angelsun

I used to be in Nonsporting when I lived in Canada, and the lot of us called it "the forgotten group"....we often joked about it though pretending to be show secretaries...."Well there...all the groups sorted out and timed...oh wait....Non Sporting!!! uhm....well....shove it in at the end...no one will care and we won't have to listen to the poodle people bitch that they didn't have enough time to put up a topknot!" And yes, I got sick and tired of the damn group being the last one on as well!

That's not entirely true. Yes you can enter, but you will not have the opportunity to be rewarded for your efforts at the breed level with CC's, hence my statement that those that for whatever reason can not/will not attend, they are penalized.

And you have that right to make that decision, what is subject of discussion is simply that the right to choose what show to attend is removed with this rule. Those that do not attend, are not attempting to state that those that do, are incorrect for doing so, unlike the reverse implication. Like so many issues within the dog ownership world, the right to choose is what is the issue here I think. As I have mentioned prior in this thread. I do not say that there shouldn't be a milage blackout, only a smaller and more reasonable figure used compared to the 1000km one currently in place. As we have seen by numbers/mileage between major centres, many are affected by this figure. Contrary to what many beleive, we do not all live in major centres and as such, all the shows that dot the land between these areas are also affected. It's 3 hours for me to drive to Melbourne, 4.5 hours to Canberra and about 7 hours to Sydney which places me about in the middle of the black out zone for most eastern areas if they had a specialty that applied to me or mine. This is a huge area, and encompasses many many smaller shows that are well within a reasonable day trip drive. As continues to be mentioned, but no one has really been able to answer this: for those areas that do NOT have a show every weekend (and as mentioned in NT that there is one per month on average, which equates to about a dozen for the year) To lose one set of possible points, is in fact a big deal and should not be dismissed simply because a large amount of posters, have a chance to do these dozen shows in less than four months, meaning they have the option of three times the shows per year. Sure, missing one weekend when you have that many to pick from, ISN'T a big deal, but perhaps some could try for a moment to put themselves in others shoes where either infrequency of shows or the simple costs of great distances mean its unrealistic to attend. Toss in that the judge might simply be a moron when it comes to your breed (and yes, that happens that the judge in question hasn't a clue about the breed he/she's been asked to officiate over because of things such as who happened to be on the judge selection committee or who owes who a favour) It's unfortunate that there are some that simply can not see both sides to this debate and consider the one they don't agree with, is simply wrong. I'm attending a specialty on the weekend. It's not a National and we have three 'pinschers' to accomodate for our club. It's in Melbourne and a three hour drive....now ignore that this is a state club that is hosting....if this same show was in Sydney, I doubt very much I would be attending....why? It's not because I don't want to support the club, it's simply because we have eight dogs at home, one vehicle and it's over 7 hours drive. For me to attend economically, would mean going on my own and not kenneling dogs however that leaves dogs here, a husband and no car.....I have to be realistic and the money tree out back didn't survive the drought.

