frodo has good sense of smell still, and knows a hand in front means come forward, and which touch can mean stop or turn or keep going or drop. He's still playful within the constraints of some arthritis and being careful of leaping into the unknown. Very slight signs of oncoming dementia so it's just watch carefully, he is okay for now. Pretty good in fact at 16 and with an unfair background of illness and injury he has overcome.

Hope Scottie settles, I know Fro went through a bad patch at the onset of losing hearing and sight, became very nervous and extremely clingey. He has worked through it and I'm proud of him (as always) - and he knows when he is a bit lost or needs to go outside, or food, or a drink, that he can just vocalise quietly and help comes. When he is home alone he sleeps very well for which I'm glad: separation stress would be hard to deal with.

:) I know it's always different - but I'm glad we've been here before. Feel like second time will be easier (in some ways).

Guin had pretty significant sight loss too - for a long time.

we'll just take it one day at a time.

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corvus   

Some dogs - particularly those with noise sensitivities - don't need any particular trigger. They will just suddenly come to hate a sound that has been around all their lives. My Erik decided he hated the dishwasher clicking when it was running probably after about 4 years of living with it and not showing any signs of concern. Soon after, he grew anxious about tiny noises around the house in the wind. Now the other dog gets stressed about them as well. No explanations. He just woke up one day and objected to sounds that had never bothered him before.

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Some dogs - particularly those with noise sensitivities - don't need any particular trigger. They will just suddenly come to hate a sound that has been around all their lives. My Erik decided he hated the dishwasher clicking when it was running probably after about 4 years of living with it and not showing any signs of concern. Soon after, he grew anxious about tiny noises around the house in the wind. Now the other dog gets stressed about them as well. No explanations. He just woke up one day and objected to sounds that had never bothered him before.

Ta Corvus.

Could very well be a contributing factor but we're also about as sure as we can be that he's gone deaf :/

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