Tacoheki Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Do you teach recall for a dog that will NOT come to you for any reason?! food, toys, praise, have tried a long lead, she will almost choke herself trying not to give in... Im at the end of my rope, as she wont even come inside to be fed and sleep anymore! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Do you teach recall for a dog that will NOT come to you for any reason?! food, toys, praise, have tried a long lead, she will almost choke herself trying not to give in... Im at the end of my rope, as she wont even come inside to be fed and sleep anymore! Wow, I can see how that would be frustrating! Can I ask how long have you had her for - and how old she is? What other training have you done with her? Is she uninterested in food treats or toys or petting at all times, or can you just not keep her focus when you're trying to teach recall? If she won't come in for dinner when called, how do you feed her? Do you take the meal to her outside? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 look at the reason she is avoiding you ... is it fear? Uncertainty? or have you spent a lot of time teaching the dog to not come to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Oh She's a Maremma Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacoheki Posted March 10, 2007 Author Share Posted March 10, 2007 She is a Kelpie and she is about 9 months old. I have had her since October and we hven't done any formal training, but I do lot with her at home on lead. She has always kept her distance like she is trying to herd me or in case I throw a toy. She will come inside if my other 2 dogs are inside where she is fed in a crate nd thats where she sleeps. Nekhbet; I have never encouraged her to stay away from me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacoheki Posted March 11, 2007 Author Share Posted March 11, 2007 Please? Anyone? Im really at a loss as to what to do!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 She has always kept her distance like she is trying to herd me OR IN CASE I THROW THE TOY. She will come inside if my other 2 dogs are inside where she is fed in a crate nd thats where she sleeps. Nekhbet; I have never encouraged her to stay away from me. There you go IN CASE I THROW THE TOY. Mind you it is natural for a kelpie, especially from working lines to herd. Every friend I know has had a kelpie from a working farm, I have no idea on show lines. DO NOT THROW the toy, encourage close contact with you. Further simple obedience close to you, petting, brushing, various drives.......anything.........to encourage her close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacoheki Posted March 11, 2007 Author Share Posted March 11, 2007 (edited) Lab lover, I dont throw the toy, thats the point. She waits in case I do. I attended a K9 force seminar not long after I got the dog, and because of that, I have always tried to get her to come up and play with the toy while I'm holding it. However, I have only had her since she was 6months old, so before that I have no idea of her history. ETA thankyou for the helpful suggestions Lablover, she does enjoy being brushed, so I will try using that as a bribe. Its funny, because she wont come for food, but once she is there she will take it anyways... Edited March 11, 2007 by Phoenix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Lab lover, I dont throw the toy, thats the point. She waits in case I do. I attended a K9 force seminar not long after I got the dog, and because of that, I have always tried to get her to come up and play with the toy while I'm holding it. And what does he say about the problem you have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacoheki Posted March 11, 2007 Author Share Posted March 11, 2007 Steve said to keep working at getting her to play with the toy that I hold. Which I still am trying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Ecollar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacoheki Posted March 11, 2007 Author Share Posted March 11, 2007 I am not too familiar with ecollars and the methods that might be used to help this situation. If you are able to give me a brief rundown Myszka I would really appreciate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Ask K9. He is the expert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjk05 Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Have you tried hand-feeding her? If she refuses, skip a meal. She won't starve to death. Keep her meals aside and use them during the day for training- she has to come towards you to get each piece of food. Don't try to grab her or lean out to catch her, just wait until she's hungry, you have her food, and she comes close- praise, reward with a bit of food, and walk away. If she follows you, again praise and feed. Make all the good stuff in her life (food, toys, etc) conditional on contact with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arya Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 I feel really sorry for you both and hope you find a solution to the problem :rolleyes: If I were you Id' head on back to K9 for sure. This can be a terribly frustrating one can't it. Hey, you'll get there! Here is my little two cents worth. You may find something useful in it, or you may not but I hope something I write helps As you didn't have her from a new pup you are working kind of 'behind the 8-ball' cos you don't know what happened to her before you had her. From what you describe, I can hear how frustrated you are about it. Hey, why not start right from the beginning again. Don't assume any prior knowledge with her and pretend you've never worked with her. Begin with no recalls or formal commands, just lots of bonding and play in the garden at home and long, no-stress street walks together, just you and the dog (assuming the dog will walk nicely on the lead for you?). Go for it, let her have the toy, balls, whatever in the garden. Let her win and enjoy being around you. Don't get too worried about her not working for the toy. You start all games, never her. You finish all games before she is ready to. Then you're still in charge. If she wants to include herding you in it go crazy and run around with her! Play her way, at least at first. The dog enjoying herself is the key, imho. As long as she is having a blast and sees you as the 'funmeister' if that makes sense. Do this for as long as it takes to see her run towards you happily in the garden when you hold up the toys or go out and invite her to play. Then, and only then, go back to formal training, little by little. Tiny steps. Keep it fun. Keep it light. Maybe she's had bad experiences. You may never know. Before considering e-collar or anything compulsive (and here I must say I am happy to use compulsion whereever it really is necessary and would happily use a prong collar or an e collar if the situation was right... but ONLY if the situation was right and in experienced hands) I'd definitely make the trip back to K9 for further advice. Here on-line you can only get so many ideas when people can't see you and your dog. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arya Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Sorry for the long post everyone... my fingers went crazy again :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsD Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Lab lover, I dont throw the toy, thats the point. She waits in case I do. Phoenix, are you saying that you never ever throw the toy for her? If not, how do you play with her? I may be on the wrong track here, but what I taught Jarrah was that for him to get the reward ie me throwing the toy or playing tug with him, he had to "do something" to earn it. In other words NILF but concentrating on his obsession with the toy. At first it was difficult - not that he wouldnt ever come to me cos he would as long as there wasnt a toy involved - but to get his dinner he had to come & sit & wait on me (helps that he is food motivated as well as toy) & for every time I throw the toy he has to "earn it". When we first got him he would stand away from me eyeing the toy & me & there was no way he was going to come close when there was a chance I may throw it but 3 months later he will do anything to work for the toy including a formal or informal recall, a drop, sit at a distance, a stay etc. If you need to, start by having him on lead & making him come to you, then giving him the reward etc, it may take a while, but if you are persistant (& consistant) it will work . If you want to see the focus my boy has when there is a toy involved have a look for my short video of our dogs & kids doing stays that I posted in here - he doesnt take his eyes off me for even a split second . Sorry I dont know if that's the solution to your problem or not but it has certainly worked for me :rolleyes: . I also agree with Arya's post, even though I did formal stuff with Jarrah ie recall, sits, drops at a distance etc, you can still do it just doing the fun stuff. Just make sure the dog thinks its FUN & that it earns the reward . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke GSP Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 (edited) Are e-collars legal? SORRY, JUST READ THE DO NOT MENTION THIS SUBJECT AGAIN WARNING ON ANOTHER THREAD! Edited March 12, 2007 by luke dixon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arya Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 Aha, I lost this thread... knew I was going senile!!! Any further thoughts Phoenix? How are you getting on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacoheki Posted March 12, 2007 Author Share Posted March 12, 2007 slight improvement, have tried all the suggestions from everyone and they all seem to be working. You guys have no idea how much I appreciate your help. :D I will keep you all informed on how we go over the next few weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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