Those that are stating "one weekend a year" isn't a big deal, from what I'm seeing on locations, generally live in areas where they can pick and choose shows at ease. Those that are against national CC restriction on a national weekend, live in areas where the number of shows is FAR less and as such one weekend IS a big deal. (not all, but many from what I"m seeing) I agree totally about peoples decisions to attend a national because of a judge for example. There are a few out there that I wouldn't cross the street to be judged under, why would I sink my years holiday fund into driving many kms and showing to them simply because it's a National? I also agree that the restriction on CC's will not increase the entry at a show. Based on past numbers of different breed national specialties, we've seen this to be true. (when the restriction was only state wide versus 1000km rule) What about those that choose for whatever reason, to not belong to their breed club and as such will not participate in events sanctioned by them? There are many reasons for this, only a few including internal politics within the club, people unable to be members because someone within the club doesn't like them (or their partner), Disagreement with some or any of the policies sanctioned by the breed club (in the case where it can contradict the breed standard) I can go on and on, and all of these things have occured to people I know and all fairly recently. Why support a show, run by a club that you don't agree with on whatever level? We preach that by not entering under a judge, it's the only way to send that judge a message (lack of entry) if you feel they are not doing their job properly, and yet we are guilted into feeling that because we call a show a National specialty show, we MUST enter or we don't care about our breed! This is most definately not the case for a majority of people. What about the person living on the fringes of the restriction, with a litter of pups? They can't be expected to drive 12 hours to the show, but have to give up the show twenty minutes down the road. It's not that they don't support their club, or the show, but reality kicks in and it is, what it is! I think it's very short sighted to assume that because some people choose to not enter a National Specialty, they are chastised or worse, ostrasized for not doing so. As well, in my opinion, it is very short sighted to assume that everyone has access to the amount and variety of shows in my particular region (which there are many, within 3 hour drive if I chose to go) when in fact, many do not have this choice, and as such a national ban of CC's during the weekend of a Specialty could clearly cause someone to be less competative overall when it's all done and hung to dry. I should add that we need to consider the all breed shows and what they can lose, in a time where entries are declining due to petrol prices and the economy in general. A club won't go broke because my one German Pinscher didn't attend, but when you see an entry of say 35 cavaliers for two days, that adds up....what if there was also a Golden Retriever show? Suddenly a club (in my area) could see a drop of 60 entries..... As mentioned as well, why would someone in Darwin be penalized for not going to a National in Melbourne? I"m not sure I would appreciate my breed club, or the ANKC for that matter, attempting to hold my show plans hostage, which is what this is, in my opinion.

I can't vote as the option I would choose would be a smaller radius of blackout from the show. Possibly half (500km)

I"m looking for a lady named Eleanor who has Cavaliers and makes show braided leads.I think she lives down in Gippsland or that area, but not totally sure on that. I have a phone number but I think it's wrong and I need to get in touch with her.

German Pinscher Junior in Group (got run for group! yippee!!!) There was a GSD for both Minor in Group and Junior in Group. (not ours) Baby puppy in show was a cute furball otherwise known as a Pomeranian!

You are using water as an excuse, Oh sorry Island. We all know Islands are surrounded by water. What's hard about driving to the Ferry, loading your car, going upstairs walking around having dinner, Maybe sleeping in a cabin or chair or watching a movie, Then getting off and driving? The boat goes over twice a day. I have been to Tassie on the boat, It was an easy experience - I do get sea sick thou! Yes i stressed about the dogs, but you would be it on the plane as well. I don't see how it's any different to hey lets say, me driving from Vic to QLDwhich is approx 1797km and approx 20hours of driving, plus 3 nights accommodation. In fact getting on the boat is easier!! It's cheaper for me in Melb to get to Tassie via the boat then it is to drive to WA or QLD. You went only once? On a calm day/night crossing...it is a lovely trip....try it when the seas are not so gentle or mechanical difficulties turns the 9 hour trip into 16 or more. Or for a real thrill....give Newfoundland a go in the winter. I did that run 2-4 times per year, why?...because I was paid to handle other peoples dogs so my costs were covered....it's hard on the dogs, hard on the humans and I often wondered what the hell I was doing when I booked my reservation. The 8 hour crossing (10 in winter) the 12 hour (roughly) drive across and the 6 hour drive to home, makes for a long time, however the weird part is, as the crow flies, it's about 700kms. I made the mistake of taking the longer sail, which was a shorter drive upon arrival and at 16-18 hours on the boat, with 5 minute potty breaks available (if you ask the steward nicely) for all dogs, to walk and pee on the deck, can't tell me that's easy on the beasties. I had six dogs that crossing.....thankfully two other people and we turbo walked six dogs on the decks....not fun at all. Yes I"m glad I live on the mainland now.....

Try $185 for a car, $75 per person and any camper or trailer up to 26 feet is $55 and each additional 2 feet is an extra $20, and this is one way with no accomodations (going to Newfoundland) You want a reclining seat? Add $50 and a dorm sleeper is $35 per person....cabin is $150 (remember, one way) Yes $42.50 isn't too bad, but try it every weekend....the year I travelled forty weekends for shows.....it's not cheap. We on the mainland take it for granted that we only need a tank of fuel to get to a show often and can be home in our own beds at night.

Living on an island IS difficult. Having lived on one for almost thirty years in Canada, and seeing the ferry service leave and replaced by a bridge (13km long) it was an improvement however wasn't any cheaper. We had only three weekends of dog shows on the Island. For us to be competative, we simply had to leave every weekend we could and at the cost of $42.50 per car load and camper trailers extra. Many that were on the mainland, used to tell us "Islanders" that they would pick ONE of the Island shows because 'it's too expensive to do them'. We left the Island every week....we budgeted for that, but it doesn't mean we liked it, nor was it fair. The bridge was basically the 'TransCanada Highway' and as such, is free for travel by anyone....except for that 13 kilometers of water by boat and then by bridge. We carpooled when we could, because it was the only way we could afford the extra costs to feed our dog show addiction. Those of us that lived on the Island, did it the hard way.....the mainlanders who didn't really get it, had no idea and kept on bitching that going to the Island is too costly. There were some however that did the three sets of shows per year on the Island...and no others.....there are also many on the other Canadian Island of Newfoundland that although had twice as many show weekends as us PEI'ers had, never left their 'rock' either. It's simply too costly with a 890 km drive from the major city to the ferry, and then an 8 hour sail followed by on average, another 4 hours driving to Halifax. And yet, if the same rule for distance was used, specific breed people would lose an opportunity for attaining points at shows in their backyard. They would, if they needed points, be forced to spend hundreds and hundreds of dollars to get to the specialty or go beyond the limit to a show that didn't have this restriction applied. Most don't.

We take our gazebo down and lift the mat every evening just to avoid both weather and vandels. It's not that much of bother really to pop ours up as it's one of the little compact ones and we don't always put sides on, although they don't take more than a few moments to set up either. we will leave the tarp down for the next day however.

I agree...as soon as done mating is best as thing. Sounds like the owner will be more stressed than the bitch though.

oh come on now.....your dog can't be a total dork more than some of the ones I've seen come through either my classes or actual trials.....(including my own current challenge!) And yes, I have had some dogs barely able to sit, and pull their handlers through the entire course....they (handlers) learned in spite of their challenge!

Your dog will be fine. any dog that has basic heeling (so you aren't pulling and he's not lunging and being a total dork the entire time) as well as sits and drops (not always needed but nice to know how to perform) are able to enjoy this seminar. Remember, we encourage differently in this, so even dogs with lessthan the basics will still learn and not leave on a negative note.

Manchester Terrier and English toy Terrier have great drive and excel in agility and flyball. German Pinschers (a big bigger) are also very versatile and have great drives. all have low grooming requirements but do shed.

We give daily here so may not be the same, but it's simply not worth risking missing.

We also are against the 1000 mile reach as we feel it is far too much. People are either going to participate in their breed nationals or not....regardless of if it's across the street or 999 miles away as the crow flies. It USED to be confined to the state lines, now that 1000 number extends from Melbourne half way to the south pole, and I totally agree that the show should have listed this information, and easy to say they didn't know....are all the state bodies not connected in some manner to the ANKC?? Lack of communication is not an excuse for someone to enter, feeling they were going for points, only to find out they were not eligible and would not receive a refund because someone failed to put all the information in the right spot. Albury Kennel Club's weekend (four hundred km's away from the Nationals) probably lost about $500 or so for the weekend of shows because of the lack of shep entries by those of us that routinely attend these shows.) We do not attend specialties as we do not agree with the style of dogs shown, nor the manner in which they are exhibited. that is our right, but we should not be penalized because we do not want to attend the circus called a GSD specialty. (flame away, but we are not the only ones that feel this way) In fact, a lovely lady attended on the first day to simply sit and watch. She showed dogs extensively a number of years ago, and was anxious to see what she thought would be the cream of the crop. She was disapointed to see young pups with roach backs, toes pointing the wrong way and hocks rubbing, only to hear the judge comment that the dog winning the particular class would be an asset to the breed and anyone not using this dog in their breeding program would be making a mistake. She also was stunned to see not only the dress code (bikini's?) but the extensive double handling that took place. She wondered if this was now the norm for dog shows and GSD's in particular. It was her first National specialty event she witnessed, and she stayed only half the day or so, and stated it would be her last. We strongly feel and have discussed this with a number of local clubs, that it is them that need to lobby their state body and hence the ANKC to have the mileage shortened to a reasonable distance. It is easy for those with shows on their doorstep to say that one weekend without points is not a big deal, however when you must travel no less than a couple hours one way for the closest of shows and there are not shows even within four-six hours drive for many of us rural inhabitants, missing a chance to finish titling a dog because of a show just under a thousand miles away, is in fact not fair. *please note that the above reflects my opinion, to which I am entitled to express, and although I'm sure there will be a few that flame or attempt to because of my thoughts, it should be noted that you have a right to attend and support any show you wish and have a right to disagree with my statements, however it doesn't have to turn into the bunfight that mostly happens when the topic turns to German Shepherds, and although we are in the minority of those that choose to not participate, we are not the only ones out there, and we are not 'wrong' to think this way.* (end of rant)

Well being this particular bitch who wants to do what SHE wants....she decided to whelp April 30th. In three hours, we ended up with four girls and a brother. One is coming here, another going to Spain and the brother is earmarked for a lovely family that have been waiting for four years for one of my pups! Am looking forward to my 'aussie' born litter. (not confirmed)

Without getting into details of your contract, unless you can show that the breeder transported the bitch against written permission there isn't much you can report. The bottom line is that you have a bitch on breeders terms. That bitch was sent somewhere to whelp and have tails docked. This sort of thing isn't new or exciting although I wouldn't do it, it's done all the time and without stress or harm to the bitch and/or litter. The bitch will be coming back to you when she is done her motherly duties. You probably have no claim to pups as this was a breeder term litter, but even if you did, if the pup is healthy and fine, there are no drama's. Even if worse case, the bitch became ill, the breeder is responsible for her care, although the future of a litter will in most cases not take precident over the welfare of the bitch, but as you have no claim to the litter, it really wouldn't have mattered anyway. The bitch did not become ill, she whelped a litter which you have no claim towards as a breeder term litter, you will get the bitch back when she is done. I still do not see any possible breach, simply with the breeder choosing to whelp the litter somewhere other than their own loungeroom or study. As there has been no fatalities, it really doesn't matter where she whelped, or even that tails were done which if prior to the date mentioned, would have been legal. I think you need to discuss your concerns with your breeder as to what you feel may have been in breach before you go off attempting to create a mountain out of a mole hill.

Me too...the only Pinscher....(so what else is new!)

I got quotes from companies here and in Canada for this new one...the Canadian company with exactly the same routing came in almost $450 less.

Uh oh....another tail dock debate!

My new import (from a litter I bred over in Canada) will cost about $5000 all up including quarantine to get to me. The only gripe I have is that she will be almost a year by the time she arrives due to mis information on shots/blood work etc. Nothing I can do about that though and time is getting closer to when she comes, so it's all good! (I don't think I could afford to purchase the dog and THEN pay to get it here.....this import and the next one that isn't born yet, are pups out of my breeding program and hence, no $$ other than paying for the shots, titres and any other testing needing done prior to shipment.)

Am looking for someone I can get this from via mail order. Picked some up in Sydney last November at Spring Fair but haven't seen it about since in my area. Figured I'd just see if anyone knew of a website that I could order it from?

I didn't hear any yelping....did I miss the mass torture session?